bf evo
- Thread starter zlatan
- Start date
Mongoose Old Bear said:
hehehhe
shall we complain to the british army for not including railguns and and 70 foot long missiles on their tanks as well
if you whant non realistic tanks dont look at this gameits real, and based on real stuff, the emount of times ive heard 40k players moan that FOW tanks dont have enough guns on them makes me scream !!!
by the way lets have some sas
Mongoose TC
Mongoose
Omegamann said:
Hmm...I had a look at the first example. So, the first one suffering a crunched spine standing on a rock...half a dozen of them in a squad would look great. The second guy, using the 'as seen in Blackhawk Down' US crouch walk. Shame the gun isn't at the approved angle pointing slightly downwards. Perhaps they are bird hunting? Third guy. Yep, the NCO waving the men forward. It's not bad. Somewhat crumpled over for my liking. What happens when your side are defending? It goes on, but I particularly like the last guy who appears to have just suffered a hernia carrying what looks like a...well, tell me what the weapon is, because it looks pretty indistinctive from here.
I agree, not all poses in the sets I have linked to are that great (and the figures are only 1:72, so much smaller then yours), but just have a look at what I guess are the real world refferences:
Standing on a wall, slightly bent forwards...
http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/fallujah_offensive/aar
The Crouch Walk:
http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/fallujah_offensive/ahu
There are more good examples of dynamic combat poses in the fallujah pictures album, and in the other pics on that site, too.
And I do understand that many poses wouldnt be appropriate in different combat situations but the your PLAs are standing upright like a Napoleonic line of Riflemen.
And I also understand that more poses mean higher costs, so please make sure that the poses you do use are good.
Standing on a wall, slightly bent forwards...
http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/fallujah_offensive/aar
The Crouch Walk:
http://media.militaryphotos.net/photos/fallujah_offensive/ahu
There are more good examples of dynamic combat poses in the fallujah pictures album, and in the other pics on that site, too.
And I do understand that many poses wouldnt be appropriate in different combat situations but the your PLAs are standing upright like a Napoleonic line of Riflemen.
And I also understand that more poses mean higher costs, so please make sure that the poses you do use are good.
Hiromoon said:
Yeah so they look good defending but if you are attacking you look silly. Thats why you do 50/50 boxes. Some running, some shooting.
Examples of good looking, realistic poses;
http://www.infinitythegame.com/eng/rtdo2.asp?IDNOTICIA=110&cat=64&titulo=Ariadna%20&titulo2=Ariadna:%20The%20Army
http://www.infinitythegame.com/eng/rtdo2.asp?IDNOTICIA=112&cat=64&titulo=Ariadna%20&titulo2=Ariadna:%20The%20Army
http://www.infinitythegame.com/eng/rtdo2.asp?IDNOTICIA=157&cat=72&titulo=Haqqislam%20&titulo2=Haqqislam:%20The%20Army
http://theminiaturespage.com/news/656855/
Mongoose Old Bear said:
Please do. Can you also ask them to provide half naked cheerleadeing soldiers and beer on demand? :roll:
I mean that the pre paints are alright but dont get me frothing and that it lacks a few cool extras (ie, crewmen, spades, searchlights, armoured skirts that sort of thing). Also I dont like the LMG on the turret.
MaxSteiner
Mongoose
Um... I was gonna sit this out, but are you people honest to god saying its more realistic that theres only four (very boring) poses? Insinuating that other companies products are silly because they don't look like the whole squads waiting for the bus is a bad move.
I was willing to sit it out because these were the first releases, and its alway good to have room for improvement (paint jobs are ok too), but this forums falling into the same old trap where anyone who raises any concerns about the sculpts is treated like they're a complete idiot.
The fact is that any attempt to convert these models is gonna involve carving off half the face and a chunk of the chest, which wouldn't be so bad if there were more variety.
Thats the level that 1/48 plastic figures are at nowadays, I was hoping for something like that from Mongoose, what's presented seems like a step back somehow (Especially at that price), hopefully the range will improve, but if they don't do you honestly think the games gonna survive once Hasbro or another big company aquires the same process?
I was willing to sit it out because these were the first releases, and its alway good to have room for improvement (paint jobs are ok too), but this forums falling into the same old trap where anyone who raises any concerns about the sculpts is treated like they're a complete idiot.
The fact is that any attempt to convert these models is gonna involve carving off half the face and a chunk of the chest, which wouldn't be so bad if there were more variety.
Thats the level that 1/48 plastic figures are at nowadays, I was hoping for something like that from Mongoose, what's presented seems like a step back somehow (Especially at that price), hopefully the range will improve, but if they don't do you honestly think the games gonna survive once Hasbro or another big company aquires the same process?
Hiromoon said:
Yes. And when you are not in cover then you want the pose to match too. Hence more movement.
As Max says the poses are OK but frankly uninspiring and uninteresting. OK, yes, I would want one each of the poses anyway but I'd also want more exciting, interesting poses too. Again, as Max says- imagine soemone like Hasbro gettign pre paints, then imagine them doing 1;56 or 1;48 pre paints of that quality. I'm OK as these are the first releases but I really hope the USMC and Brits look better.
MaxSteiner
Mongoose
Wow, didn't recognise you with the new Avatar lol.
Im a bit bemused really, the (whatever the Arab leagues called) models we saw in the S&P article looked pretty decent, nice pose all of the rest, these though have the weapon suck up against the face, the arms flush with the body etc. Which suggest a reason for them being so (maybe the molds, maybe the way they're painted... maybe a 3d stencil?)...
I really hope that they aren't indicative of the entire evolution range, those Rackham miniatures I'd be willing to repaint, these I wouldn't bother with (Especially if Im paying GW prices!).
Actually were the SST models we saw the actually models or existing lead ones painted with the new process? Because those appeared lightyears ahead of these...
Im a bit bemused really, the (whatever the Arab leagues called) models we saw in the S&P article looked pretty decent, nice pose all of the rest, these though have the weapon suck up against the face, the arms flush with the body etc. Which suggest a reason for them being so (maybe the molds, maybe the way they're painted... maybe a 3d stencil?)...
I really hope that they aren't indicative of the entire evolution range, those Rackham miniatures I'd be willing to repaint, these I wouldn't bother with (Especially if Im paying GW prices!).
Actually were the SST models we saw the actually models or existing lead ones painted with the new process? Because those appeared lightyears ahead of these...
Elvis in Combat
Mongoose
No thank you. I do not want DEAD poses. :roll:xeoran said:
Because I don't forsee many models staying on the table very long if they're not in cover. :wink:
Hi,
When I read in S&P that the figures would come pre-painted to a high standard and be priced the same as what you would pay for an un painted metal figure, I was really excited.
But having seen the price. £25 for 10 figures and £20 for a tank.
I was expecting a lot less. The usual price for metal 28mm wargame figures is £1, I know fantasy and sci-fi can be £2. I did not expect £2.50 per figure.
The Tank price is not bad as Chieften models sell 1/56th (28mm) tanks for £25.
I am still interested in the rules but will look elseware for figures even if I have to paint them.
Rich.
When I read in S&P that the figures would come pre-painted to a high standard and be priced the same as what you would pay for an un painted metal figure, I was really excited.
But having seen the price. £25 for 10 figures and £20 for a tank.
I was expecting a lot less. The usual price for metal 28mm wargame figures is £1, I know fantasy and sci-fi can be £2. I did not expect £2.50 per figure.
The Tank price is not bad as Chieften models sell 1/56th (28mm) tanks for £25.
I am still interested in the rules but will look elseware for figures even if I have to paint them.
Rich.
MaxSteiner said:
I know, a shock from my previous crazy Russian avatar! :wink: However I like Lobster Johnson more...
The MEA I rate above the PLA but the poses are still boring, generic and wildly unexciting.
Elvis in Combat said:
Watch videos of troops in combat- they still need to advance and do so by advancing under covering fire, in short hops or by moving with far away terrain blocking the enemies LoS. But they still run, and they still advance, they throw grenades etc. :wink:
Oh and accordign to Matt (on Frothers) the infantry should (I'm not guaranteeign) go down to £20 and the tanks to £15. Matt correct me if I got that wrong.
For Omegaman I went to those links you posted, the poses are somewhat dynamic but the miniatures in those pictures are cack. Not one figure could be a prepainted figure because every figure has unacceptable fladh. To be honest those look more like the soft platic toy soldier I can get fifty for a dollar at the dollar store. Especially the one carrying an M-16 with twenty ammo pouches for pistols on his vest, ridiculous!!
For richinq show me the individual figures for 1 pound from EE or let me know who actually produces metal figures of "quality" at 1 BP each in 28mm. I honestly do not know of any in 28mm. Perhaps in 15mm .
Not to mention prepainted.
Hey MaxSteiner, I like dynamic poses as well but I can take them or leave them as game pieces.
For those complaining about the rifles being too close to the face etc. Just how are you supposed to aim it if you do not "Cheek" the rifle to align the sights with the eye?? Certainly it makes conversions more difficult, I agree with that. This statement from one who always qualified as an Expert Marksman (Rifle, Pistol etc. I hit what I aim at)and as the arms Sgt for my unit.
I think too many have watched movies and television, where you "defeat" the enemy by spraying 2,000 rounds of ammo into the brush and terrain.
Vietnam was a great lesson against such tactics. That is why the latest version of th M16 has a three shot selector. To prevent soldiers from wasting that precious ammo load. Since most units carried 200 rounds as their basic load, on full-auto they could burn through that in no time. What something on the order of 1.6 seconds for a twenty round magazine, 2.3 seconds for a thirty round magazine etc. Two minutes into a Fire Fight and they were screaming for ammo. No fire discipline and a failure to aim resulted in the highest ammunition consumption per enemy casualty of any war the US has ever been involved in. Enough of that particular rant!!
As for buying different miniatures from another company to play this rule set, that is your choice, however I personally do no support this attitude.
My personal take on this is support the company if you like the game. If you do not like the game, well that is a personal preference.
All of the above is not aimed to start controversy, in any way. I am just stating my opinion on the various posts in this thread. Hell, I could be dead before BF:Evo goes into release. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
For richinq show me the individual figures for 1 pound from EE or let me know who actually produces metal figures of "quality" at 1 BP each in 28mm. I honestly do not know of any in 28mm. Perhaps in 15mm .
Not to mention prepainted.
Hey MaxSteiner, I like dynamic poses as well but I can take them or leave them as game pieces.
For those complaining about the rifles being too close to the face etc. Just how are you supposed to aim it if you do not "Cheek" the rifle to align the sights with the eye?? Certainly it makes conversions more difficult, I agree with that. This statement from one who always qualified as an Expert Marksman (Rifle, Pistol etc. I hit what I aim at)and as the arms Sgt for my unit.
I think too many have watched movies and television, where you "defeat" the enemy by spraying 2,000 rounds of ammo into the brush and terrain.
Vietnam was a great lesson against such tactics. That is why the latest version of th M16 has a three shot selector. To prevent soldiers from wasting that precious ammo load. Since most units carried 200 rounds as their basic load, on full-auto they could burn through that in no time. What something on the order of 1.6 seconds for a twenty round magazine, 2.3 seconds for a thirty round magazine etc. Two minutes into a Fire Fight and they were screaming for ammo. No fire discipline and a failure to aim resulted in the highest ammunition consumption per enemy casualty of any war the US has ever been involved in. Enough of that particular rant!!
As for buying different miniatures from another company to play this rule set, that is your choice, however I personally do no support this attitude.
My personal take on this is support the company if you like the game. If you do not like the game, well that is a personal preference.
All of the above is not aimed to start controversy, in any way. I am just stating my opinion on the various posts in this thread. Hell, I could be dead before BF:Evo goes into release. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
i think for examples the poses of the americans that max posted are really good, the infinity miniatures and these strange plastic soldiers...well some good poses, but overall miniature quality is pretty dull. (to say it in a polite way )
i'm very happy that i'm not the only one who dislikes the poses, and again i have to say:
The Problem is not that we who dislike the poses saw to many hollywood movies and now nothing about infantry combat. At least i can clearly say for myself that i like about the miniatures the realistic proportions and the, for a single miniature, realistic pose. But they neither look realistic as a whole squad, nor are they worth the stress of repainting them. And, because of the realistic pose, converting them is probably nearly impossible.
And at that point for example i would've liked a more customer friendly approach to sculpting=If you don't culpt dynamic or at least varied poses, at least try to make the miniatures convertable.
)i'm very happy that i'm not the only one who dislikes the poses, and again i have to say:
The Problem is not that we who dislike the poses saw to many hollywood movies and now nothing about infantry combat. At least i can clearly say for myself that i like about the miniatures the realistic proportions and the, for a single miniature, realistic pose. But they neither look realistic as a whole squad, nor are they worth the stress of repainting them. And, because of the realistic pose, converting them is probably nearly impossible.
And at that point for example i would've liked a more customer friendly approach to sculpting=If you don't culpt dynamic or at least varied poses, at least try to make the miniatures convertable.
CudaHP said:
Actually they are the cheap soft plastic soldiers (1:72) and only meant to show some variatons in poses.
I also gave some links to militaryphotos.net showing troops moving in a MOUT environment.
Re: the discussion above
If you actually want to depict units firing in a stationary from cover, you would have to have the SAW Gunner and also a lot of other soldier in prone position, as this gives you the most stable firing position with the least exposure to enemy fire.
And soldiers will find a lot more cover were they can lie or crouch behind, than cover were you can stand totaly upright and fire from the shouldered stance.
I thing the discussion about how "realistic" the poses are is moot, because the real reason behind the lack of poses and the poses given looks to be more influenced by the casting procedure and the cost calculation.
Hi,
CudaHP said show where you can get quality 28mm figures for £1 each.
Mongrel Miniatures
http://www.mongrelminiatures.co.uk/index.htm
All packs contain 8 figures in different poses at £8.00 per pack, except for Support weapons packs which usually contain 6 crew figures and 3 weapons.
I know they are not painted but S&P did state for the same price as unpainted metal figures.
If the packs were £15 for the squads I would have brought them. I think the tanks are priced ok.
I like the figures Mongoose will be doing for EVO battlefield its just the price. I have a limited buget and I am currently buying Runequest RPG by Mongoose.
I wargame Historical, Sci-fi & Fantasy in a lot of different scales from 6mm Napolenonic to 1/48th (40mm) scale WW2.
I also looking at using 1/48th scale modern figures as a possability.
I always look to see what is the best/most suitable rules and figures in my opinion to use for the games I play.
I will be purchasing the rulebook when it is available.
Rich.
CudaHP said show where you can get quality 28mm figures for £1 each.
Mongrel Miniatures
http://www.mongrelminiatures.co.uk/index.htm
All packs contain 8 figures in different poses at £8.00 per pack, except for Support weapons packs which usually contain 6 crew figures and 3 weapons.
I know they are not painted but S&P did state for the same price as unpainted metal figures.
If the packs were £15 for the squads I would have brought them. I think the tanks are priced ok.
I like the figures Mongoose will be doing for EVO battlefield its just the price. I have a limited buget and I am currently buying Runequest RPG by Mongoose.
I wargame Historical, Sci-fi & Fantasy in a lot of different scales from 6mm Napolenonic to 1/48th (40mm) scale WW2.
I also looking at using 1/48th scale modern figures as a possability.
I always look to see what is the best/most suitable rules and figures in my opinion to use for the games I play.
I will be purchasing the rulebook when it is available.
Rich.
Similar threads
