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Anonymous
Guest
Does anyone have any suggestions for creating Power Point Costs for D&D Spells that you might want to use in a Conan d20 game?
BhilJhoanz
Mongoose
First, I'd strongly urge you not to cross spells over from D&D unless the spell fits into the spirit of the Conan Setting.
Second, there's a lot more to consider than just PP cost. Prereqs are equally important since spells don't have "levels" Some spells might be very difficult to learn but the PP cost might be small. Secondly, you need to consider how a D&D spell might upset the game balance. Fireball would surely turn an encampment of nomads into an encampment of burning husks -- there are other, more subtle distinctions as well.
Because of these factors, there shouldn't be a guideline for converting spells from D&D other than experience and playtesting. Use your own best judgement but warn your players that spells could get revoked or changed at any time. If a converted spell (or any spell IMO) is a scholar's first (or only) choice in most situations -- it's likely overpowered and needs to be adjusted.
If you're looking for more spell options though, look to Scrolls of Skelos -- due out very soon!
Second, there's a lot more to consider than just PP cost. Prereqs are equally important since spells don't have "levels" Some spells might be very difficult to learn but the PP cost might be small. Secondly, you need to consider how a D&D spell might upset the game balance. Fireball would surely turn an encampment of nomads into an encampment of burning husks -- there are other, more subtle distinctions as well.
Because of these factors, there shouldn't be a guideline for converting spells from D&D other than experience and playtesting. Use your own best judgement but warn your players that spells could get revoked or changed at any time. If a converted spell (or any spell IMO) is a scholar's first (or only) choice in most situations -- it's likely overpowered and needs to be adjusted.
If you're looking for more spell options though, look to Scrolls of Skelos -- due out very soon!
A
Anonymous
Guest
I understand full well about D&D spells and the tone of a Sword & Sorcery game. I appreciate the warnings and admonitions, but I don't find them very suitable to the question posed.
I think there are (or should be) some guidelines for the Power Point pricing of spells somewhere. How did Ian and Co. come up with them otherwise? Pull numbers out of a hat?
I think there definitely is a starting point that was used for pricing these spells. Having worked on some games in the past, I think it's rather silly to propose that the pricing is all due to playtesting and experience. This game wasn't in production for *that* long. That would also mean that the upcoming Book of Skelos would need to be already written AND in playtest for the next two years to playtest, modify, and re-playtest (ad infinitum) all the spells that are supposed to be included therein. There has to be some framework that they're working from, otherwise the scale would be completely arbitrary as they certainly don't have the time or resources to be playtesting every single spell in every single circumstance that could come up.
I understand all the considerations that need to go into this upfront. Judging from the threads that are already popping up about playing D&D with Conan rules, however, I don't think my line of questioning is all that out of whack. I'd like to see if anyone's worked up guidelines on the PP pricing of spells and how that pricing might relate to spells that can be found in D&D, CoCd20 and elsewhere. If you think it's a bad idea, that's fine.
But my question wasn't about whether this was a bad idea or not, it was about how to *do* it.
I think there are (or should be) some guidelines for the Power Point pricing of spells somewhere. How did Ian and Co. come up with them otherwise? Pull numbers out of a hat?
I think there definitely is a starting point that was used for pricing these spells. Having worked on some games in the past, I think it's rather silly to propose that the pricing is all due to playtesting and experience. This game wasn't in production for *that* long. That would also mean that the upcoming Book of Skelos would need to be already written AND in playtest for the next two years to playtest, modify, and re-playtest (ad infinitum) all the spells that are supposed to be included therein. There has to be some framework that they're working from, otherwise the scale would be completely arbitrary as they certainly don't have the time or resources to be playtesting every single spell in every single circumstance that could come up.
I understand all the considerations that need to go into this upfront. Judging from the threads that are already popping up about playing D&D with Conan rules, however, I don't think my line of questioning is all that out of whack. I'd like to see if anyone's worked up guidelines on the PP pricing of spells and how that pricing might relate to spells that can be found in D&D, CoCd20 and elsewhere. If you think it's a bad idea, that's fine.
But my question wasn't about whether this was a bad idea or not, it was about how to *do* it.
I must admit that, while I don't necessarily care about D&D spells in Conan, some of the ones in CoC I think would be very cool - Death by Flames immediately jumps to mind.
While there are major differences in how D&D spells and CoC spells work, CoC spells have been given a level in an appendix so if we can work out how to do one, we can potentially work out how to do another.
Having said that, I don't really have any idea on where to start - there are two many variables for me to get my head around. Maybe I'll have some thoughts this weekend.
While there are major differences in how D&D spells and CoC spells work, CoC spells have been given a level in an appendix so if we can work out how to do one, we can potentially work out how to do another.
Having said that, I don't really have any idea on where to start - there are two many variables for me to get my head around. Maybe I'll have some thoughts this weekend.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Cool. Thanks, Phil. I've been going over it myself. On other forums, some people have suggested using the Sanity cost for CoC spells to represent spell costs. Through further reading it seems to me that the spells are priced on a 1, 2, 4, 8, 10, and 20 PP range. I'm not sure about the ability drain cost. Perhaps that could be re-worked into the spells as needing a focus, or special (and costly) materials, etc. etc.
While I agree that spells like Magic Missile or Tenser's Floating Disk might not make the cut, it's hard, IMO, to deny that other spells such as Ghoul Touch, Spider Climb, Change Self and Vampiric Touch are definitely worth mining. A while back, in an attempt to do a CoC fantasy campaign I created Sanity/Attribute costs for relevant D&D spells (that weren't already re-purposed into CoC). I think you'll find that a significant number of the spells in CoCd20 are an exact reprint of D&D spells with a new name stamped on top. This made it easier to price out other relevant D&D spells.
I'm looking into this as well. Based on all the "playing D&D with Conan rule thread" I had thought that others would've been farther along on this than I was. I was wrong. Apparently, this is new ground, not only in pricing out the relevant D&D spells but also in codifying how Conan spells are priced in the system. Maybe they really are flying by the seats of their pants...
While I agree that spells like Magic Missile or Tenser's Floating Disk might not make the cut, it's hard, IMO, to deny that other spells such as Ghoul Touch, Spider Climb, Change Self and Vampiric Touch are definitely worth mining. A while back, in an attempt to do a CoC fantasy campaign I created Sanity/Attribute costs for relevant D&D spells (that weren't already re-purposed into CoC). I think you'll find that a significant number of the spells in CoCd20 are an exact reprint of D&D spells with a new name stamped on top. This made it easier to price out other relevant D&D spells.
I'm looking into this as well. Based on all the "playing D&D with Conan rule thread" I had thought that others would've been farther along on this than I was. I was wrong. Apparently, this is new ground, not only in pricing out the relevant D&D spells but also in codifying how Conan spells are priced in the system. Maybe they really are flying by the seats of their pants...
