How's Land of the Samurai?
- Thread starter danbuter
- Start date
MongooseCharlie
Mongoose
just to let you know this went to the printer yesterday
Indeed - we get it back in our hands next week, so expect to see it on the shelves soon!
shotgun-toting chipmunk
Mongoose
Any chance of a teaser? 
GbajiTheDeceiver
Mongoose
Preview's up. Somebody's been reading Bushido - I approve.
Faelan Niall
Banded Mongoose
I am just hoping it does not include some seriously mistaken conceptions about the katana being some sort of super sword, but if we continue in the vein of A&E it will be.
The primary method bushi used for fighting during the Heian priod was with bow and horse with the riders trying to get into a position to be able to use their limited firing arc on their left from aside the horses head to about 90 degrees to the front. The bows were made from wood and thus had limited range and penetration meaning you had to be close to do damage. Compound bows are not mentioned until early 12th century I believe.
Horses were small and had limited endurance which taken with the bow battles tended to be about manoeuvring to gain optimal firing position or avoiding being trapped into one. Much like a dog-fight between fighter planes. I say "battles" but they tended to be between limited numbers of upto around a dozen men.
The primary hand weapon was the tachi, a long one-edged sword, used when the bow was unable to be used ie no arrows or close quarter fighting. The term katana was in use but was used for a short-blade thrust through the belt (the phrase "wakizashi no katana" meant sword thrust at one's side). Companion swords were also known as sayamaki (wound-case) or koshi-gatana (hip-sword). Around the 12th century different swords started to be used that led to the katana as known in Bushido.
Sorry for such a long first post but some, like me, may find it useful to give their game an authentic feel.
For those wanting to know more I can highly recommend Karl Friday's book "Samurai, Warfare and the State in Early Medieval Japan" published by Routledge. The book covers the meaning, organisation, tools, science and cutlure of war. From past reading I know some people like an ISBN - 9780415329637.
Also wondered if there is any news when Land of the Samurai will be shipped and any chance of a character sheet being made available for downloading. Thanks.
DWP.
PS hello everybody.
Horses were small and had limited endurance which taken with the bow battles tended to be about manoeuvring to gain optimal firing position or avoiding being trapped into one. Much like a dog-fight between fighter planes. I say "battles" but they tended to be between limited numbers of upto around a dozen men.
The primary hand weapon was the tachi, a long one-edged sword, used when the bow was unable to be used ie no arrows or close quarter fighting. The term katana was in use but was used for a short-blade thrust through the belt (the phrase "wakizashi no katana" meant sword thrust at one's side). Companion swords were also known as sayamaki (wound-case) or koshi-gatana (hip-sword). Around the 12th century different swords started to be used that led to the katana as known in Bushido.
Sorry for such a long first post but some, like me, may find it useful to give their game an authentic feel.
For those wanting to know more I can highly recommend Karl Friday's book "Samurai, Warfare and the State in Early Medieval Japan" published by Routledge. The book covers the meaning, organisation, tools, science and cutlure of war. From past reading I know some people like an ISBN - 9780415329637.
Also wondered if there is any news when Land of the Samurai will be shipped and any chance of a character sheet being made available for downloading. Thanks.
DWP.
PS hello everybody.
Faelan Niall
Banded Mongoose
I was unsure of the exact period being depicted in the supplement, however my point stands since both swords have a similar background, and mystique that most westerners (including myself) fall into at some point or another. The katana as listed in the Arms & Equipment guide along with its other Eastern counterparts are listed with more AP than any of their western counterparts. This in my mind makes no sense whatsoever due to the fact that Europeans had equivalent and some argue superior sword making techniques. The difference in HP of the weapons is acceptable due to a general difference in mass, but giving Eastern weapons (more exactly anything japanese) an extra point of armor because they are so much better (which they were not) is just wrong. So my question really is, is the book accurate and devoid of fan boy misconception? I love the subject material, but got past the glitter a long time ago. Truth or glitter?
Loz
Mongoose
Faelan Niall said:
If you mean, have I altered the katana's AP stat? No I haven't. I can't argue with your case about sword-making techniques in the west vs the east, because I'm not an expert on metallurgy or swordsmithing (and what you say is most likely correct), but stats for weapons actually need to be consistent across game books; so, as the AP for the katana are 5 in A&E, so they are also 5 in LotS. But I don't feel that it really makes a huge amount of difference in terms of game play.
But neither is the katana or tachi mythologised at all; there's no real leaning towards it as some super-weapon-samurai-soul because, as already stated, samurai placed far more emphasis on the bow before the sword n the Heian period. There is still courtesy around the sword, but the weapon itself isn't pushed to the forefront is some kind of Kill Bill way (now there IS a case of overenthusiastic katana fetishism...)
Faelan Niall
Banded Mongoose
Sounds cool and I completely understand the need for consistency.
Loz
Mongoose
Actually, I've just been back to Turnbull's 'The Samurai Sourcebook' to see what he has to say on the katana.
He notes the sword's immense strength due to its shape and skill of manufacture, saying that a katana could defend against in incoming blade with superior strength to similar, western blades (which would most likely break in similar circumstances). He also goes into some detail on its composition and design, noting its 'astonishing' properties. So, if you assume that Turnbull knows what he's talking about, then I don't suppose that 5AP is unreasonable.
He notes the sword's immense strength due to its shape and skill of manufacture, saying that a katana could defend against in incoming blade with superior strength to similar, western blades (which would most likely break in similar circumstances). He also goes into some detail on its composition and design, noting its 'astonishing' properties. So, if you assume that Turnbull knows what he's talking about, then I don't suppose that 5AP is unreasonable.
Faelan Niall
Banded Mongoose
Fortunately Stephen Turnbull is a historian and not a metallurgist, weaponsmith, or apparently a practitioner. The katana is generally used to redirect / parry with either the side or back (spine of the blade). In actuality a block could only reliably be performed with the spine of the blade. For detailed conversations between makers and users I strongly recommend going to http://www.swordforum.com/ some of the back issues have very detailed analysis of both eastern and western blades. Additionally some very useful essays are available here http://www.thearma.org/essays.htm, and in general having been on both sides of the fence in this matter I would have to say that the essays are comparatively unbiased. Personally I know what weapon I would rather have if my life depended on it.
It doesn't really matter ruleswise if a parrying weapon is used to deflect or block. Either way it stops a certain amount of damage from getting through.
As long as weapons are not completely unbalanced, I don't really mind what the stats are.
The important thing is the background and how easy it is to run/play a game in the setting.
As long as weapons are not completely unbalanced, I don't really mind what the stats are.
The important thing is the background and how easy it is to run/play a game in the setting.
Scut Farkas
Mongoose
simon what are you saying?! you mean enjoying a well thought out setting/system is more important than coming onto forums and expounding ad nauseam on all the minute details you know about the katana in order to look smarter than everyone else? my god man have you gone mad??
Are there really 3 different skills for reading hiragana, katakana and kanji ?
Learning kanji is a difficult task and it asks for a specific skill.
I their modern form, Hiragana and katakana are simple syllabic systems that really require a few weeks to master. I don't doubt archaïc kanas were more difficult to master, but not to the point to need a specific skill for each.
Also, it is unrealistic at best to believe one with a knowledge in hiragana or katakana can understand a text only written in kanji. Yet I understand it can be intersting game-wise
Learning kanji is a difficult task and it asks for a specific skill.
I their modern form, Hiragana and katakana are simple syllabic systems that really require a few weeks to master. I don't doubt archaïc kanas were more difficult to master, but not to the point to need a specific skill for each.
Also, it is unrealistic at best to believe one with a knowledge in hiragana or katakana can understand a text only written in kanji. Yet I understand it can be intersting game-wise
Loz
Mongoose
Mugen said:Are there really 3 different skills for reading hiragana, katakana and kanji ?
Learning kanji is a difficult task and it asks for a specific skill.
I their modern form, Hiragana and katakana are simple syllabic systems that really require a few weeks to master. I don't doubt archaïc kanas were more difficult to master, but not to the point to need a specific skill for each.
Also, it is unrealistic at best to believe one with a knowledge in hiragana or katakana can understand a text only written in kanji. Yet I understand it can be intersting game-wise
There are modifications/penalties for attempting to read Kanji using kata or hira, but you don't need a separate skill, as both are derived from kanji. In the Heian period the kanji alphabet was fully developed from the old Chinese, which dominated the culture. It would take some time for the learning to filter down, but the literate classes (ie the Buke) were encouraged to study by the Imperial Court, so all three alphabets will be simple for them to use.
GianniVacca
Mongoose
My, I am deeply disappointed by the kanji/kana stuff. There were three sets of kana at the time of Heian and not two (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kana). Contrary to modern usage, hiragana were used by women (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiragana), who were not taught Chinese, to write Japanese. Men wrote in Chinese (kanji) but would use Man'yôgana to write Japanese (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27y%C5%8Dgana). Katakana were less common.
So to read a given text a character should first be able to read whatever script had been use to write the text in the first place, and obviously one should also know the language. So maybe two skill rolls should be involved.
A last word-- kanji are not an alphabet, but a set of logographs.
So to read a given text a character should first be able to read whatever script had been use to write the text in the first place, and obviously one should also know the language. So maybe two skill rolls should be involved.
A last word-- kanji are not an alphabet, but a set of logographs.
