First impressions and some questions

[HirnKhan]

Hi again,

now that I've played my first game here's some comments and some questions.

All in all it seems like a great game and I have not regretted ordering the rulebooks. We played Centauri against Narn and rolled Ambush as our scenario.

As attacker I had 3points to use and I chose the following:
1 Dag'Kar
2 Sho"kar
3 Wings od Frazi

Centauri had 5 points in:
1 Dargan
1 Balvarin
2 Kutai
2 Wings of Corvan

The idea was to wipe the Centauri fighters out of the sky with my Dak'Kar and then use my Frazi to take out some of the Centauri ships before I retreat.
It started out good with me killing 10 Fighters, 4 grouped in a wing at the front of the Centauri convoy and 6 grouped around a carrier. I also managed to damage one Kutai.
Turn one also turned out in my favor, since most of the Centauri ships still were busy turning around and I reduced the Kutai to 0 dam and 0 crew. But another thing happened too, that should have warned. The 2 Centauri fighters left engaged 2 of mine and killed them. From turn 2 on things went seriously wrong. All Centauri now could use their front arc weapons on my ships and started to cut them into handy pieces of scrap. The fighters proved to be too much for mine to handle and by the end of turn 5 my last Sho'Kar retreated and the fanheads ran away with the victory.
What do I think I have learned from my first battle?

• The Narn seem to be a race with some interesting ships and weapons, but in reality only few of these ships can be used.

• Beam weapons, beam weapons, beam weapons

• Stealth 3 is not a good as expected, but better than nothing

• Survivability (Dodge 2 and +2 compared to dodge 3 and +0) is more important than AD (2 and 4)

Now some questions:

• Are there and tournament reports around so we could see the fleets used and how the different racers are doing?

• Do fighters that belong to a ship give VPs?

• Are there any rules for shooting into dogfights?

Michael

 

[JayRaider]

You may find some Battle Reports on the forum to find info on fleet types and various tactics.

Do fighters that belong to a ship give VPs?.

No.

Are there any rules for shooting into dogfights?


If player A and player B's fighters are in a dogfight neither side can fire into the dogfight.
However, player C can fire into the dogfight, and results are randomised between fighters from A and B.

 

[Burger]

Do fighters that belong to a ship give VPs?.

No.

YES in Armageddon.

 

[thePirv]

Also, technically speaking a Narn emine can fire into a dogfight, you just end up vapourising your own fighters as well as the enemy's. That's really the only exception to the rule if you have fighters engaged in the Dogfight.

 

[H]

ok, Narn.
the dag Kar was a nice Idea for what you used it for, however, the fleet was too small to support it, consider 2 G'Kariths, 4 mines a turn overall, as well as other weapons, you need to protect the ass off Frazis' never let em get in dogfights if you can help it, the Shokar again is better in larger engagements, try a thentus, or Ka'Tocs, plenty of beaminess and good secondary weapons. the kaToc also carries a frazi. The Ambush scenario really needs you to A) level the score quickly, B) stay behind your enemy, this is difficult when he is so maneuvreable, but the Thentus is a fine maneouvreable ship as well.
Pretty much any Narn ship has it's place, don't write off what you used, just experiment to see when those ships suit you best. The dag Kar, and Scout are both good support ships, but you should never consider leading an attack with them. the Only Narn ships to ignore are the G'Quonth, and G'Tal, as the Bin Tak is vastly superior

 

[lastbesthope]

Do fighters that belong to a ship give VPs?.

No.

YES in Armageddon.

I believe you are right Burrger, but I can't find it, which page?

I know it was in the tourney pack, but that was a s part of the tourney rules section, not the main Armageddon section.

LBH

 

[Slightly Norse John]

Just been through Armageddon looking for it myself; the only reference I can find at all is on page 90 (FAQ) in the Scenarios subsection, where it says "Destroyed Shadow Fighters give Victory Points as normal (one point per flight)."
To me, that's pointing out that a specific case which might cause confusion is not an exception to a general rule, which as far as I can tell isn't stated in the rest of the book.
I think it got missed out in the typesetting.

 

[MustEatBrains]

Also, technically speaking a Narn emine can fire into a dogfight, you just end up vapourising your own fighters as well as the enemy's.

Not quite - as far as I remember, Matt Sprange said in a thread that you can use the area-effect of an e-mine to shoot enemy fighters out of dogfights with your own fighters, if you place the center of the effect right. I think he called it "legal, but not sportsman-like" or something like that.

 

[Hash]

You're right - Armageddon doesn't make this clear!

However - on Page 3 of the Into the Fire II tourney pack there is a table on the bottom listing the VPs given for destroying an "Auxiliary Craft Flight" which it list at 1VP.

Still, that addition is missing to the table in the Armageddon Book and the only reference is indeed to those Shadow Fighters which, as you point out - implies that it is normal to receive 1VP for destroying a flight of aux craft and Shadows are no exception...

Still it could have been clearer for those who didn't attend the Into the Fire II tourney!

 

[Methos5000]

If player A and player B's fighters are in a dogfight neither side can fire into the dogfight.
However, player C can fire into the dogfight, and results are randomised between fighters from A and B.

So what about this scenario. I have my nial fighter supporting my WS per the rules on page 19. My opponent moves all of his fighters to the side and rear arcs of my WS so that one cant shoot at his fighters. I have another WS which is in range with the molecular pulsar. Can I shoot at those fighters since they are all also in base contact with my Nial and the first one that attack my WS has to dogfight the Nial.

And a related question, can his fighters team up on the dogfight resulting from my fighter supporting my ship, or does that count as me initiating the dogfight, and if they can are they no longer allowed to fire on this ship since they participated in the dogfight?

 

[Greg Smith]

SFoS states:

Auxilliary craft included in a game as the onboard comlpement of fighters for a capital ship do not give VPs for being destroyed.

It doesn't change in Armageddon.

However in Mongoose tourneys, they usually do give VPs for flights.

 

[Vertexx69]

yes every auxilary craft destroyed gives 1VP it's just that fighters can't get XP dice for killing other things-even if they are from a bigger ship, and you don't get XP dice for killing them. so remember to soften with fighters but cripple and kill with 2 seperate ships if you can, to maximize the XP dice you can get ;p

 

[lastbesthope]

Well I've been looking through the rules tonight.

Mongfoose tourneys have for the last few at least given 1 VP per flight of aux craft destroyed, whether independent or ship based.

However, in standard rules you only get points for independent flights of aux craft, and you score for each wing or part thereof that you destroy.

LBH

 

[Chernobyl]

I have a report from the first King of the Jumpgate tournament, downloadable in a PDF from the Archive section of my website.

Chern

 

[Ripple]

Hmm...any way we can get a listing of how the vps are done at mongoose? I am assuming that the fighter vps is the only difference but I would like to make sure.

Ripple

 

[lastbesthope]

Hmm...any way we can get a listing of how the vps are done at mongoose? I am assuming that the fighter vps is the only difference but I would like to make sure.

Ripple

From the recent Mongoose Tourney packs:

Victory Points
As every scenario is played at Priority Level: Raid the following may be used as a reference as to how many
Victory Points are earned during each game.
A Call to Arms
Priority Level of Destroyed Ship Victory Points
War 30
Battle 20
Raid 10
Skirmish 5
Patrol 3
Auxiliary Craft Flight 1

LBH

 

[Ripple]

Thanks LBH...was wondering if I did not have the right list. The aux craft is indeed the only odd ball.

Ripple