Pocket Player's Guide

FailedSpotCheck said:
What it all boils down to is the solidity of the ruleset. If the product is all glitz and glamour, a glossy, technicolour, orgiastic riot of graphics but a badly conceived and ill-tested system, then all the window-dressing in the world is not going to save it.

I like a little sprinkling of graphics in my RPG books, and the LBB's were deficient, IMHO, when it came to the non-textual aspect of those releases, but the rules were elegant in their simplicity and have stood the test of time.

I like the portability of PDFs, but DESPISE the exorbitant prices of the digital format. In many cases the PDFs are nearly as expensive as the HC. :evil: :x If the HC is full-colour it would be very nice if the industry as a whole also provided B/W companion PDF's for us blokes who do not want to spend 35 pounds or 70-some odd dollars on printer ink cartridges.

A number of publishers are tying the two together (eg: Mouseguard RPG - pre-order, and you get the PDF now, and the book in january, or Burning Empires, Buy the book at IPR and get the PDF for free), or are making the PDF really inexpensive (Wiked Dead Brewing Co... $40 book, $5 PDF).

Really, I think the PDFs for mongoose stuff are too expensive; usually more than 50% cover, and seldom print well.
 
AKAramis said:
Really, I think the PDFs for mongoose stuff are too expensive; usually more than 50% cover, and seldom print well.

I have spent a lot of time pondering this entire issue.

In general I like small limited subject books, which the CT books were perfect. Price is another issue I have with many of the current gaming products, I frequently walk out of game store without purchasing anything, as $30+ is still too much for some random book that I might never use. That was never a problem with the digest sized books, or at least the Traveller ones.

Though a pdf of character generation and related info is useful, and I can build campaign specific players books.

Equipment catalogs are the odd ducks. I am old enough to remember and have run entire games using only 3x5 index cards. I kinda like to have equipment on their own cards as it helps limit what the characters are carrying. Nothing brightens my day than seeing a play realize that they have just emptied their last magazine, as they toss in their last magazine card.
 
I'm already purchasing a couple of the pocket LBBS in addition to the regular sized book.
I love the pocket sized versions of Mongoose's books and I've purchased a few that I wasn't interested in in the past just because of the small size. (I ended up wowed by them too which is also a reason why I love the pocket sized books...they just scream "impulse buy" to me!) :D
If they rerelease the entire line as pocket sized books I'd buy them all again!
There is also the nostalgia factor here too. I own TONS of the original LBBS and I only had single copies of the larger format books from later editions.
 
I'm planning on getting roughly six of the little buggers. 1. I do massive amounts of Traveller now, for the Convention Team I work with. 2. My non convention players are to cheap to buy a book, using some silly excuse as they have to spend money on food or some such. The pocket guides are nice because I can pack a lot of them and they generate a sort of Cool Factor that resonates with the players.

PDF's though, I have no use for, because I refuse to get another 3K LAPTOP stolen at a convention (Not to mention all the issues with Power and such things conventions have heart attacks over), can't stand reading a computer screen during the game, and I'm not saving any money if I print the stupid thing anyway (Rex still misses the days when double sided printing was easy).

Based on peoples logic, (and a not inconsiderable knowledge of the industry), I agree, the PDF's are to expensive by far. Still there is the geek factor to consider.

I'll stick, with actual books though.

~Rex
 
I've found PDFs are good for cutting and pasting info into notes and stuff, but for management during a game I'd prefer to have everything organized into one source, either a database or combined into one set of documents (all skill info in one place, etc.)

Unfortunately, it's too expensive to have both the printed and PDF versions, and it can non-cost effective to print-and-bind the PDF.
 
Hence why we should ditch all PDF's, All hardbacks, and go to a D ring Binder LBB format, optional vertical or horizontal D-Ring set up.

Most of my Mongoose Product ends up with me drilling holes in what used to be a book and making binders out of them anyway.

Traveller Rolodex.

~Rex
 
Me, I love PDFs. Especially when they're a lot cheaper than buying an actual book - PDFs that are close to the hardcopy in price are overpriced IMO. I ain't paying more than 50% of the hardcopy price for a PDF (at most) - why should I when there's no manufacturer's print costs to cover? There aren't there any significant distributor costs either, and the publisher is directly making a lot more money per sale for a PDF than they would for a hardcopy that's sold via an FLGS.
 
EDG said:
Me, I love PDFs. Especially when they're a lot cheaper than buying an actual book - PDFs that are close to the hardcopy in price are overpriced IMO. I ain't paying more than 50% of the hardcopy price for a PDF (at most) - why should I when there's no manufacturer's print costs to cover? There aren't there any significant distributor costs either, and the publisher is directly making a lot more money per sale for a PDF than they would for a hardcopy that's sold via an FLGS.

Right so when they are making so much more money per PDF sold, why bother lowering the price?

One of the other many reasons I despise PDF's. There is no comparable value, no finding it sitting in a box and going, "Damn I forgot I had this!" and all that book stuff.

PDF's......just Sterile. I prefer my Computer Games on Disc's, My Table Top Games in Books.

Besides reading a computer screen just makes your eyes bleed out in the end.



~Rex
 
PDFs do give licence to the owner to print them as they see fit though - including nice flashy hardcovers should you wish. You do have to pay extra though of course, but I'm just happy with the variety of formats being available so gamers can choose their own preferences.
 
Rex said:
Right so when they are making so much more money per PDF sold, why bother lowering the price?

A publisher releasing a PDF on their own website could charge a lot less for the PDFs than for hardcopies distrubuted and sold through an FLGS, and make the same direct profit per sale on both. I'm OK with them charging a little more than that base cost for the PDF given the added convenience of a download, and to make a bit more money directly... but I'm not OK with a PDF that costs about the same as the hardcopy book.

I'm pulling all the numbers out of my ass here, but this is just a general demonstration of how I understand it working... let's say that a publisher sells the books to distributors for 33% of the final cover price, and then the distributors sell the books to the gaming stores for 66% of the final cover price. Again, these percentages are entirely mythical, I don't know how much the distributors and retailers cuts really are, but this is just to show the principle of what I'm talking about.

Let's take a book whose final retail cost through the FLGS is $24. The publisher would sell that to distributors for $8 per copy. The distributors would sell that to retailers for $16 per copy. So per sale, the publisher gets only $8 out of the $24 final price - and out of that they have to pay the printers, artists, writers, layout people etc.

Now let's take out the distributor and retailer from the equation, and just have the publisher sell directly to the public as a PDF. Now they don't have to pay any printing or shipping costs (OK, there's server and software costs, but let's assume for now that those are minimal). Also, they can charge more for the book and all of that will go directly to them, not to distributors or retailers. So the publishers could now directly charge customers $16 - or even $24 - for the PDF, and ALL of that (barring server fees etc) would go into their coffers to pay the people who produced the book. Personally I'd rather they charged closer to the $16 price rather than the full $24, because I know for a fact that they're not paying for physical printers or for people to ship the books to or from their warehouses.

Yet again, these aren't accurate numbers, it's just to illustrate the general principle of what is going on (as far as I understand it). And obviously places like DTRPG act as distributors and do take a cut of the money (so if the publisher skips DTRPG and sells the PDFs direct to the customer from their own websites, they can make even more money per sale).

Of course, the publishers say that they want people to buy books from the FLGS and not from them directly, but personally, I think that's self-defeating and misuguided. I personally don't care about supporting a retailer, I care about supporting a publisher - if the retailer goes down then the publisher is still there and I can still get the products I want from them directly, but if the publisher dies from lack of support then I won't be able to get any more of the products I want at all, so obviously I'm going to want the publisher to get as much of my money as possible.

That's not to say I don't by RPG books at all, because I do - largely because I don't have a laptop to take to games that I could put the PDFs on, or because the book just isn't available electronically at all. But often when I can't be arsed to go down to the FLGS, or just want to grab a book quickly, or just want something to read, I'll go straight for the PDF option.



One of the other many reasons I despise PDF's. There is no comparable value, no finding it sitting in a box and going, "Damn I forgot I had this!" and all that book stuff.

I've had the same feeling going through folders on my computer and going "wtf is this PDF? I forgot I downloaded that!".
 
EDG: I've gotten roughly the same percentages out of hunter, and my FLGS's ordering clerk.

I'd consider 25% cover to be fair; WDBC's 11% is rather nice.

Rex: not everyone is as hidebound as you; I read most of my game books (those that render well on a 5" diagonal ebook reader) on my Sony PRS 505, and don't print out anything other than CGen and intro to tasks. I seldom game at home.

I ran my entire BTVS game, except for CGen, with no paper other than character sheets and maps. For CGen, I printed out the cheat sheets into 5.5x8.5 booklets. 3 of them, total 6 sheets. Books on laptop. Great way to run.

When it comes out, I'm getting an 11" diagonal dedicated ebook reader... the e-ink is like reading paper in terms of visibility, and I can get 50 hours of display time on a charge on my 5". (I read 1800 pages of novels without recharge... the entire vorKosigan series. PDF's not so much, about 1000 pages on a charge, due to more processor time to render than the dedicated text only formats of novels.)

I also have more than a dozen game SYSTEMS on my sony PRS-505... and it weighs about half a pound.

pretty soon, if it isn't available electronically, I won't be buying.
 
I just got into this post
I like the idea of the digest editions
(lugging a ton of books to a game sucks :evil: ) but
my only problem is that I would like to have all my books in the same format but I couldnt afford to rebuy all my A4 books in digest size

I do think its a great idea though
guess, as people say, its all down to how well the pocket edition sells 8)
 
Back
Top