MWWG Saga Edition/4E

[MechaPilot]

I recently picked up SWSE and heard that D20 Modern may be getting a 4E-style upgrade in 2009. Ever since then I've been wondering: "Am I the only one who would like to see a MWWG Saga Edition/4E?" & "What do other fans of the game think of the idea?" Thanx for your time.

 

[Utgardloki]

I've been wondering what the Macho Women with Guns system would be like in Runequest.

But I think a setting like MWWG needs classes. And advantages/disadvantages would have to somehow be ported into the Runequest system. And who'd want to do a thing like that?

A game like Villians and Vigilantes would be ideal for the setting.

 

[Jed Clayton]

Hi there.

Ah, Macho Women With Guns, what a fun beer & pretzels game - if only you have a group of players who get the jokes. I have two of the earlier incarnations of that game, from 1989 and early 1990s. It originally used a roll-low D20 mechanic, and IIRC the second edition had a 3D6 system instead, very similar to GURPS.

I cannot comment much on the Saga Edition. I only know it was created for Star Wars and streamlined a lot of details, like starting skills etc., from the D20 system material. I guess parts from SW Saga Edition could easily be ported to other franchises and settings.

Personally, I wouldn't want to try adapting MWWG to RuneQuest, for the reasons stated already. RuneQuest is tailored to pure, gritty fantasy. MWWG also does not need something as fine-grained as a percentile system, so the steps on a 1-20 scale seem a lot more appropriate for its style in general: D20 instead of D100, you know.

As for the classes in MWWG, or templates or archetypes if you prefer to call them that, those were actually explained nicely in the first edition, where there were only three of them: Macho Women, Demonettes and Killer Nuns.

Villains & Vigilantes? Hmm, why that? Is that easier than a d20 derivative? I believe MWWG would be suited to a stripped down GURPS, Unisystem, Fuzion, or to the True20 system. I could probably list more.

 

[MechaPilot]

I've never played Villains & Vigilantees, so I don't know how well MWWG would work with the V&V system. I do appreciate the input, however I was really wondering if I'm alone in wanting to see a revised MWWG (kinda like a MWWG Redux) come out that will use the updated D20 system. With D20 games making combat more streamlined and heroic, I think it would really work out well. Lord knows I'd buy a copy. Also, I think I'd like to see the MWWG magic system shift from feats to talents.

 

[Utgardloki]

Villians and Vigilantes was an old Superheroes game from the 1980s. It had a number of features that would be interesting to add to a Macho Women with Guns Game.

Perhaps the most dramatic thing was the way that characters could throw each other around. Although maybe MWWG would benefit from a rule like in the Teen Titans cartoon where any character who is thrown more than 15 feet will hit a female character who happens to be standing in the way.

Size (mass) also mattered in the game. Most MWWG heroines, being somewhere less than 120 pounds, would tend to get thrown around a lot. Heavier opponents are harder to throw around, and do more damage if they hit you.

V&V was also cool in the way that attribute modifiers multiplied, allowing for some really munchkiny combinations. It was very math intensive, but creating a character with high strength and constitution was fun.

The randomized superpower and superweakness matrix made for some very interesting, if rather inexplicable characters. Perhaps in a modern game such a table could be made an option to speed up character generation. In other words, instead of having to select disadvantages from an ever-lengthening list, perhaps a random table could be provided. Players could either select from the table or else roll, with perhaps a small bonus if they rolled (e.g., a 3 point defect granting 4 additional character points).

I'm not sure if it is worth resurrecting V&V for MWWG. The D20 mechanic works pretty well.

Instead of redoing the MWWG rules, I'd like to see new material that perhaps focusses on one aspect of the MWWG world. It should be easy enough to convert this to any game system that is desired.

 

[Input Jack]

Youd have better luck converting to Mutants and Masterminds. V&V was, in my opinion, NOT a good game system.

Honestly, d20 seems to suit MWWG just fine.

 

[Utgardloki]

Now that somebody has resurrected this thread.

I think I'd like to see MWWG done with the 4E D&D mechanics. But I don't think I am willing to put that much work into it. I spent a whole weekend trying to create a Barbarian class for 4E and only got half way done. For MWWG you'd need to define Renegade Nuns, Vampire Slayers, Ninja Schoolgirls, et cetera.

I think I'll stick to D20.

 

[MechaPilot]

I have to confess you are correct about the difficulty of statting out full 30 level classes with various powers for each of the MWWG classes. I think that at least a few of them can come straight from D&D 4e with just flavor modifications.

The Renegade Nun is basically a 4e cleric in a bikini, with guns, riding a harley. Not much of a change there.

The Witch is basically a Wizard or Warlock in a pointy hat, with a broom and a bundle of new-age beliefs.

The rest of them require a bit of thought, and likely a decent amount of work. I don't have the time to quickly convert the new classes i've made (Cheerleader, Girlie Scout, Ravashing Referee, and Dracubabe) into 4e equivalents. Though the challenge is intriguing.

For the time being, when i play, i use the 4e skills; defenses; 4e action point rules; and the conversion of most abilities that cost action points into per encounter or per day powers.

On the bright side, the 4e combat mechanics of moving on a grid map, and measuring movement in squares, seems to bring the game a little closer to its roots (though the d20 version was my first introduction to the game).

 

[Utgardloki]

Or, another thought I've had is converting a fantasy setting to MWWG. Heck, Iron Kingdoms is almost halfway there. Whenever I played a PC in Iron Kingdoms, I always made a female character, based on a country/western song whenever possible.

Or perhaps the Dang has destroyed technology forcing the survivors to use sword and sorcery to resolve their differences and fend off demonic invasions. So instead of Wisconsin being a cold war battleground between MATO (Milwaukee Area Technical Organization) and the Wausau Pact (allied with Aunt Josephine in Alaska), it is a fuedal kingdom with giant ants and flying pizzas in Grant County.

I guess Renegade Nuns and Lutheran Biker Chicks can keep their motorcycles, but they'll need a Fuel Miracle power to avoid running out of gas.

Some classes could be converted to Earth equivalents. Cheerleaders would become Warlords. I would make the Renegade Nuns Paladins instead of Clerics -- more fighting. Witches would become Warlocks -- perhaps an inventive GM could even invent inventive alternative pacts, such as the Grey Pact (pact made with the elusive Greys). Alice Capone would have Rogues working for her. There would be Rangers in the woods, although I am VERY disappointed that among the Ranger powers in the new Player's Handbook there is only ONE power that actually involves being in the woods and not killing anybody.

In fact, if someone wanted to they could even keep my idea of a Milwaukee Area Technological Organization -- except that they would be wizards instead of engineers. They could still fight the Wausau Pact Warlocks, when the Minions of Bthulu aren't coming over across the Great Lakes.

 

[blodgett]

I personally would go more Saga with it. Simplified, limited skills, limited classes and an easy to convert force / spell system. Call Force Points Macho Points (or something equally appropriate).

There has been some talk of converting d20 Modern to Saga, but I would prefer to see MWWG as a stand alone game.

(I have 2 of the BTRC editions. As well as the More Excuses to Kill Things supplement.)

 

[LoneStranger]

I for one am inclined to agree that Macho Women with Guns would be best suited for a "conversion" to Mutants and Masterminds if it is to be converted to another mechanic of any type. 4E strikes me as too cookie cutter for the concept, and Saga seems like they wanted to throw bits of all the mechanics together (3.5 feats, 4E skills and combat, and D20 Modern talents) and see how much duct tape it needs to stick together.

The biggest thing is enough people recognize D20 Modern these days, and with all the faults people assign the system in 3.0/3.5 it's still good enough to get the concept across.


Macho Women with Guns using the Traveller system could be something to see, tweak the tables to fit the genre. Hmm...