Thanks

[rust]

As to perfect ? Not sure if that is "an achievable goal that allows the potential of a well defined success experience within specified parameters" as marketing would say.

Yep, and since different people tend to have very much different expecta-
tions and wishes, no roleplaying game will ever be able to satisfy all the
players.
For example, on another forum someone complained that the Surveyor
from High Guard and Scout is a waste of space - and for my setting it is
the perfect solution to one of the problems.

 

[captainjack23]

As to perfect ? Not sure if that is "an achievable goal that allows the potential of a well defined success experience within specified parameters" as marketing would say.

Yep, and since different people tend to have very much different expecta-
tions and wishes, no roleplaying game will ever be able to satisfy all the
players.
For example, on another forum someone complained that the Surveyor
from High Guard and Scout is a waste of space - and for my setting it is
the perfect solution to one of the problems.

really ? I hadn't noticed.

(Please add smileys until the above is seen as a joke......)

 

[rust]

Well, I tried hard, but I could not resist ... :lol:

 

[captainjack23]

Well, I tried hard, but I could not resist ... :lol:

Pods are eight tenths of one percent a waste of space, seems to be the final conclusion.

Smarty pants. (is there a good version of that in German ? Just in case....)

 

[EDG]

Pods are eight tenths of one percent a waste of space, seems to be the final conclusion.

0.8%?!! *grabs reader and shakes by the shoulders* CAN'T YOU SEE ELSE THEY COULD HAVE PUT IN THAT SPACE?!

It amazes me how much so-called "fans" are willing to complain about things. It's even more ridiculous when they preface a three page rant about something which is really irrelevant in the grand scale of things with "oh, I have nothing against MGT but...". And all because it goes against their fossilised vision of the OTU. :roll:

 

[captainjack23]

It amazes me how much so-called "fans" are willing to complain about things. It's even more ridiculous when they preface a three page rant about something which is really irrelevant in the grand scale of things with "oh, I have nothing against MGT but...". And all because it goes against their fossilised vision of the OTU. :roll:

Actually, not much like that; the point was that there was tons of neat stuff in Scout, and that Mongoose could/should have used the space to do more new and different stuff. The Pod was tagged as wasted space because the poster(s) felt it was redundant. Mainly. Then the argument was about if and why it was redundant.

Actually, if it was categorized politically, it would be Impatient-revisionist rather than Fossilized -reactionary... Vs. the dialectically correct moderate revolutionaries, obviously.

 

[EDG]

Actually, not much like that; the point was that there was tons of neat stuff in Scout, and that Mongoose could/should have used the space to do more new and different stuff. The Pod was tagged as wasted space because the poster(s) felt it was redundant. Mainly. Then the argument was about if and why it was redundant.

It was still a pointless argument. Why argue so intensely over whether one thinks something is redundant or not? It's there whether anyone likes it or not, and it's not going anywhere. Is it so much of an affront that he can't just ignore it?

Whatever. It's on another board. Let them keep their negativity over there, we don't need it here.

 

[Kilgs]

All that said, I'm MUCH more interested in Mongoose Traveller as it's here, now. There's stuff coming out for it from Mongoose and Avenger. This is where it's happening here and now... so this is what I'm interested in discussing.

And maybe expanding Gateway with...?

Please.

 

[MJD]

Gateway 993 is an issue that's not quite resolved. When I reclaimed my manuscripts from QLI, I wanted to publish them but was told that gateway domain was the *exclusive* (yes, with asterisks!) preserve of QLI. This was from QLI. Marc never confirmed it when I asked, though he did tell me to go along with what QLI wanted me to do in order to publish.

That was clearly unacceptable, since it involved paying QLI to publish manuscripts that I'd reclaimed from them because they weren't going to pay me for them.

Now, I have been categotically told by Marc that Gateway 1248would be OK for us to publish under our then existing license, so maybe it's just the 993 Gateway background that's *exclusive* - and maybe even that isn't legally so, given the new Mongoose deal.


But the upshot of this is that while I would like to expand Gateway Domain, I was blocked from doing so with Avenger. QLI could do it, but I won't ever be working with them again so any new gateway products will have to be written by someone else. Whether you think QLi might ever produce more products is open to your own speculation.

All I can offer is that I really don't think the Gateway setting will be supported any more. I'd like to but I can't.

 

[dmccoy1693]

Just curious, but can you publish it under the Fair Use License. Agreed, you don't get paid for it, but you're not getting paid for it while its just sitting around collecting dust.

 

[MJD]

Not sure if I could. When I asked Marc to verify the QLI assertion that Gateway 993 was *exclusive* or not, I got no definite answer but a vague suggestion that I should get a sublicense from QLI.

The legality therefore remains unresolved.

But in any case, that was professional work, ie I did nothing else to pay my mortgage while I was working on it. Putting it out for free means giving up any hope of ever making a return on that work. I'm not willing to do that.

 

[Sangrolu]

All I can offer is that I really don't think the Gateway setting will be supported any more. I'd like to but I can't.

I'd pretty much come to that conclusion. Which is sad, because Gateway has become my home in the OTU. I just finished Homecoming for my group using Mongoose Traveller, and they loved it!

 

[EDG]

Out of curiosity, what happens when QLI's license sunsets? Would that mean that Gateway is not "out of bounds" for publication anymore?

 

[BP]

...That was clearly unacceptable, since it involved paying QLI to publish manuscripts that I'd reclaimed from them because they weren't going to pay me for them.

Curious - didn't pay for them, but they still own the rights?

That's pathetic (and technically probably not legally valid depending on the state - not that it is worth pursuing) - though not unbelievable. Seems that if they returned the manuscripts then they would have relinquished ownership (in writing) so you could pursue with the original license holder - would have been the decent thing to do.

Sounds like problems exceeded fiscal responsibility and broached the ethical - here's hoping that things work out to your advantage in the long run.

 

[atpollard]

...That was clearly unacceptable, since it involved paying QLI to publish manuscripts that I'd reclaimed from them because they weren't going to pay me for them.

Curious - didn't pay for them, but they still own the rights?

MJD owns the rights to the actual written text.

QLI may own the exclusive rights to publish in that sector (like only Mongoose can publish in the Spinward Marches).

 

[EDG]

I think Martin was saying that he wasn't allowed to publish any of his reclaimed Gateway material because Marc had declared that only QLI were allowed to publish material set in that area. So Martin owned the manuscripts again... but couldn't publish them because the area that they were set in was the exclusive territory of the company he'd just wrested it from (and who hasn't even published anything else set in that territory since then anyway).

Let's think about that for a sec. There's publishable material there that presumably could directly make the licensor some money from royalties from sales, and it doesn't get published because he tells the licensee to get a sub-license from the people who left the licensee hanging for so long that he gave up and reclaimed the manuscripts from them in the first place.

Of course Martin's not going to do that - nobody would. So everyone loses - Martin can't publish his hard work and make a return on his valuable time and effort, Marc doesn't get anything from the sales, and the fans don't see the work at all. It's lose-lose-lose all around, just seems completely crazy from a business point of view.

 

[EDG]

(like only Mongoose can publish in the Spinward Marches).

I thought only Mongoose could commercially publish anywhere in the OTU. Though I wonder how that interacts with this "exclusivity" that QLI has over Gateway. Is Mongoose excluded from Gateway too? Who trumps who?

 

[Dave Chase]

The impression that I have is that Mongoose will be able to publish what they want AFTER the other licenses have expired.

Most licensors ususally either continue a license product with a new licensee right at the point of the change of hands or they wait 2 to 3 years for material (products) to be sold/destoryed and then allow the new licensee to start up the additional products.

Seeing how Marc has operated in the past, I would say more toward the later than the former.

Also, it depends on much Marc is planning on puting into the T5 license versus the Mongoose license.

Officially no one knows what T5 is going to be: either a seperate Traveller license/version OR Big all inclusive Traveller version that helps build Mongoose stuff up more. (Officially as of last week, since I no longer have T5 access due to CotI politics.)

Dave Chase

 

[BP]

I think Martin was saying that he wasn't allowed to publish any of his reclaimed Gateway material because Marc had declared that only QLI were allowed to publish material set in that area. ...

.... Is Mongoose excluded from Gateway too? ...

Thanks for clarifying - thought it was something like that - and also thought Mongoose would have license to Gateway OTU - so, in effect it is QLI that is the holdup for him and Marc would not want to get too involved in such complications (of course, I know nothing about the setting, so I am being a bit presumptuous here).

Like you said - lose, lose for everyone. In my experience - that is typical business when it comes to legal aspects.

At least Martin has the experience of doing the work - that no one can take from him - and the community at least indirectly benefits. Hopefully, he gets a paid day from it in other ways.

 

[EDG]

At least Martin has the experience of doing the work - that no one can take from him - and the community at least indirectly benefits. Hopefully, he gets a paid day from it in other ways.

Y'know, I think Martin deserves some thanks on this thread too - thanks for sticking it out through all the stupid politics and getting where he is today, producing Traveller stuff for Mongoose and Avenger, and getting the long-overdue recognition and praise he deserves.

Thanks, Martin!