Slaine Monster PDF solutions?

blue crane

Mongoose
Hi there!

I was just wondering whether or not it would be possible for Mongoose to look into producing PDF files for monsters and the like (at a price of course!).

I was thinking about the following...

What about providing a ten-page PDF enhancement / supplement every two months at a nominal fee (say, $2-3).

The PDF file would cover, for argument's sake, between five and ten creatures/monsters, fully statted out with nominal illustrations. The borders used for the Slaine RPG could be re-used to add a little colour.

Over a year, 60+ pages of support would be forthcomming and would provide Mongoose with between $12 and $18 of revenue! (Not much, but for the work involved, not too bad either!) Furthermore, sales of the PDF files could be used as interest indices and so gauge medium-term response to this intellectual property.

At the same time, I believe that Slaine fans would at least get their hands on additional information and be moderately satisfied.

I believe something like this would be possible and could indeed be easily covered in the time frame made available (namely, two months). This would give those of us who are interested in the Slaine RPG some much-needed gaming support. Also, writers over at Mongoose would not be committed to writing 64 - 130 page sourcebooks (saving both time and money), which may or may not meet expected company sales figures; this I believe is a compromise that may satisfy both sides overall.

I suppose the same could be done for other areas of interest: El Worlds, Time Travel, et cetera.

It was just a thought....

Regards,
Blue Crane
 
Nice idea, but you have to pay the writers for their work! Sixty pages would cost mongoose - what - £600? They would have to make three times that amount to even consider PDFs; even so, £600 profit is not worth getting out of bed for, especially if you're making a wad of cash from B5...
 
In principle, the idea is a good one - downloadable PDFs and e-books are a very easy, low-cost solution for providing material. There are a couple of caveats which need to be provided.

1. Piracy is a problem. Without some kind of licensing key (and the associated administration), it means your product can be ripped off and distributed. It's wrong folks, but it happens.

:oops:

2. Profit, as lawbabe has indicated, is another reason. Producing PDF material means relatively low costs. Given that the profit to be recouped has to be considered (MP being a business and all) - they need to think of how to make this model work.

However, that doesn't mean that the current picture is the future...

:twisted:

Now I've hit the cons, it would be uncharitable not to list the benefits.

1. Distribution costs are driven way way down. Once you create the PDF, it's done. Post it on the site and bingo, you're done. No rending of hair with distributors, no angst over the printer costs. Job as they say, is a good 'un but the FLGS won't respect you in the morning...

2. Fan support is also a compelling argument in favour. One of Slaine's big problems as I see it is the lack of material referenced in the main book, references to the Drune book, the Fomorians book, Dinas Emrys. All there - however, it has been a little while and Slaine is sleeping. Time for a wake-up call?

So, how to get PDFs which might drum up some interest?

Samples of material are always a possibility of course, the Slaine website has laid fallow for a little while (unsubtle hint - insult sheet?).

:idea: You could reprint some of the material that's been published in other areas (Signs & Portents articles?) then you could have your cake and eat it?
You could even include web exclusives - a hitherto unknown treasure? Errata for a few errors in the book?

All of which, can be done. Just depends on what you want to do, no?
 
satyre said:
1. Piracy is a problem. Without some kind of licensing key (and the associated administration), it means your product can be ripped off and distributed. It's wrong folks, but it happens.
If you can find one roleplaying book thats not available as a pirated PDF i would be supprised. By releasing work already as a PDF your only saving the pirate 10 mins of scanning.

Piracy really is not the issue agaist selling PDFs some people make it out to be.
 
Sure scanning will happen anyway! Yes, someone can scan something in but it doesn't take quite as long to copy a file if it's in electronic format already. Method isn't important, what matters is that it is happening!

Piracy is an issue is when your revenue comes primarily from providing information and in business, scarcity implies value. Since the cost of distributing and printing is the biggest cost in game manufacture, you'd think e-publishing would be an obvious solution.

However... the real world currently says otherwise.

I would be pleasantly surprised if the number of legitimate electronic copies outnumbered the number of pirate copies. Voluntary donations might work but unless you're willing to pay for it, a business will not provide. While you've got pioneers like svgames.com who are making money while the pirates and their friends and leeches use bootleg copies, not everyone has a copy of the book in question.

Personally I think the best antidote to piracy is to create something that is so good that a prospective customer would buy it anyway! Optimistic but if your product is that damn good, it will happen. The alternative is to adopt a Darwinian model where companies have ideas which get ripped off and then vanish. The only people who prosper then are the lawyers.

:(
 
you have to take a risk sometime.. sitting back and not doing anything will only let the line collapse..

hell, you could do what sword and sorcery does... take contributions from fans... ask them to write up creature and stuff and submit them...

as for the piracy thing...if i have a PDF, or i have a book, its the same thing... i could print off the PDF and give it to as friend, or i could sell the book to someone else... letting me make a profit

its quite simple, why not trust your fan base?... put out one PDF online, say 5 bucks... then see what happens.. people are either going to wantg the info, and will get it one way or another, or are not going to buy it..

its that damn simple... putting it out in hard cover, or soft cover, means that sure, they have to scan it in, or xerox the whole thing for a friend...... piracy exists because of fear
 
I think you've hit the nail on the head, trust is key!

I know people who have managed to get PDF versions and they usually 'peruse' through them to decide whether they want to part with hard earned cash for the hardcopy of the version. After all you don't want to buy a £25+ book and then find that it's c*&p.

Personally I'm lucky in that my local gaming shop owner lets me have a read of new systems and in some cases I borrow from friends to have a look, but not everyone is in that position.

After all gaming is no longer a 'cheap' hobby just look at the prices of the more popular RPG systems and tell me a 14 year old can afford that sort of money!

IMHO not many people have portables to load up with their system PDF rules to take to a game, a nice idea but not very practicable in a gaming environment, I'd expect the port' would be in the way.
 
as there is no planned releases for slaine in print :( how about a PDF of monsters,lore etc which mongoose never got round too putting into print. 8)
 
the PDF market for RPGs is really taking off. It's no where close to what print does, but it's really improved opver the past year.

Piracy is a problem, but it does seem that the people who would spend money for it, will buy it anyway. As one PDF publisher does, he puts adds and his website in every PDF knowing that with piracy it will be seen by thousands of more people then who normally look at buying pdfs.But piracy is also a problem with print books. It's not hard to find almost any RPG book for download.

The money side doesn't seem to be great, but there are a few companies that are doing well. Mongoose has a good name in the d20 market, and Slaine has a fanbase. Both of those should help for some sales.

The PDF market is still young and many people are slowly figureing it out.
 
lawbabe said:
Nice idea, but you have to pay the writers for their work! Sixty pages would cost mongoose - what - £600? They would have to make three times that amount to even consider PDFs; even so, £600 profit is not worth getting out of bed for, especially if you're making a wad of cash from B5...

Is that all, a tenner a page... not much at all :cry:
 
just do what other companies are doing... have fans write the stuff... give the the information they need, and cut them in one some of the profit..lol
 
prophet118 said:
just do what other companies are doing... have fans write the stuff... give the the information they need, and cut them in one some of the profit..lol

now that would be a great idea 8)
 
Driftwood publishing has been doing that with "The Riddle Of Steel"... they dont have as much stuff out as someone like mongoose does... but at least by letting fans write stuff (with direction of course)... it lets the company really know if there is or isnt fan support
 
also, Sword and Sorcery Studios has been taken submissions for their books for a while..lol

alot of it for things like Scarred Lands... or even for their monster books... granted this wasnt PDF stuff... but it does happen... somer companies actualkly let the players have a say in what they will do with their game
 
Hi guys,

I'll tell you what we will do. . .

If some of you chaps want to email me (msprange@mongoosepublishing.com) some Slaine monsters - making sure they are spellchecked, researched and edited, of course - we'll get some art together and do a PDF. We can return free PDF copies to contributors but, I warn you, there will be next to no profits on such a project after the licence costs :)

However, if this is something you chaps want to have a crack at, we'll do our best to help.
 
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