Average Age of Retirement by TL

In such circumstances, there would be no consumer choice. The retailer simply wouldn't stock the older model of the same concept and, knowing this, the manufacture would likely decommission or otherwise depreciate the old tech.
If you could obtain fine wine for the same price as vinegar , then you'd choose fine wine. However, for the same price, you might not necessarily choose sparkling wine for every occasion.
There can be tons of consumer choice. There may be a million varieties of Computer/1. They are all different, but all have the same basic capabilities. Buy an HP desktop or a Dell desktop. They are both TL-7 Computer/0. You have choice. You are making the mistake of thinking that all Computer/1s are the same. They are not. They are merely all the same for the purposes of game mechanics. How many companies make a TL-7 9mm pistol with all of the same characteristics? Tons. In Traveller, they all count as the same for the purposes of game mechanics, but in-game, they actually can be made by an unlimited number of companies giving consumers choice.

You guys really need to learn to separate out mechanics and fluff. They are not the same.
 
Six Gee looks very promising, and as I understand it, increases bandwidth, by using a wider bandwidth.

Five Gee is more expensive to operate than Four Gee.

Energy cost usually isn't an issue in Traveller, but probably the cost of the equipment and installation.

How sophisticated a washing machine do you really need?
Can you still go out and buy a manual washing machine in the US? Or a pedal-powered sewing machine? Brand new? Fresh out of the factory? The reality is, that no one builds stuff more than 2 or 3 TLs below the society's TL. They build higher TL items with the same capabilities for increased efficiencies, or higher TL items with increased price, size, and capabilities.
 
I kinda suspect you can get along in Traveller with a technological level ten washing machine, which adds in sonic vibrations to shake loose the dirt.
 
I kinda suspect you can get along in Traveller with a technological level ten washing machine, which adds in sonic vibrations to shake loose the dirt.

and that TL-10 washing machine built by a TL-13 society, still has the same capabilities as a TL-10 washing machine, but for 12.5% of the price.
 
It probably still has moving parts.

It might be in some way seventy five percent more efficient, but you have to pay a fifty percent premium.

Tee/Five allows genericization.
 
It probably still has moving parts.

It might be in some way seventy five percent more efficient, but you have to pay a fifty percent premium.

Tee/Five allows genericization.
Go to a T5 forum if you want to keep moving the goal posts. Last I checked We were discussing MgT2 on an Mg forum.

So quit being a troll, trying to "refute statements (ie. MgT2 rules)" with other systems.

I will quit here so I do not say something regrettable.
 
As long as the price, cost, and size were the same, since you are ignoring TLs, why wouldn't you take it? "Oh no! I have too much capability! The horror!" lol
On the other hand you may already have something that meets your needs and not see any need to pay for something that isn't going to add anything to what you already have. Yes if you are looking to buy you would more likely take the more advanced one for the same or a lower price but if what you already have already meets your needs there isn't a reason to.
 
There can be tons of consumer choice. There may be a million varieties of Computer/1. They are all different, but all have the same basic capabilities. Buy an HP desktop or a Dell desktop. They are both TL-7 Computer/0. You have choice. You are making the mistake of thinking that all Computer/1s are the same. They are not. They are merely all the same for the purposes of game mechanics. How many companies make a TL-7 9mm pistol with all of the same characteristics? Tons. In Traveller, they all count as the same for the purposes of game mechanics, but in-game, they actually can be made by an unlimited number of companies giving consumers choice.

You guys really need to learn to separate out mechanics and fluff. They are not the same.
Post #58 @MasterGwydion offers @Limpin Legin choice prior to question mark.
 
Yes, you are. lolz! Cleon's whole method of empire-building was based on the model of raising the TLs of it's new member worlds. Why they stopped would be a better question.
:) :) :)
They didn't raise the TL of member worlds or soon to be member worlds so far as I can tell, the maker/fusion+ gifts were for worlds far far away from the Imperium. The scout cruiser dropping them off was jump 5 and had a twenty year mission beyond the borders of the Imperium.

Why does every Imperial member world in the sectors close to Capital not have makers and fusion+ making every world a minimum of TL12? Why, after 1105 years, are the populations of most worlds less than that of Earth today? Is it the Vilani influence?

A capitalist government would be pushing for growth and wealth creation so that it can be taxed to make the government more money and pay more money to (megacorporation) shareholders (the Imperial nobility)
 
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I kinda suspect you can get along in Traveller with a technological level ten washing machine, which adds in sonic vibrations to shake loose the dirt.
Why would you when the TL12 washing machine has been available for 1105 years?

I have no interest in buying a brand new iphone 5 to replace my iphone SE, I will likely get the next gen SE edition when my current SE goes to the great chip fabricator in the sky.
I will not be buying a nokia retro dumbphone, despite them having vastly more powerful internals.
 
:) :) :)
They didn't raise the TL of member worlds or soon to be member worlds so far as I can tell, the maker/fusion+ gifts were for worlds far far away from the Imperium. The scout cruiser dropping them off was jump 5 and had a twenty year mission beyond the borders of the Imperium.

Why does every Imperial member world in the sectors close to Capital not have makers and fusion+ making every world a minimum of TL12? Why, after 1105 years, are the populations of most worlds less than that of Earth today? Is it the Vilani influence?

A capitalist government would be pushing for growth and wealth creation so that it can be taxed to make the government more money and pay more money to (megacorporation) shareholders (the Imperial nobility)
I am guessing that they regressed due to poor writing consistency. One or more authors came up with a cool idea and later authors ignored the implications of those cool ideas.
 
It depends on the pension plan you pay into. The state pension age is ridiculously high in the USA and the UK compared with European countries like France.

Some careers can afford to retire at 50
This comment is gonna offend some people. However, everybody who has an Economics or Political Science degree will tell you that what I'm about to say is true.

The countries where you can retire at 50 are the ones with the PIGS economies... Portugal, Ireland, Greece, and Spain certainly, but Norway, Holland, and Belgium are also net-loss economies for the EEU. France's economy underperforms in almost every category and contributes less than 75% of what it should. They're only taken seriously in the EEU because of their population numbers. Many of these economies [Portugal, Italy, Greece] refuse to even work towards a more equitable sharing of the EEU load and just expect 'somebody else' to pay for their social programs.
Bluntly put, there is ONE economy actually holding up its end of the EEU agreement. That economy is Germany. And Germans are getting sick to death of people in the 'black hole economies' retiring at 50 and laying around on a Mediterranean beach on Germany's pfennig.

As an American, I had no say in Brexit. But I did some reading on it because there were people I know who were directly effected [a couple Brits and a guy I know in France]. Once you get down past the propaganda, hyperbole and outright lies in the Brexit debate, there were some legitimate complaints by the British and Germans over supporting the 'socialist paradise' economies like it was Welfare program. That doesn't excuse the propaganda, hyperbole and lies, but it wasn't all just made up either. In any event, as of now the UK took the only other economy that realistically functioned out of the EEU, so it's all on the Germans' shoulders now.

Furthermore, the majority of NATO doesn't field militaries for their own defense. They spend just [barely] enough to make NATO happy and then rent the USN and USAF to come save their asses. The only two NATO allies that actually have a skin in the game are Germany and the UK. To be fair, I have not watched the Swedish and Finnish militaries that much because they were neutrals for most of my life, but they simply don't have the populations or the GDP to field much. Same with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania, although these three are taking the Russian threat FAR more seriously for obvious reasons. The Poles are spending as much as their economy will support for the same reasons.

But the pure, hard, cold fact is that a great many citizens of Europe live comfortable lives with an extensive social safety net because it is simply easier politically to rent the services of German bankers and US service personnel to work the overtime they themselves should be working. You cannot depend on your allies to guarantee your trade, diplomacy, and borders and then bitch about how they do it. Especially with Czar Vlad Put-Put on their doorstep and China ramping up.
 
Germany, for the first time in history, practiced unilateral disarmament, because it thought it now had buffer states; maybe, even client ones.

I'm not too familiar with the rest of the PIIGS, since I think Ireland is doing some form of magical bookkeeping, but Greece has structural socio economic and political issues stretching back to Turkish occupation, where resistance to central authority would be considered patriotic, including hiding income and refusal to pay taxes; they had the misfortune of gaining admittance to the opium den of easy money.

With Italy, it's regional, and what seems unstable central governments; also, reluctance to pay taxes and nepotism. I'm not sure if the Greeks are nepotic.

Spain, they used to blame the siesta, an overactive housing market, and infrastructure programmes, plus regional instability.

Early retirement, I think, was a political carrot to the electorate, that chimed with both the local culture and (lack of) economic strength.

There are theories that colder climates are more inducive to a work culture, but civilizations tended start in warmer climes.

Also, local peer pressure tends to work.
 
Who paid to rebuild the German economy and so in effect protect the socialist EU? (it has not been called the EEC since 1993 when it accelerated the process of becoming a superstate).

Yup, the US tax payer.
 
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Who paid to rebuild the German economy and so in effect protect the socialist EU? (it has not been called the EEU since 1993 when it accelerated the process of becoming a superstate).

Yup, the US tax payer.
The EU has never been called the EEU. Maybe there is confusion between EEU (Russian controlled Republic) and the former EEC (Western European controlled economic state)? The EEC became the EU after 1992 because of Perestroika restructuring and the fall of the Berlin Wall, progressively unifying Europe.
The agreement between EEC/US are trade agreements and involve import and export duties, not income tax. Also includes right to work in a foreign country. AFAIK, US funding is concerned with placing US air bases and missiles, etc in just about every country, but maybe you know differently.
 
Japan and Germany, and I suppose South Korea, were all assisted by the United States, though not out of pure philanthropism.

Dominoes.


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You guys are talking a lot about what is affordable and what is not. Why pay sophonts to do most jobs?

For the same cost as a Skill Level/1 general crew sophont, 1,000Cr/mo, you can have 13MCr worth of robots. Utility Droids are 24KCr each, but we will say 26KCr each for the easier maths. That means that in monthly costs, 500 utility droids cost the same to work every month as one sophont.

Go take that money saved and you won't even have a society that needs to work. You can give 12,000 universal basic income and still be making money.

So, My point is this. In the Traveller universe, money is easy.

If you can't make boatloads of money when you cut your personnel costs by 99.99992%, then there is a problem. That is easily enough to give everyone Basic Universal Incomes and them not have to work for it increasing interest in the Arts.
 
The problem is that the writers of the rules in Traveller never considered the implications of their rules outside of their narrowly-defined uses. If a robot only costs 1/500th the cost of a sophont of equal skill, then no companies are going to be using sophonts, unless required to by law.

Also, with a TL-14 Fabricator, you can turn out 6 new employees every day for 72,000Cr of materials. No more HR department. No more worker injuries. No more lawsuits or labor disputes. No more unhappy workers. All for the low, low cost of cutting your required personnel costs by 50% and giving the rest away to be used for Basic Universal Income. People make money. Corporations make even more money. Governments make money. Everyone gets paid.

I doubt Geir took this into account when he was writing the Robot Handbook though. lol. Still love your work Geir. Never think otherwise! :)

btw Geir, what is the average lifespan for a robot that is well-maintained? Poorly-maintained?
 
The EU has never been called the EEU. Maybe there is confusion between EEU (Russian controlled Republic) and the former EEC (Western European controlled economic state)? The EEC became the EU after 1992 because of Perestroika restructuring and the fall of the Berlin Wall, progressively unifying Europe.
The agreement between EEC/US are trade agreements and involve import and export duties, not income tax. Also includes right to work in a foreign country. AFAIK, US funding is concerned with placing US air bases and missiles, etc in just about every country, but maybe you know differently.
I am referring to the enormous amount of money the US paid towards the reconstruction of West Germany following the war.
 
I am referring to the enormous amount of money the US paid towards the reconstruction of West Germany following the war.
"In 1947, the Marshall Plan, initially known as the "European Recovery Program" was initiated. In the years 1947–1952, some $13 billion of economic and technical assistance – equivalent to around $140 billion in 2017 – were allocated to Western Europe. Despite protests from many beneficiaries, the Marshall Plan, although in the less generous form of loans, was in 1949 extended to also include the newly formed West Germany. In the years 1949–1952, West Germany received loans which totaled $1.45 billion, equivalent to around $19 billion in 2024."

Reconstruction of Germany
 
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