Initiative mechanic and modelling modern tactics

[Settembrini]

Aramis, you are misreading me. In any of the previous version, or most other existing games are IGOUGO.

A figure is activated and can act. All the way through.
Sure, there´s interrupts and ready actions.

But those are straightdforward

I have played every Trav version except T4.

In MongoTrav, you take a micro action, wait, take another micor action, wait and then you migh or might not take a combat action.

BTW, you made several factual mistakes in your compilation.

CT for example has 15s turns, MT has 6 or 60 s turns, for example.

CT also has NO initiative, it´s like BattleTech in that everybody moves, and everybody shoots and damage is in effect only afterwards. But that´s just me being a knowitall.

Also MT has FIXED ini following the Tactics pool.

Form your compilation it shows that you misunderstood what I was saying.
It doesn´t adress the problem.

That must be my fault, language and all that.

Have you tried MongoTrav?
Didn´t your players or youself notice this:

GM announces movement round
people move a hex or two or three
GM announces ini round
people update their dice
GM asks if anyone hastes an action
people make their calls
GM announces it´s combat action time
people announce their actions

That´s at least FOUR times around the table.

Whereas in most other games and Trav Incarnations it´s ONCE around the table.

I hope this was more clear.

 

[Settembrini]

TNE had multiple actions per turn, with high initiative characters not only acting first, but acting more often. Of course, that could be ignored and just "Go round the table", which many GM's did...

Guilty! But to my defense, there was an (Challenge?) article that changed the 30s/6 impulse turn into an IGOUGO structure. Could even have been Twilight v2.2

 

[AKAramis]

Aramis, you are misreading me. In any of the previous version, or most other existing games are IGOUGO.


Form your compilation it shows that you misunderstood what I was saying.
It doesn´t adress the problem.

That must be my fault, language and all that.

Have you tried MongoTrav?
Didn´t your players or youself notice this:

GM announces movement round
people move a hex or two or three
GM announces ini round
people update their dice
GM asks if anyone hastes an action
people make their calls
GM announces it´s combat action time
people announce their actions

That´s at least FOUR times around the table.

Whereas in most other games and Trav Incarnations it´s ONCE around the table.

I hope this was more clear.

No, it isn't. You've either misread or misinterpreted MegaTraveller. In practice, almost no character gets his whole turn at once due to interrupts. In fact, it's pretty rare in firefights. Even more so in Large Scale combats, but more units get to go.

Also, I *LIKE* the initiative system in MoTrav. I've run it. It's no slower than TNE nor MT. It's faster for my group than Battletech was/is, or Hero System. We happen to like phased initiative systems; in practice MoTrav works out to 1-3 actions per 6 seconds.

I stand corrected on 15sec for CT. One of my copies says 6, the other says 15... different printings.

As to Tactics Pool in MT: only determines who makes first activation.

TNE allows some characters more than one action per turn.

 

[Settembrini]

But in MT, an interrupt let´s you take your whole action!

That´s my point! We all loathed the huge disconnect and handbrake nature of the MongoTrav round structure.

Even vanilla TNE is not fucking with your turn. You might act more often, but when you act, you act. In MGT you act a tiny bit at a time, four times and even then it´s only two seconds which have passed.


Also, there´s also only ONE interrupt per trigger. So interrupts fuck with the sequence, but not with your action.

 

[captainjack23]

Mmm. Or like any other version of Traveller?

I think I made myself very clear, but I´ll try again:

To split two second round into at least three bouts of managing what everybody does in turn order is actually making three rounds out of those two seconds.

Usually, everbody acts, when it´s his turn.
proceed to next round. Interrupts or overwatch is part of that. When it´s my turn, I can say I go to overwatch or covering fire or whatever. Not so in MongoTrav! You can´t state what you are doing, you must manipulate the ticks several bouts in advance so that the end result is soimehow akin to what the player does.
It´s like playing with a sign langage instead of spoken words: doable but needlessly cumbersome.

In MongoTrav, everybody actually has to be asked what he´s doing at least three times before a turn is over, or before a coherent action or progress of the fictious situation can be administered.

That´s the problem with the procedure I have.

It´s even slower than BattleTech, with it´s everbody move- everybody torso-twist -everybody fire-resolve damage turns.

Especially as a Battletech turn gets a lot of things done. Not so MongoTrav.

Much ado about nothing, that´s my experience with the turn structure.
And it´s directly influencing and reinforcing the fact that nothing like infantry tactics can be modelled with it in an efficient way.

Actually, you did make yourself clear. I wasn't being sarcastic, just perhaps too terse. A homogenous round structure has lots of advantages, not the least of which is long history and ease of access even if it is a contentuous issue -which I don't want to import here. Disjuncture during combat is a real issue -and it isn't for everyone.

I wonder if it is a player mix/play style issue.....my group does tend to prefer interrupting each other in general (or at least is comfortable with it -we have at a minimum 10 years history with each other), and hotdogging things. A fixed action round (that we use in other games, like white box D&D often causes too much figiting and backseat character talk than is good. One advantage of the MGT interactive/ruptive "jumpcut" style may be better for keeping more hyper players on focus...like us. 8)