Autonomous Combat Robots

[allanimal]

Page 95 of the core rulebook has an entry for combat drones with the line:

Combat drones loaded with Intellect and combat Expert programs (making them autonomous combat robots) are illegal on many worlds.

Tell someone something is illegal, and it makes it more tempting than ever, so I decided my players will be encountering one of these their next session, and I am trying to figure out exactly how it should work.

First off, I look at the computers and software section on pages 91-92.
* Intellect program/x allows the computer to run expert systems, one per Intellect rating.
* Expert/y programs mimic skills, at a level of y-1.

So far, so good.
Let's say the Combat Robot is mounting a gauss rifle. At a minimum, it should have the Gun combat (slug rifles) Skill, and for gravy, we can add on say Recon and Tactics. This means we need an Intellect/3 and 3x Expert/1. Assuming we add these ratings to see what computer rating we need, that takes a Computer/6, which doesn't seem to exist, but with a specialized computer we should be able to make all that fit.

But here's where the problem comes. The definition of an Expert program states:

Only Intelligence and Education-based checks can be attempted.

No problem for Recon and Tactics, but but Gun Combat is Dex-based.
That kinda blows the possibility of an intelligent combat robot out of the water.
Or am I missing something?

CSC has the kinetic interface, which allows a computer to give a player physical skills, but I see no way to give a computer/robot physical skills. I suppose applying some handwavium and making the kinetic interface work for the robot is one way to go...

Anyone else out there make one of these?

One other conundrum. Again from p.95 of the core book:

Any robot running an Intellect program has an Intelligence and Education score. ... A robot’s Education characteristic is representative of the information programmed into it and even low-end robots can have high Education scores.

I can find no rules about how to determine the INT and EDU of a robot. But even if I did, looking at CSC:

false A.I. costs 3,000,000 Credits per point of simulated Intelligence and Education.

This seems in conflict with, say the Servitor (p.95 of the core book) that has an INT score of 9, yet costs only 120kCr.

 

[phavoc]

A couple of things you can do here.

The first is to give your 'bot a 6-8 Dex and Int capability. Then base all modifiers off of that.

As for the control limitations, you can dodge that rule simply by giving the robot two 'brains' - one controls movement, one controls weaponry. Or you could simply do a handwavium and say that any computer mounted on a combat bot is, by definition, "special", and therefore you can get around the rule limitation.

You may also want to check out the Robots book, though not everyone is happy with the rules in there because they are inconsistent with other parts of the rules. But its a starting point for you.

 

[Treebore]

Saying a robot has no Dex or Strength attribute is the same as saying it cannot move or carry anything.

So it is obvious mobile Robots have an inherent score, so the mentioned attribute range by phavoc is definitely a good start.

The AI rule your quoting is for robots like Data, from Star Trek. Your idea uses programs and computer processors, it is not imparting any kind of human like intelligence, such as general reasoning. your robot has very specific knowledge within well defined parameters, so within those boundaries it can seem like it is intelligent, but it isn't even close to being AI of any kind.

 

[Treebore]

As for determining INT or EDU, I look at the computer. If it has a 6 like you mention I divide it by 2 to get its "attribute" modifier. Yes, on really powerful computers they can effectively exceed human limits, which our computers obviously do in real life. But nothing says you have to divide by 2, you can do it by 3, or whatever gives you the result you like best.

 

[allanimal]

Thanks for the thoughts on this.
Upon further scouring of the book, I found "Erik's Custom Gun" example on p.102 of the core book.
While it isn't the clearest bit of writing, after comparing it with the specialist computer section, it would appear that the expert program restriction on INT or EDU skills only applies to creatures using the computer, not to objects (The gun can fire itself, you see...)

So I decided to take the Combat Drone's listed STR and DEX and the Servitor's INT and EDU (but not SOC) and leave it at that. I also gave it the sensors of the Probe Drone, skill software, and a computer beefy enough to run all of that. Based on the known costs, my rough calculations of everything comes out to around 300kCr, with a +3 to hit on the installed weapon. (ouch). It's actually cheaper than I thought...

Base Combat Drone:										90,000Cr
STR: 12 (+2)											
DEX: 10 (+1)
END: ----
INT: 9 (+1)
EDU: 12 (+2)
SOC: ---

Hull 4 
Structure 4
Armour 14 (9+5)	(base *0.25)							22,500Cr
Integral Systems (
	Grav floater (Agility -2, Speed 40 kph)
	Weapon: Light Machinegun (CSC p. 107)					3000Cr
Damage: 3d6 DSAP (Ignore 6 points of armor)
Auto: 6
Recoil: 2
Magazine: 1000 DSAP rounds								12500Cr
	Sensors (IR, Light-Intensifying, Motion Sensor,
		EM Probe, Geiger Counter)						3500Cr
	Specialist Computer/5 [Gun Combat (Slug Rifle)/3]			7500Cr
		Intellect/2										50,000Cr
		Expert/3 Gun Combat (Slug Rifle)					100,000Cr
		Expert/1 Recon									1000Cr
		Expert/1 Sensors								1000Cr
		Expert/1 Tactics								1000Cr
		Database										10000Cr
												--------------
													302,000Cr

 

[Captain Jonah]

Now make it laser reflective, six feet six tall with a glowing red sensor. Make thousands, give them ships and they can defend the builders home world and protect and serve.

Whats the worst that could go wrong :twisted:

 

[rust]

Whats the worst that could go wrong :twisted:

DO NOT WORRY CITIZEN THE COMPUTER IS YOUR FRIEND.

 

[RichardP]

If your robot flys on anti-grav it will need a grav vehicle skill to stop it slamming into stuff. Suggest you swap out one of the other skills.

 

[allanimal]

If your robot flys on anti-grav it will need a grav vehicle skill to stop it slamming into stuff. Suggest you swap out one of the other skills.

D'oh! Good point. No more tactics, I guess.

 

[Old timer]

No need to drop skills, just reduce gun combat to 2 instead of 3 and then add grav 1.

 

[allanimal]

No need to drop skills, just reduce gun combat to 2 instead of 3 and then add grav 1.

Gun combat is free due to the specialized computer.

The computer rating determines the number of skills possible, but I think it also needs an intellect to make it autonomous.
Therefore computer/ -> intellect/2 + 3x expert/1 (aka skills)
Is that how you interpret it? The entries for autodoc and servitor seem to agree with me.

Of course, the computer can only use 2 skills at any one time. ..

 

[Old timer]

The computer rating, if i am reading the core book right, is the number of programs it could run simultaneously, not its maximum number of programmes, as at TL9+ storage space is unlimited. So you can have any number of programmes, but only run five 'ranks' worth at any one time. I think your interpretation of the intellect programme is correct, but it seems limiting.

 

[allanimal]

I think your interpretation of the intellect programme is correct, but it seems limiting.

Limiting indeed.

But I think I found a loophole. Make the weapon intelligent with it's own computer doing the gun combat part, and a second computer for the movement and the other skills.

 

[IanW]

I think your interpretation of the intellect programme is correct, but it seems limiting.

Limiting indeed.

But I think I found a loophole. Make the weapon intelligent with it's own computer doing the gun combat part, and a second computer for the movement and the other skills.

If I was your GM, I wouldnt allow that - otherwise we'll build a robot grav sled, with its own set of skills, with a robot gun turret on it, that has its own set of skills, and a robot sensor unit on that, with its own set of skills.

 

[Dave Chase]

If I was your GM, I wouldnt allow that - otherwise we'll build a robot grav sled, with its own set of skills, with a robot gun turret on it, that has its own set of skills, and a robot sensor unit on that, with its own set of skills.

Mechanical (AI) Rogue Trooper? LOL

Dave Chase