Mortgages & Imperial Dates (especially months)

[mr31337]

The CRB suggests that mortgages repayments are made monthly; the amount to be repaid is loan/240 per month for 40 years. Great, except there are 13 months in an Imperial Calendar, not 12 as appears to be forgotten, Mongoose later recalled there are 13 months in the OTU in Libray Data. So that sort of messes things up and needs to be recalculated; at least we know the total cost is loan + 120%. It’s good to keep things simple, but that’s really too simple, since I was frustrated with the CRB fluff up of mortgages I decided to calculate the amount as an annual interest rate, turns out it’s pretty much 4.6%. What rates were used in other versions of Traveller?

I know the names of months on the Imperial Calendar aren’t used much or even at all in the OTU, I used to have them written down someplace. Does anybody have a list of all thirteen just for extra flavour please?

 

[F33D]

I decided to calculate the amount as an annual interest rate, turns out it’s pretty much 4.6%. What rates were used in other versions of Traveller?

When I calculated MT's 20 yrs ago it was about the same APR. I think total cost was 240% or 220% of the ship purchase price.

 

[mr31337]

I decided to calculate the amount as an annual interest rate, turns out it’s pretty much 4.6%. What rates were used in other versions of Traveller?

When I calculated MT's 20 yrs ago it was about the same APR. I think total cost was 240% or 220% of the ship purchase price.

Thanks.

I guess I'll stick with 4.6% APR as a fixed rate repayment mortgage. No overpayment fees, no arrangement fees.

Do you think the borrower would be required by the mortgage lender to have some type of insurance? What would that probably cost? :?

 

[F33D]

Do you think the borrower would be required by the mortgage lender to have some type of insurance? What would that probably cost? :?

It is 100% certain that the lender would require proof of insurance. (with appropriate restrictions on ship usage and crew certification requirements, etc., :shock: )

Consider that PMI (private mortgage insurance) is rolled into part of the APR %. For Subbies the gov insures the loans.

 

[GamerDude]

Do you think the borrower would be required by the mortgage lender to have some type of insurance? What would that probably cost? :?

It is 100% certain that the lender would require proof of insurance. (with appropriate restrictions on ship usage and crew certification requirements, etc., :shock: )

Consider that PMI (private mortgage insurance) is rolled into part of the APR %. For Subbies the gov insures the loans.

I agree insurance would be required, and full coverage not just "collision". When I had my house the insurance was figured as a flat amount (like any other insurance) not a percentage of the loan.

 

[dragoner]

IMTU, the 13th month is called "Holiday" and no payments to the bank are paid, for insurance on the loan, either one is in the Imperium, and one gets cheap subsidized Imperial insurance (for which the Imperium makes it up on the backside by fostering trade and travel - eg cohesion) or on the frontier, where prices are at a premium for old junk.

But...

Like the forest of masts in San Francisco's Yerba Buena Cove during the Gold Rush era, due to the flight from the Imperium and other places, there has been quite a bit of salvage of old ships, offsetting their value.

 

[F33D]

When I had my house the insurance was figured as a flat amount (like any other insurance) not a percentage of the loan.

I just meant that it was added on top of the monthly payment... "Comp" (comprehensive) is full coverage. Up to and including, "acts of God". Only additional you can get is insurance that covers your liability if you use the "vehicle" to damage someone else. The bank doesn't care about that.

 

[Captain Jonah]

Its all the fault of those darn Vilani. Everything was fine with 12 months in the year, it worked for the Solomani.

Then along came the Vilani and muck things up, and after we Solomani tried to save them from the long dark.

You can go with holiday.

You can make a payment every 4 weeks and pay the loan off a few years early.

You can put aside a payment every month and use the 13th payment for annual overhauls and a nice crew bonus :wink:

You could recalculate the 4 week payment so that after 13 payments you have paid for the 12 months, this takes a bit of the pressure off if your ships are running a tight margin.

Or you could do your accounts with a full payment every 4 weeks. 12 payments to the bank and embezzle the extra. Not that I would in any way condone such criminal protit making :twisted:

 

[steelbrok]

I always go with the 13th month coinciding with annual maintenance, no payment, no earning capacity

 

[mr31337]

I always go with the 13th month coinciding with annual maintenance, no payment, ne earning capacity

Another interesting point. In Mong there is monthly maintenance and life support, is that every 28 days as per OTU? In other words 13 times per year.

 

[Captain Jonah]

I always thought of maintenance as something that the engineer did every day and that the big work was the two weeks a year shut down. MongT changed to monthly rather than annual but the cost is the same so it really is up to the players/ref as to when it is done.

Still the two week shutdown covers many major things that cannot be done while the ship is active. Even the few days on world are not enough to shutdown and flush the ships fuel systems or plumbing.

Making a payment every 4 weeks over 12 payments gives you one free trip and then two weeks of holiday while the ship is in the yard. A trade run with no mortgage offset should turn a nice profit just in time for crew holidays :wink:

 

[Greylond]

Well, to give a Real World example the US Navy has maintenance that gets scheduled daily, Weekly, Biweekly, Monthly, Quarterly, Semi-annually, Annually and Every 5 years. Not every system has maintenance at each of those check points but those are the most common ones. Typically the Daily, Weekly and Biweekly ones are simple preventative maintenance checks and/or cleaning. Translated into MgT terms I'd say that simple daily and weekly checks are done by the crew as a regular course of the job and really don't need to be rolled for by anyone. The rest of it you could keep it simple and run it as per the book with a Monthly fee or you could rule that once per year the ship needs to be at a shipyard of the same or higher TL as the ship for a one week maintenance downtime(no income generated).

As for the mortage, ever since CT the intention is for the ship to paid off in 40 years, so I think maybe split the payments up so that the actual ones are a bit lower but you end up with the same annual pay off schedule.

 

[mr31337]

As for the mortage, ever since CT the intention is for the ship to paid off in 40 years, so I think maybe split the payments up so that the actual ones are a bit lower but you end up with the same annual pay off schedule.

How many mortage payments per year were there in CT? 12 or 13?

Anyway, I agree, hence I worked out that the APR for Mong is 4.6%

 

[Greylond]

As for the mortage, ever since CT the intention is for the ship to paid off in 40 years, so I think maybe split the payments up so that the actual ones are a bit lower but you end up with the same annual pay off schedule.

How many mortage payments per year were there in CT? 12 or 13?

Anyway, I agree, hence I worked out that the APR for Mong is 4.6%

That depends...

In the CT Book 2: Starships it says the same thing as MgT Mainbook. But a later supplment says that there are 13 months of 28 days...

 

[Jeraa]

In CT (at least in the beginning, as far as I know) there was no official setting yet. Just some minor details. So the length of the year was still 12 months. Once more setting information was created, the year become 13 months, but not all of the rules were properly updated to the new year length. Later editions just carried over the error.

 

[F33D]

IMTU it is 360 days, 12 months of 30 days. neat & simple.

 

[Egil Skallagrimsson]

I doubt that this is "canon", but our solution to this was a business year of 12 months each of 30 days each, i.e. 360 days or 12 mortgage repayments, +5 days "Imperial Holiday" week, so 365 days overall. No leap years. By tradition mortgages and long term loans are not "paid" in the Holiday Week, but as all such loans are spaced over years anyway, the 5 days is fairly academic as far as the banks are concerned. Short term loans, daily pay etc is still paid, though salaries may not be.

Egil

 

[Greylond]

Yea, that sounds like it would work.

Lots of good suggestions here. For my game though, I'm just going to go with 13 28day months and split the Mortgages up into 520 payments instead of 480.

 

[CosmicGamer]

As far as Mongoose publication "canon"

The year is divided into 365 standard days, which
are grouped into 52 weeks of seven days each. The lengths of
days and weeks are a legacy of Terran domination during the
second Imperium. Days are numbered consecutively, beginning
with one. The first day of the year is a holiday and is not part
of any week. Weeks of seven days and months of 28 days
are used to refer to lengths of time but rarely to establish
dates.