Why so many rules books? - I cant cope.

[nats]

I guess I know that the reason you are releasing so many books is because you have the publishing rights for a limited time - but I have to disagree with the basic philosophy at work here in terms of the amount fo information you are providing, especially rules.

I find that the sheer amount of new rules information available here is absolutely impossible for a single referee to comprehend. I strongly believe in the original classic books where the rules were kept to a minimum of five small rules books and you could instantly remember everythng you needed to play the game from memory most of the time.

In the Mongoose publications we already have 8 rules books but not just that, most of the other Supplements have rules variations and additions in them. Its just getting rediculous! I like a lot of people was sucked onto buying new Traveller books, but I have found myself going back to the original classic Traveller lately purely for the simplicity.

The thing that started turning me off Mongoose was the Central Supply Catalogue. In there you have loads of minute rules a covering fletchettes, armour piercing bullets, slugs - just to touch on one small area of the info. And theres loads of other minute rules stuff in there! On the surface the whole book looks great as there is a gun for every occasion possible, but in practice its just complete overwhelming!

This fascination with loads of rules is just getting to be information overload, and lately I have just given up on Mongoose becuase of this.

What I really want out of any new Traveller development is simplicity - a character book, a starship book, a combat book, a planet book - these are all we need. Sure release Supplements that provide adventures or quick lists for use by referees, or ship deckplans, or starport layouts or whatever, but please - LESS RULES! All this Mongoose stuff is getting to be completely unfathonable.

 

[Sylvre Phire]

To be honest, you're making an asteroid out of a pebble. If you want to play basic, general Traveller all you really need are two books - the rulebook and a setting book. The various profession books are meant to provide depth for GMs looking to run focused campaigns, such as Navy, mercenary, law enforcement, etc. Sure, they're great for variety too, but if you find it to be too much, just ignore them.

Use what you like. You're not obligated to use any of the other books beyond the rulebook. There's no contract written in blood, no squad of armored Mongooses coming to knock down your door and force you to buy the latest supplements. Just use what you feel is necessary.

Pax et bonum,

Dale

 

[nats]

To be honest, you're making an asteroid out of a pebble. If you want to play basic, general Traveller all you really need are two books - the rulebook and a setting book. The various profession books are meant to provide depth for GMs looking to run focused campaigns, such as Navy, mercenary, law enforcement, etc. Sure, they're great for variety too, but if you find it to be too much, just ignore them.

Use what you like. You're not obligated to use any of the other books beyond the rulebook. There's no contract written in blood, no squad of armored Mongooses coming to knock down your door and force you to buy the latest supplements. Just use what you feel is necessary.

Pax et bonum,

Dale

Well that is true to an extent but liking Traveller, I dont want to miss out on any expansion of the rules and the basic core book is very basic. Considering its size it actually provides less information than the five basic traveller books IMO. So you have to look elsewhere for the rules. And of course you feel you want to get the Supply Book because it has loads of euqipment in it but does it all have to come with expansions to the rules? Why is there fletchette etc rules in the Supply Cataloue for example and yet there also is also combat rules in the core book and also in Mercenary?

I just feel that with a little bit of thought the books could be more cohesive. At the moment its like - oh yeah lets add some new weapons and we had better cover how to play those in this book becuase they havent been covered in the basic rules. Its just all over the place. Its getting to be impossible to comprehend.

Anyway Ive had it with Mongoose I just dont think you need all this variation. I am going back to the Classic Traveller books. I will wait to see what T5 has in store instead.

 

[kristof65]

To be honest, you're making an asteroid out of a pebble. If you want to play basic, general Traveller all you really need are two books - the rulebook and a setting book.

Actually, you don't even really need a setting book.

nats does make one good point though - I hate when new books come out (for any game system) that have special or overriding rules to cover specific pieces of equipment, certain situations, etc that deviate away from the core rules. But all editions of Traveller have been guilty of that, too, not just MGT

 

[AndrewW]

I strongly believe in the original classic books where the rules were kept to a minimum of five small rules books and you could instantly remember everythng you needed to play the game from memory most of the time.

Classic Traveller had Book 0 - Book 8, that's more then 5. While not all might be needed for play, there's still stuff in multiple books that can be useful during play. And the same can be said for the Mongoose Traveller books, the extra material can be used during play but you aren't forced to.

But you can just ignore anything beyond what you need.

 

[apoc527]

Why do people post on forums just to complain and state that they won't be buying any more of products? Do we care?

No.

And besides, tastes vary. CSC and its complexity was actually what brought me back to MGT. Prior to that book, i felt the game was too simplistic. So I LIKE the gradual expansion of the rules!

 

[Treebore]

My experience with Mongoose is no different than it was back when Classic first came out, just my sources for rules complexity are collected into books, rather than a variety of magazine articles and other sources.

Like back then, use what you like, ignore what makes it over loading.

 

[nats]

My experience with Mongoose is no different than it was back when Classic first came out, just my sources for rules complexity are collected into books, rather than a variety of magazine articles and other sources.

Like back then, use what you like, ignore what makes it over loading.

Ah well you see I never got any of those magazines - I stuck with the Classic Traveller books and played most of my Traveller with only books 1 to 5 on their own. Although I owned most of the Supplements and Adventures I hardly ever used them. There was something magical about the first five books, cant explain it. The rest of the stuff that was released in magazines and journals just diluted the experience and in the end Traveller disappeared up its own backside. Same will happen with Mongoose Traveller. Just because someone releases new stuff doesnt mean you have to use it. Some people will like rules complexity but its certainly not for me.

All I have been looking for is an updated version of the five classic Traveller books (I say five because I never played with Merchant Prince or Scout) that incorporate some of the better rules expansion that was done later on (such as the missiles rules). I dont need anything more than that. Perhaps Traveller 6 ....

I sold all my Classic Traveller Supplements and now I just have the reprints plus my original classic black book set. Its all I need. And I will be selling my Mongoose stuff soon...

 

[Sevya]

Ah well you see I never got any of those magazines - I stuck with the Classic Traveller books and played most of my Traveller with only books 1 to 5 on their own. Although I owned most of the Supplements and Adventures I hardly ever used them. There was something magical about the first five books, cant explain it. The rest of the stuff that was released in magazines and journals just diluted the experience and in the end Traveller disappeared up its own backside. Same will happen with Mongoose Traveller. Just because someone releases new stuff doesnt mean you have to use it. Some people will like rules complexity but its certainly not for me.

So, you did, and are doing, with Classic Traveller what has been suggested you do with MGT. You played with the Core Rules, Mercenary and High Guard, and ignored the rest.

I sold all my Classic Traveller Supplements and now I just have the reprints plus my original classic black book set. Its all I need. And I will be selling my Mongoose stuff soon...

Fine. Play what you want. It's your game.

Sevya[/i]

 

[hdan]

You're right nats, the CT 1-5 books were sort of magical. Merc&High Guard for me were mostly "ways to kill time when my friends weren't around" books though, and 1-3 were the meat of the game.

I think the MGT Core Rules compare favorably to the old "Traveller Book" (books 1-3 and two adventures). I still have my Traveller Book, and recently re-read it. It's surprising how many things I thought were in that book were actually from Mercenary or High Guard. Apples to Apples, MGT gives you quite a lot of cool things, like all the extra careers, deck plans and more detailed character generation.

I do wish they had included something like "Shadows" or some other simple adventure to help newbies out, but the MGT Core Rules are a good update to The Traveller Book, and all you really need to have fun.

One thing I can say against the MGT Trav books is that they are much higher production value, and therefore more expensive than the old CT stuff was.

I don't know if MGT LBBs will bring back the sort of "low rent" feel of CT or not. In a way, that kind of bare-bones publishing colored the character of the OTU. Everything was done with these really stuffy Vilani-style Record Sheets and hexadecimal Universal Profile Codes, which really let the Imperial culture seep into the gamer at a visceral level.

 

[dreamingbadger]

Ah well you see I never got any of those magazines - I stuck with the Classic Traveller books and played most of my Traveller with only books 1 to 5 on their own.

... what is making you feel you have to buy the other books in the first place ? if you want the feel of the original 3 books, just stick with the Core Rule Book; if you want the feel of the first 5 buy High Guard and Merc? and not the others... if you want to stick with the original books do that too... it's your choice.

:roll:

 

[SnowDog]

The funny things with all of this is that if Mongoose decided not to publish any new rules, just adventures what would happen?

Some people would cry out that the line is dead and abandon it in favor of ... something else.

Personally I am not that hard core that I would be buying only adventures. I would buy an occasional adventure and I am pretty sure that concentrating on adventures would hurt the coffers of Mongoose.

Classic Traveller was a rules set that supported only OTU setting. MGT is used as a game engine for many settings (Babylon 5, Judge Dredd, Strontium Dog, Hammer's Slammers) and such a varied settings need specific rules to tune the basic engine to better perform in the specific environment (setting).

 

[Stainless]

Traveller grognards being what they are, it would be nice if someone would compile a Traveller Rules Codex so one coul keep track of the various rules from the books and S&P. Perhaps a wiki....

 

[Treebore]

Well, what is the LBB line Mongoose is soon starting? Isn't it a reprint, essentially, of the classic books? Maybe updated a bit?

 

[Sylvre Phire]

Well, what is the LBB line Mongoose is soon starting? Isn't it a reprint, essentially, of the classic books? Maybe updated a bit?

No, actually they're pocket sized editions of the Mongoose books.

@Sylvre Phire
You absolutely sure that there is no such thing as a canon police? I remember a few games of T2K where we deviated from canon and suddenly somebody started firing maneuver ammo at us...

There's no official canon police, only the self-proclaimed rank and file over on that dilapidated, lonely looking little space station over there. I can just barely make out the worn lettering on the side... C... O... Dang it, the scanner's getting jammed again... Anyway, don't get too close. They'll use you for target practice over there...

Dale

 

[artteach]

Anyone complaining about the large amount of published Traveller rulebooks has never played and edition of DnD. They always start with 3 books and within 5 years DnD will have 30 books of rules! Personally, I very happy they created the DnD Insider with a program that updates when new classes, equipment, rules come up. I bought the first 3 books and since I just use the online tools and have access to everything else.

It's to bad Mongoose does not developed a Mongoose Insider. A would pay a yearly fee for an online character, ship, world, sector generation tools that updates as new rules are added. It would be a good way to generate income for the company and provide a nice database of information for the players.

 

[DeadMike]

Personally I love the new books. Gives me interesting things to read that are full of options for a game I play. Not rules, options. Not sure what books you have Nats, I have most of them. If you have Supplements 3,5,6 and 7 and want to cut me a deal (being poor sucks) I will take them off of your hands.

 

[mrfingle]

To be honest I have WAY more CT LBBs that I am ever likely to have MTG books (over the short term at least). Mongoose (in my opinion) have always published rules with a number of additional suppliments and, let's face it, CT was exactly the same.

 

[Sturn]

There's no official canon police, only the self-proclaimed rank and file over on that dilapidated, lonely looking little space station over there. I can just barely make out the worn lettering on the side... C... O... Dang it, the scanner's getting jammed again... Anyway, don't get too close. They'll use you for target practice over there...

Dale

To qualify my statements, I'm a fan of all versions of Traveller and my current project is a MGT one.

Why must Traveller fans continue to do this? My forum can beat up your forum? My version of Traveller can beat up your version of Traveller? :roll:

Did some stats on the last 24 hours within the MGT Traveller forums vs. CotI:

MGT 63 posts in 18 threads. 2 Users currently online.
CotI 43 posts in 17 threads. 23 Users currently online.

Throwing names such as "dilapidated" and "lonely" isn't exactly factual unless the same title applies to our forums here also?

 

[Treebore]

There's no official canon police, only the self-proclaimed rank and file over on that dilapidated, lonely looking little space station over there. I can just barely make out the worn lettering on the side... C... O... Dang it, the scanner's getting jammed again... Anyway, don't get too close. They'll use you for target practice over there...

Dale

To qualify my statements, I'm a fan of all versions of Traveller and my current project is a MGT one.

Why must Traveller fans continue to do this? My forum can beat up your forum? My version of Traveller can beat up your version of Traveller? :roll:

Did some stats on the last 24 hours within the MGT Traveller forums vs. CotI:

MGT 63 posts in 18 threads. 2 Users currently online.
CotI 43 posts in 17 threads. 23 Users currently online.

Throwing names such as "dilapidated" and "lonely" isn't exactly factual unless the same title applies to our forums here also?

I tried hanging out over there a few years ago, unless the core posters over there have changed, I still won't hang out over there. I was so turned off by the experience I feel no desire to try unless I get told they are much better now.

One thing I like about Mongoose is there is no true "core" any longer with TRaveller, there are so many options, so many settings, there is no true "Core" set of rules or ways to play Traveller anymore. Which I am sure has the old Traveller "police" foaming, and it makes me smile. Mostly because Traveller has always been a game of wide open options to me, so never understood this demand to follow the books, the histories, etc... down to using the right number of moons for a given planet. Totally anti fun in my view.