Tactic vs longlance torps.

[Lord David the Denied]

A little common sense is called for. I think that you would roll to hit. You would reroll your misses for twin linked, as you're not done firing until you have determined all of your hits. Thats what the shooting player does. The defending player would then force you to reroll all of the hits because he is evading as his part of the sequence. Pretty simple, logical and common sense approach.

Like I said, then?

 

[Bob Hume]

"Like I said, then? "

yep! :lol:

 

[Lord David the Denied]

I love it when people think I'm right... 8)

 

[Court Jester]

I would just like to point out that although it may seem 'logical' the rules do not support it, likewise they do not support rolling twin-linked second.

I am all for Evasive being an annoyance even with TL but it needs to be rules because as it stands neither takes precidence.

 

[Lord David the Denied]

The rules as written may not be completely clear, but if you read it with common sense and simple logic in mind, you'll find the suggestion put forward here to be the only reasonable explanation for the proper resoultion of this situation.

 

[Court Jester]

you'll find the suggestion put forward here to be the only reasonable explanation for the proper resoultion of this situation.

I'm gonna have to diasagree with this. What we have are two simultanious effects. They are effecting the outcome of your roll to hit. As soon as you have rolled the dice both these rules are triggered. You are assuming there is some unwritten delay in the effects of Evasive.

But this will just go round in circles as there is no clear answer, and one thing I have learnt about games rules is that they are never logical and never follow common sense.

So I will agree to disagree.

Also here's hoping someone comes in and puts Evasive in its rightful place (after Twin-Linked).

 

[Bob Hume]

I asked the question about twin linked and evasive on the rulemasters board. So, we should get an official ruling soon. I still believe that Lord David and I have the way of it. 8)

 

[Court Jester]

I still believe that Lord David and I have the way of it. 8)

Oh I am sure you have. As I said I would welcome Evasive besting Twin Linked. It doesn't stop the rules being ambiguos in places though...

 

[voodoomachine]

You know, I find it funny that the arguement is only between whether twin-linked and evasive are simultanous (as i believe) or twin-linked happening first, then evasive happening.

Why shouldn't evasive happen first, then twin-linked?

So you would roll to hit, re-roll all your hits, then re-roll all your misses, including the ones that missed due to evasive.

That seems just as fair. Why should the defender get to basically nullify twin-linked?

 

[Poi]

I love circular arguments.

 

[Der Kommandant]

just add this to the list of all the other unanswered questions.

 

[Bob Hume]

I just posted this on the rules forum a little while ago. Lets give em a chance to answer it , eh. It's late on that side of the puddle.

 

[Court Jester]

I love circular arguments.

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

 

[Bob Hume]

Still no answer on the rules forum.

 

[E Nicely]

usually you can't re-roll a re-roll....

Chern

Right. There is an absolute limit to rerolling. One reroll per attack, you never get to reroll an attack twice.

 

[Bob Hume]

Oh hey, glad to see ya. Right I understand that you can't reroll a reroll, but this case in unique. It has conflicting rules. In one case, twin linked allows the shooter to reroll his miss's. But, evading allows the target to force a reroll of the hits. For example the shooter rolls his dice to hit, then he rerolls those he missed because he is twin linked. The evading target does not force him to do another reroll of those missed shots, which would be a reroll of the reroll. He has already determined how many hits he's done. By wildly jinking (read evading), he's forcing a roll to cause some of those hits to go off target. Thats my contention anyway. If you rules guys see that as a reroll of a reroll then answer this question. Which reroll takes precedence, twin linked or evading?

 

[E Nicely]

Sorry I misread your Q. In the case of TL vs. Evading there would be multiple rerolls. First you reroll the misses for your TL weapon. Gives you X hits. The Evasion causes those X hits to be rerolled giving you Y hits and you've more or less negated the TL. The attacker isn't rerolling the attack in his favor so the Evasion reroll isn't a reroll per se. It's the long way around for negating TL and vs. a standard attack roll the Evasion decreases the chances of hitting below normal. A very useful SA (I should use it more :wink: ). You can't lose the effects of the Evasion due to a TL weapon.

I see the point of confusion, if there was a Concentrate All Firepower SA (which there isn't-we're talking WWII here), that would negate a Twin Linked weapon's advantage (one reroll on attack) but it would still be subject to the Evasion.

 

[Bob Hume]

Thank you sir, for the answer.

 

[captainsmirk]

Personally in this case I would just say they cancel each other out but that's just me...


Nick

 

[Bob Hume]

Lord David, you and I were correct.

captsmirk I see your point about cancelling each other out but say I'm shooting at you and my first roll is two hits, my reroll gives me one more. But when I roll those hits again because of your evading they all come up miss's. Thats good for you. If we did it as they cancel each other out, you would have still taken two hits from my first roll vs none doing it the correct way. Doing it the right way is only adding one more die roll and a few seconds to the game and it might save the loss of a ship or even a game.