Playing Mainstream: My 11 Kai in FR

Hey all, I play in a game, once weekly, and recently, I got the opportunity to swap out my 11 ranger for a new character. I chose the Kai Lord, being a huge fan of Dever (i have all the 28 game books, the 12 legends books, the magnamund companion, grey star, the black baron and scarlet sorcerer books, freeway warrior, etc)

So I rolled up an 11 Kai Lord, and was allowed to take feats. And I am here to tell you, that I am two things: sick and wrong.

My Discipline Choices:
5 Weaponskill, Hunting, Sixth Sense, Tracking, Mind over Matter, Mindshield, Healing
4 Mindblast
3 Camoflague
2 Animal Kinship

1 Weaponsmastery (see my Strike as One post for why I took this first)
12 Huntsmastery (For low light vision...we use it alot)
13 Nexus
14 Divinination
15 Pathsmanship

Observed Craziness:
Tracking: Skill Level 23. Its very difficult for me to miss a tracking roll. When I get pathmanship tier 2 at level 16, I will have a 28 in tracking, and be able to make that DC 30 check on a 2 or better.

Mindblast: the stun ability is not capped on how much willpower you can throw into it. I can throw out a DC 30 stun at the beginning of a combat, at a target. The next action, I move to them. The one after that (they are stunned for a minimum 2 rounds) they get my full attack action. See my Strike as One post for why this will hurt.

Sixth Sense: Glancing Blow - with no need to make any roll to make this ability work, its pretty darn nuts. I built my Kai around Dex (I'm the party sneaker). I have a +6 dex modifier (19 dex, gloves of dex +4), so five times a day, I can take minimum damage.

AR: 25. 10 + 6 (Dex) + 4 (Leather + 2) + 1 (Sixth Sense) + 1 (Weaponskill), +2 (Improved Buckler Defense, Buckler +1), +1 (Amulet of Natural Armor) = 25. Respectable Indeed.
Touch Attack: 10 + 6 (Dex), +1 (Sixth Sense), +1 (Deflection) = 18
The Dream Armor for my Kai Lord is Celestial Chain Mail. It would add +4 more to armor bonus and allow up to +8 Dex. That would make my AR 32, by level 16. When Divinination hits Tier 5, add 2 more.
I get one Dex at 12, 16, and 20, and 1 Dex from the Circle of Solaris for a 23 total. If I get +6 gloves of Dex at any point it goes to 29. For a +9 bonus. Since the bonus occurs on evens, my lvl 20 point is going into Wisdom instead.

Saving Throws:
With Healing, Huntsmastery, and Mindshield you get a +5 to all saves. At level 11, before stats, it makes my saves +10. After stats they are Fort: 11, Reflex 16, Will 12, before equipment. Those, my friend, are nice saves.

If I get my hands on a Ring of Evasion, I'm all set.

Feats: Weapon Finess (short sword - I'm Dex focused), Two weapon fighting, improved two weapon fighting, improved buckler defense, Imporved critical: short shord.

The Kai Lord is more than balanced. I am an excellent scout and tracker. My psionic abilites give me reads on people, and are nasty in combat. While my chance to hit is low (14/9, 14/9), my defense and saves are great.

I love the class because there is so much to do. The abilities give me something for every situation.

Do I feel its unbalanced? Not now. But in later levels, yes. See my Strike as One post as to why.

While I feel that a Kai Lord blows any melee class away, our groups wizard is still by and far above everyone else. but that's d&d. magic rules and us sword swingers get by as best we can :)

Edited for math and spelling.
Well, when you add feats, it will become unbalancing. I played a kai in FR, and i made sure not to take feats (and to spread out the skill choices), but it wasn't too over-the-top.

But you start getting rings of evasion, feats, and all that good stuff, yeah, you will hog the limelight. The kai belong in magnumund.
Yes, I agree the Kai belong in Magnamund- all the classes are powerful enough without traditional feats. And they are designed for a world which is fairly low-magic, in terms of weird and wonderful items, unlike Forgotten realms.

Your high level magnamund character would often be lucky to have a superior (+2) broadsword and some Kagonite Chainmail, never mind all the stuff your getting...

It is a strange DM indeed who lets this kind of strength into their campaign, unless you're all power hungry munchkins...but if thats the case, go play Diablo 2 instead...roleplay is about having fun being someone else, not being an uber hax0r character...
It is a strange DM indeed who lets this kind of strength into their campaign, unless you're all power hungry munchkins...but if thats the case, go play Diablo 2 instead...roleplay is about having fun being someone else, not being an uber hax0r character...

I too agree that the character is overpowered ... but this in no way makes the GM strange or imply that they should be playing Diablo instead. Besides, for all we know, maybe the GM allows uber-tough characters because this is a strongly political campaign where the ability to cut down powerful foes with a single blow is not particularly relevant or helpful.

Roleplaying is about having fun playing the way you like to play. Your way need not be the Right Way (TM).
well, the friday game I play in tends to be a tough game indeed. Equipment wise, I spoke about dream items, not about things I have. Really, its a low to no loot campaign, so its best to play self-sufficient classes.

Power level wise, I disagree however. Standard monks, mages, and sorcerers are definitely more powerful, especially if the encounters are spread over many days, and recovery is available. Combine those classes with things like the Book of Exalted deeds, and you get some pretty rediculous results.

The standing policy at the game I am a player in is that anyone can bring any OGL book, and the DM does his best to make it work. The OGL is what has given D&D new legs, and they really embrace that.

My post was meant to give an example of a Kai Lord, medium level, in a mainstream game, as I noticed a few people asked me.

This criticism with what sort of game I play in and why is just silly. The game is what you make it. The guys I play with on friday really seem to enjoy encounters, which is their style. The game I run on sundays, and have for the last six years, is much different. but that's the beauty of the game.

It gets old hearing people tell other people how they should play. The whole point of table top RPG gaming is freedom...the participants define the experience. And, frankly, it seems to stink of superiority, as if someone is telling someone else that they play better, and others don't have it "right" which is just bunk. Its D&D - Every one that plays has it right.

I still think the character is more powerful than a typical 11th level character. His BAB and AC will be at or around the level of a fighter of the same level, his stealth and tracking abilities as good or better than a Ranger or Rogue, Psychic Attacks not available to other classes, all three saves very good, and his versatility is only going to increase.

While he may not be better than other classes at most things, the fact that he can do a wide range of things as well as many specialists means the character has the ability to hog the limelight in a range of situations. Given that D&D classes are about niche specialisation, this is ultimately what being unblanced is about, IMO.

All this may fit in perfectly well with the particular campaign in which the PC participates, but speaking from a position of default, vanilla D&D, I think it's safe to consider it at least somewhat unbalanced. The important point is that this discrepancy will only increase as the character continues to level.
His BAB (BCS in Lone Wolf) is equal to a cleric's or rogue's, with +1 for the right Lorecircle.
I personally use a D&D version of Lone Wolf which anyone can have, just by emailing me at
Of course, with something so magic-heavy as Faerun, you do need to be careful! :)