Planet Crackers

[alex_greene]

No, not the planet of the insane. Weapons that can crack open planets.

The theory is that capital ships' meson spinal mounts, especially for capital ships of the 100,000 dton+ range (i.e. dreadnoughts and battleships) can do this. But has anyone actually run a scenario when someone actually threatened to use one of these Xindi superweapons against a civilised world?

(And yes, the choice of terminology is deliberate).

And have you described one being fired, whether in space combat or on a planetary installation of some sort?

 

[rust]

And have you described one being fired, whether in space combat or on a planetary installation of some sort?

Well, we even have used old documentary material ... :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICP1-w593NE

 

[alex_greene]

"I only wanted a little off the top!" - Captain Archer, Enterprise, on watching the ship's new phase cannons render a huge crater in a little moon (Season 1)

"You're only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!" - Michael Caine, The Italian Job

 

[kafka]

Planet crackers would have to appear at least at TL20. These would be the refinement of antimatter missiles which only start to appear at TL16. Such a device should not even viewed lightly even as an Ancient artifact...this would be extremely rare. For it to survive...it would upset game balance. However, one could see it as a threat that the players could have to blow up in Empty Space sort of like Ogre in Space.

 

[EDG]

No, not the planet of the insane. Weapons that can crack open planets.

The theory is that capital ships' meson spinal mounts, especially for capital ships of the 100,000 dton+ range (i.e. dreadnoughts and battleships) can do this.

What "theory"? There's no way in hell that any kind of spinal weapon has enough energy to destroy a planet (sufficiently large AM bombs might, but you'd need billions of them to destroy an earthlike planets).

 

[GypsyComet]

Planets are big. REALLY big. The Traveller crowd tends to size things based on the ship design system, but really, the largest ship any version of Traveller has been written for is still only a couple city blocks in size. Even the monster orbital stations from GURPS Traveller Spaceport are tiny compared to a real city on the ground, and the smallest "planet" in Traveller terms (1000 miles diameter) is millions of times the volume of said station, constructed out of rock, and *really* good as an energy sink.

On such a scale, even the big planetary defense meson guns are little more than a bag of Pop Rocks. You remember Pop Rocks, right?

At higher TL, the advent of anti-matter provides a significant boost to the power of some weapons. With an anti-matter spinal PA you could, over a long period, strip atmosphere and carve your initials across the surface of a world. Its not going to be fast, though.

Cracking the planet with such a weapon would require pre-existing weak spots far worse than the garden-variety fault lines we see on Earth, and a large world would re-"weld" itself back together pretty quickly.

Look into the estimates of the amount of energy released in a normal earthquake. The mega-joules of Traveller weaponry will quickly pale in comparison.

 

[Infojunky]

Man with the title I was hoping for a discussion of a kids treat.

Planet Crackers => Animal Crackers...

But in the case of ordinance, Large Near-C rocks will do ya...

But, come on guys, this one have been done to death, I'm not saying that you can't discuss it, just that it is among the traditional flame-war topics.

 

[EDG]

But in the case of ordinance, Large Near-C rocks will do ya...

But, come on guys, this one have been done to death, I'm not saying that you can't discuss it, just that it is among the traditional flame-war topics.

Well, you're the one that mentioned near-c rocks...

 

[GypsyComet]

But, come on guys, this one have been done to death, I'm not saying that you can't discuss it, just that it is among the traditional flame-war topics.

Shrug.

If the game is being played as Science Fantasy (ala Star Wars, Lensmen, h2g2, Lexx), then the decision easily falls towards simple mad science. Blow up planets for the sake of politics, religion, or a better view in the evenings. Whatever.

If the game is being played with more than a nod to "hard" science (yes, we know how slippery that is in Traveller) then popping a planet is going to take a lot more effort. In such a case, the Death Star rolls into Alderaan, pops the defending ships casually, then sits in orbit hammering cities. No "one-shot kablooie" on the whole planet, but still scary and worth blowing up.

Pick your flavor and run with it.

 

[Infojunky]

But in the case of ordinance, Large Near-C rocks will do ya...

But, come on guys, this one have been done to death, I'm not saying that you can't discuss it, just that it is among the traditional flame-war topics.

Well, you're the one that mentioned near-c rocks...

Yes, yes, I did.... But I am stoned on Vicodin (near massive dental work yesterday), but that being said on the Gurpsnet list and the TML the numbers where trotted out about what it would take.

For me all it take to crack a planet is a funny little guy in a helmet with a lisp.

 

[qstor]

For me all it take to crack a planet is a funny little guy in a helmet with a lisp.

What about a guy in a misshapen helmet and sneakers?

"I'm going to blow it up. It obstructs my view of Venus."

Mike

 

[5h4ne]

What about kinetic ordnance. Massive rocks falling from space would be pretty intense - a lot more damage than a ship could muster.

Or there's the Darrian trigger thing.. some kind of crazy tech rather than a weapon.

 

[GypsyComet]

What about kinetic ordnance. Massive rocks falling from space would be pretty intense - a lot more damage than a ship could muster.

Or there's the Darrian trigger thing.. some kind of crazy tech rather than a weapon.

Rocks fall, everybody dies.

It takes a fairly small rock, as rocks go, to end all life on a world. It takes a much MUCH bigger rock to shatter the planet.

The Darrian Star Trigger works because its meant for balls of hot gas and plasma, not balls of rock. The amount of energy available just from the environment the Star Trigger is in is immense, and only has to create the stellar equivalent of a Tsunami, not blow the star completely to pieces.

 

[5h4ne]

Rocks fall, everybody dies.

It takes a fairly small rock, as rocks go, to end all life on a world.

Seems like a good result if you can't blow the planet up and your intention was to kill everyone

 

[GypsyComet]

Rocks fall, everybody dies.

It takes a fairly small rock, as rocks go, to end all life on a world.

Seems like a good result if you can't blow the planet up and your intention was to kill everyone

Sure, but that's still a mighty big rock compared to ship sizes.

 

[Leo Knight]

This reminds me of a scene early in the novel "Lucifer's Hammer". Upon discovery of a comet heading towards Earth, the media asks a scientist if it hit the Earth, would it destroy the planet. He answers, "No, of course not...civilization, maybe, but not the planet."

Personally, I like the image of a ship casually cruising into orbit and lazily blasting cities. Far more deliberate. It also allows the Rebels time to mount a desperate counter attack. :lol:

 

[BP]

I whip out my weapon of 'millions of instantaneous micro-blackhole creations at a distance'...

I roll...

Its a 2!

Pffft! The Planet's History! Ah-ha! There's that beautiful view...

[As has been said - just don't seem to fit in the Traveller Universe...
not that it can't be perceived - but in reference to the original post (100,000 tonner's spinal mount?) - to quote a line I heard in some show recently - 'ain't gonna happen.']

 

[Thlaylie]

Maybe if the meson spinal could ne tuned to the right frequency to cause a chain reaction charge build up of the iron core causeing it to fuse....

 

[alex_greene]

Oh, you know, all you need is to pinpoint certain locations of pronounced tectonic activity and, well, loosen up the ground at those stress points a little.

Or weaken certain magma plugs and increase the temperature inside certain magma chambers by pouring in energy and thereby agitating the contents of the chamber, and one could turn an ordinary volcano into a supervolcano ...

 

[GypsyComet]

Mad Science. If it works for you, expect a hero and a thousand peasants with pitchforks to come along shortly...

Iron fusion is a losing proposition.

"pour energy into a magma chamber". Er, with what? Manmade power sources, even in the Great Glowing Future that was MegaTraveller (a gigawatt through one small turret?), are like adding a shotglass of water to the ocean and expecting to see a difference.