Anti-Swarm ships.

[Stonehorse]

Has anyone thought out what ships are good against the Swarm tactic. I'm thinking the best way to beat the Swarm is to hang back a couple of turns and use long range tactics to reduce their number. Most swarm ships are low PL and tend to have short ranges and low Damage/Crew thresholds.

I've had a quick flick through the fleet lists, and I think I may have found 2.

Dilgar Mankhat Dreadnought. With 2 slow loading 10 AD of AP triple Damge 28" range in the front arc. I'm guessing this ship can sit back and take out a large number of small ships every turn or second turn. It's Heavy Bolters are also very nice.

Brakiri Tashkat (mining varient). I can't recall it's name, but those 4 Energy mines in it's front arc seem to be usefull for again sitting back and reducing the Swarm.

Of course in a 5pts Raid Game (Which I think is the average sized game played) the above ships take a mighty 4 Raid choices. The remaining Raid choice I would break down into as many low PL ships as I could.

Has anyone tried these ships, or any other ships that they think would be good against Swarm Tactics?

 

[Burger]

A Drakh mothership would work well. Not only will the GEG help greatly agains the swarm's "lots of small guns" approach, but it also comes with a free swarm of its own :lol:

 

[Da Boss]

so much depends on what fleet the swarm is and what fleet you are fielding against it................. also what level game?

 

[CheesyRobMan]

A Vorchan pack can probably pop a small ship or 2 each turn quite reliably.

 

[H]

A Vorchan pack can probably pop a small ship or 2 each turn quite reliably.

but then a vorchan pack is a Swarm on it's own.

 

[No. 1 Bear]

A dag kar obviously.

 

[Lorcan Nagle]

For the EA, the Saggi, Warlock and Apollo all provide good DD guns at medium-long range.

 

[No. 1 Bear]

A Vorchan pack can probably pop a small ship or 2 each turn quite reliably.

but then a vorchan pack is a Swarm on it's own.

All this says is that to kill a swarm you need another swarm.

 

[Triggy]

I would have to say it's one of the following fleets that can deal with swarms effectively:

Massed fighters (e.g. Avenger/Garasoch)
Long range (e.g. Sagittarius/Apollo/Dag'Kar)
Very fast and manoeuvrable (e.g. White Star/Blue Star/WS Gunship/any Vree)
Drakh (GEG really helps against multiple smaller weapons)

There are a couple of ships that excel at two or more of these traits such as the Psi Corps Mothership, Xeel, almost any Gaim ship, White Star Carrier and G'Vrahn. However, this at best levels the playing field. The best way to deal with swarms (without swarming yourself) is to take a fleet with some of these features and enough initiative sinks to give you options through the bulk of the battle.

 

[Ripple]

the original post did mention the basic 5 Raid...

The problem with the long range snipes is terrain. Even a couple of pieces of terrain can become effective places to hide from this tactic.

Drahk mothership has been the best we've see... but as said, in part because it becomes a swarm of its own.

I would have thought the Adira would make a good anti-swarm ship, again because it has one of the few defenses that is not degraded by numbers.

Ripple

 

[Ripple]

Psi Core mothership would be terrible too slow to avoid, bore sighted even if it does have range. Good fighters but not enough to affect a swarm much due to low AD.

Basic ideas are right though,

Long range - depends on terrain (though you can go for a stalemate at least)
Massed fighters - depends on the swarming fleet (you'll lose to Vree)
Maneuver/Speed - torn on this one, as sinking makes maneuver almost irrelevant against some swarms.
Drahk/GEG - this stays the same regardless of terrain or race I think.

you skipped over what I think is the best offense...

E-mine/Area weapons - negates the primary defense of a number of 'swarm' ships (dodge/stealth/interceptors). Crits are often wasted vs swarms as the ships don't last long enough for the effect to be to valuable. Being able to hit multiple targets per AD also negates the damage/crew advantage gotten by buying down. Helps if you have he non-slow loading ones though...

Just a thought.

Ripple

 

[inq101]

Any swarm will almost certainly get close in the end. You need something that can snipe at long range then dive into the middle of the swarm and hit it with multiple arcs. I'd say any EA battle/war level ship (except the Poseidon) or Narn's Bin'Tak. I'd also sat the Minbari's Troligan armored cruiser would put on a good show.

 

[Karhedron]

Most swarm ships have either 0 or (at best) 1 Troop on board. This makes breaching pods an ideal weapon to take them on. Landing a boarding party on such a weakly held ship will munch through the crew of a small ship very quickly. Pretty much every race can take breaching pods although Gaim obviously excel in this area.

Failing that, Fighters in general are a good back up. Swarm ships generally have poor anti-fighter defences (although there are exceptions of course). Ganging up lots of fighters in their blind arcs will generally whittle them down.

 

[Ripple]

Boarding does work well due to the number needed. You have to get on too many ships, same reason high crit doesn't work well, lot of effort to arrange for a low pl return.

But fighters can certainly be a good answer as long as there aren't low end escorts in the mix.

Ripple

 

[Burger]

How about a White Star with Sheidan on board. Dodge rerolls make for an excellent defence. You can do 2 special actions, such as Close Blast Doors and All Hands On Deck. So you won't take much damage, and any crits you receive will be automatically healed in the next turn.