Question on Ambush
- Thread starter Itkovian
- Start date
Iain McGhee
Mongoose
I'd still think that Interceptors could be used. If the fleet was in a war zone they'd probably be on at least a low alert level with their weapons and defences online. As for Dodging I'd say they could as although the ships don't get to act on the first turn this does not mean they aren't in motion, just that they are surprised.
It's not Pearl Harbour
It's not Pearl Harbour
That matches what I remember. While I'm pretty sure that doesn't apply to aux craft, I'm not 100% sure...
I seem to remember that it was ruled that the fleet being ambushed don't count as moving in the first turn, which pretty much means firey death for White Stars, though this doesn't make sense to me as they're not exactly gonna be holding station while they duck out to take a leak or hitting the drive-thru
Methos5000
Mongoose
I think the dodge rule was updated in Armageddon. I dont have the book infront of me but it says if the ship doesnt move, or cant move, it cant dodge. Now im pretty sure it states that it is ships, so aux craft should still be able to dodge, I mean even if your fleet is caught by surprise I find it hard to believe that the pilots wouldnt be able to react .
shadowbloodmoon
Mongoose
Just thought I'd quote the part from Armageddon for ya since I happen to have it right here:
This would seem to indicate that it is ships only based on the rules that say it would have mentioned aux craft if it meant aux craft however, the first phrase:
This seems to count fighters as ships for the purpose of the Dodge trait. Poor guys...
This would seem to indicate that it is ships only based on the rules that say it would have mentioned aux craft if it meant aux craft however, the first phrase:
This seems to count fighters as ships for the purpose of the Dodge trait. Poor guys...
Yep looked it up last night and that is the conclusion we came to.
Of course for all that it resulted in about 2 dead fighters as there were far more important things to shoot at!
And I am now of the opinion that the Dilgar need either a) a better fighter or b) more fighters per wing, as at the moment they have one of the worst in terms of vfm, yes I know it has a dd,tl weapon, but only one die and as pretty any halfway decent fighter will take it out in one go it'll hardly ever get to fire!
Of course for all that it resulted in about 2 dead fighters as there were far more important things to shoot at!
And I am now of the opinion that the Dilgar need either a) a better fighter or b) more fighters per wing, as at the moment they have one of the worst in terms of vfm, yes I know it has a dd,tl weapon, but only one die and as pretty any halfway decent fighter will take it out in one go it'll hardly ever get to fire!
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
As the defender, can a ship with fighters start with those fighters launched?
lastbesthope
Mongoose
prelude_to_war said:
From looking at the rules, yes within the usual restrictions of how many fighters can be launched at the start of a game.
LBH
Greg Smith
Mongoose
IN 2e, the rules for ambush say traits still apply. Whether you consider that should apply to the existing rules is up to you.
Well the Dilgars initial opponenets were the league, who have only one fighter with a dogfight score of greater than 0. So it kind of fits historically. That isn't going to help you when you fight the Minbari, I know, but then a lot of races will struggle against their fighters (only the Centauri, Minbari, ISA and EA have dogfighters). But the Thoruns do have two significabt advantages - they are the fastest fighter in the game and they have the fighter pentacon.
Well the Dilgars initial opponenets were the league, who have only one fighter with a dogfight score of greater than 0. So it kind of fits historically. That isn't going to help you when you fight the Minbari, I know, but then a lot of races will struggle against their fighters (only the Centauri, Minbari, ISA and EA have dogfighters). But the Thoruns do have two significabt advantages - they are the fastest fighter in the game and they have the fighter pentacon.
we play that whitestars/raiders etc cannot dodge as they havent moved. last campaign i was in my opponents always seemed to get ambush on my ISA too. good thing is you get to roll scenary. as ISA hope for low CQ asteroid fields and make sure you bring any CQ6 whitestars along and set them up in the fields.
Admiral Phlop
Mongoose
As the scenario is set that one force is moving through an area that is set for ambush, wouldn't one assume that both forces are moving and that the ambusher is just getting the first attack then you roll for initiative on the second turn. If it was looked at this way both forces should be considered moving which would let the ambushed be able to use the dodge trait. Just a thought.
victor romeo
Mongoose
If the defender counts as stationery then can you use Mass drivers against them? a Primus on CAF will spell burny death on anything with that!
victor romeo said:
LULz, I personally don't think that a ship stops moving just because nobody else is there unless, they are hiding to start a ambush of there own, if nothing else they got momentum going, then again that could work into being a excuse for being stationary, as motion is relative in space, then again, there motion is relative too.
prelude_to_war
Mongoose
As the attacker, all you really have to do is destroy two of the defender's ships and jump out/ get off the board, right? This is assuming the attacker suffers no ship losses - at least this is what I understand after calculating VPs.
In a patrol level scenario (of which I have one coming up, which is why I resurrected this thread):
Attacker
Destroying 2 ships of the same level (patrol in this case) would yield 10x2 VPs = 20.
Defender
Gains 1/4 of the ships total in VPs for attacking ships that leave the table, rounding up. I'll probably have something like a Patrol and Skirmish ship as the attacker for my 3 points. This would total 8 after rounding...
Gains 5VP for holding ground for a total of 13...so destroying two patrol level ships and leaving with no losses would grant me victory?
Incidentally, the defender list would consist of 4 Hermes w/Furies and a wing of T-bolts, while I'd come in with something like a pak Sunhawk and an Ikorta...
In a patrol level scenario (of which I have one coming up, which is why I resurrected this thread):
Attacker
Destroying 2 ships of the same level (patrol in this case) would yield 10x2 VPs = 20.
Defender
Gains 1/4 of the ships total in VPs for attacking ships that leave the table, rounding up. I'll probably have something like a Patrol and Skirmish ship as the attacker for my 3 points. This would total 8 after rounding...
Gains 5VP for holding ground for a total of 13...so destroying two patrol level ships and leaving with no losses would grant me victory?
Incidentally, the defender list would consist of 4 Hermes w/Furies and a wing of T-bolts, while I'd come in with something like a pak Sunhawk and an Ikorta...
CZuschlag
Mongoose
Itkovian:
You can, given what you see, almost certainly use Mass Drivers. This revelation led to a while where the concept of the scenario was banned. We calculated that the Dilgar could likely kill out 60-80% of any enemy fleet in the turn zero volley without much question. The Rohric, Wahant, and the Khatrik were often the center of such calculations.
Broken.
And yes, thread zombies are out to kill us all!
You can, given what you see, almost certainly use Mass Drivers. This revelation led to a while where the concept of the scenario was banned. We calculated that the Dilgar could likely kill out 60-80% of any enemy fleet in the turn zero volley without much question. The Rohric, Wahant, and the Khatrik were often the center of such calculations.
Broken.
And yes, thread zombies are out to kill us all!
Locutus9956
Mongoose
Yes you can. Word of advice. Dont get ambushed by Dilgar. EVER.
