ACTA SF

[Iain McGhee]

No chance of that with the licence issues, not officially anyway. You could pick up a model of one in roughly the right scale (there's a 1/2500 model available, but it's $20 for a 1.75"x 2.25" model :shock: ) and either use it to represent one of the other ship types or house rule some stats for your own use (just don't post them ).

Word of warning: Vanilla Trek ships rarely do well in the SFU, they didn't get those refits for nothing !

 

[MarkDawg]

Is 1/2500 the scale for ACTA SF?

 

[Iain McGhee]

They're 1/3125 scale. The ADB models are 1/3788. Given that the on-screen BoPs vary in size so much you could get away with using almost any similarly scaled model or diecast out there.

As a suggestion, the Starfleet Command PC game used them as E3s and E4s and a larger slightly restyled design as F5s.

 

[MarkDawg]

It's bad to post house rules? Why would anyone care? Thanks for the information I found a kick ass sight with some cracking minis I plan to use. I will be buying the Klingon and Fed Fleets from Mongoose once they come available.

 

[Da Boss]

It's bad to post house rules? Why would anyone care? Thanks for the information I found a kick ass sight with some cracking minis I plan to use. I will be buying the Klingon and Fed Fleets from Mongoose once they come available.

In the past MGP have been VERY tolerant about house rules/ fan publications etc - it may be different given the issues with the ST licence. When /if people put stuff up we will probably find out the limits.

 

[Jean]

MarkDawg, the terms of the license under which ADB, Inc. works and Mongoose produces ACTA:SF are very specific in what can be done. One of the restrictions is that we can't use anything ST that we haven't already used. Thus we can't do TNG or the movies and such. No wrinkle-headed Klingons for us!

We also cannot promote ways around those restrictions. This forum is used to promote the game, so we cannot promote ways to "work around" the license, even if our players come up with them. Those are the rules and restrictions our lawyers tell us WE must play by. We have no problem with what you do around your gaming table and no amount of playing with wrinkle-headed Klingons can make me beam in and pontificate (or play ). But we do have to restrict what appears here, on our FC Forum, the company's BBS, or ADB's page on Facebook. Think of it this way -- you are helping us stay in business to produce more exciting games for you to play and more great starships for you to acquire!

 

[MarkDawg]

Thanks for the heads up Jean. I do plan I on buying 2 of your fleets so I will be supporting what you do here.

 

[Da Boss]

@ Markdawg

If you are bored make up a name - say the Dagger class, and use your models as perhaps a conjectural advanced Klingon scout / light warship ............ get your firends to agree and start blowing each other up. Should not cause any issues I wouldn't think unless you put up a shiny pdf with pics of certain ships / models in it. You could probably (could be wrong) have a thread discussing the balance of your conjectural vessels.....

{Ships stats edited out}

 

[Jean]

Da Boss, only SVC can answer if that comes too close to "wink, nudge" and breaks the license. He's going on his annual vacation to feed the wolves this weekend, so I cannot discuss that and know if I am accurate. We really do have to be careful with this.

[Edit: I have emailed SVC and Matthew about this. Please hold off on discussing the ship until I get back a definitive answer. If it must be deleted, then I'd like to see as little work for the moderator as possible. If it is fine, then you can discuss away. But I won't know until SVC tells me and he may have to consult with his lawyer who specializes in copyright/IP issues.]

 

[Da Boss]

I do sympathise with your issue and I imagine its a complicated one but trying to establish a few boundaries here with an unfamialr licence thanks for your continuing paitiance. Happy to delete the post if its an issue.

Do people presently "make up" ships for the SFU for themselves and for others to look at - without actually saying this is a "XXXX XX XXXX" for instance?

Can you make up a conjectural scenario/s where say the Federation (or other Empire) has built a one off cloaked ship and its adventures and talk about it. I understand at least one Fed warship has plasma torpedoes and perhaps other races have co-opted other empires tech?

Am I right in saying a conjectural ship - like the "Dagger" -can be made up by any one -However as soon as its associated with a specific licensed ship then its an issue? Knowing gamers peopel love to make up stuff and share it!

incidently feeding wolves sounds fun

 

[Jean]

Da Boss, people make up ships all the time. Sometimes they are what we call "obvious variants" such as making a destroyer leader ship for an empire that has none. Sometimes they create a whole new class. Folks spend days if not weeks discussing if it would happen, if stuff could fit, where the balance point is, and all sorts of stuff. They get pretty passionate about it and more than once I've had to step in to keep the peace (armed with the #8 Griswold cast-iron frying pan).

Until SVC makes his call about the conjectural ship (and is my personal speculation that since it doesn't exist in the SFU, it isn't legal), we won't know the answer to the scenario question.

"Tech slosh" is a Really Bad Phrase over in the SFU. No Romulans with hellbores or Gatling phasers, no Tholians with photon torpedoes, and no Federation ships with cloaks. I'd actually have to go and check the Anarchist series to see what happens with captured ships. Most of the time, the empire-specific weapon gets removed. Think about it -- if the thingamajigger breaks on the doohickey that leads to the thingamabob, how efficient is it going to be to handcraft the broken part? And if it breaks in the middle of a battle, how quickly could you fix it? Much better to replace that disruptor with a good old photon torpedo or phaser or something.

SVC and Leanna really support the wolf sanctuary. People forget that wolves are essentially wild animals and aren't domesticated. Others don't realize that some places have laws against keeping them. When the people suddenly realize they made a Big Mistake, this place will take in the animals that are no longer safe in the wild.

Jean

 

[Da Boss]

Da Boss, people make up ships all the time. Sometimes they are what we call "obvious variants" such as making a destroyer leader ship for an empire that has none. Sometimes they create a whole new class. Folks spend days if not weeks discussing if it would happen, if stuff could fit, where the balance point is, and all sorts of stuff. They get pretty passionate about it and more than once I've had to step in to keep the peace (armed with the #8 Griswold cast-iron frying pan).

I know what you mean - although people here are to be honest fairly relaxed about it these days - although that might also be as there are not that many players these days and even when I first started making stuff up many moons ago they were pretty kind to a newbee!

So reading your post - "new" ships have to be based on old / current ships as in you can't make up a new picture / model by converting an old one - say be chopping off or adding engines, guns etc?

Until SVC makes his call about the conjectural ship (and is my personal speculation that since it doesn't exist in the SFU, it isn't legal), we won't know the answer to the scenario question.

No worries

"Tech slosh" is a Really Bad Phrase over in the SFU. No Romulans with hellbores or Gatling phasers, no Tholians with photon torpedoes, and no Federation ships with cloaks. I'd actually have to go and check the Anarchist series to see what happens with captured ships. Most of the time, the empire-specific weapon gets removed. Think about it -- if the thingamajigger breaks on the doohickey that leads to the thingamabob, how efficient is it going to be to handcraft the broken part? And if it breaks in the middle of a battle, how quickly could you fix it? Much better to replace that disruptor with a good old photon torpedo or phaser or something.

I can see that argument as well as the opposite and in game terms its no fun for everyone to have all the same toys - we had this issue a bit with emines.......I can also see the this seems to work really well against us why don't we try and get a working model and both use it and try to work out better ways to fight it. Guess it depends on how the tech arms race plays out in the SFU - which seems to be more we will match their cool weapon with our own unique weapon - although there does also seem to be a varying degree of uniqueness?

Also the Orions get to use pretty much everything?

SVC and Leanna really support the wolf sanctuary. People forget that wolves are essentially wild animals and aren't domesticated. Others don't realize that some places have laws against keeping them. When the people suddenly realize they made a Big Mistake, this place will take in the animals that are no longer safe in the wild.Jean

Yeah even over here in the uk we get people who have young lions and crocodiles etc and regret it later! We were supposed to have soem wolves living semi-wild up in Scotland at one point but not sure how that went - but we do have lots of Wild boars now down south.

 

[Jean]

Orion Pirates are a weird group. They are loosely organized into cartels and those that operate in a specific area tend to have weapons they begged, borrowed, or stolen from that area. So an Orion Pirate in the Romulan area might have a cloak (although the odds are against it), but an Orion up in Kzinti space wouldn't. The Orion ship I fly (when I fly), has a gazillion phasers and a Gatling phaser. I may not win, but I have a grand time flying her!

(For a picture of her, try this topic: http://www.starfleetgames.com/discus/messages/12032/26457.html?FridayDecember1720101113pm and scroll down. You cannot miss her!)

Jean

[Quick edit: The Orion ship in Kzinti space wouldn't tend to have a cloak, but could if the Crimelord were wealthy enough!]

 

[Apep]

We were supposed to have soem wolves living semi-wild up in Scotland at one point but not sure how that went - but we do have lots of Wild boars now down south.

Bit off topic

There have been some groups thatwant to re-introduce wolves in Scotland - However none have got past the discussion stage yet - One "individual" said he had smuggled in wolves and released them but there is limited evidence to support his claims -

Wolves might be the answer to the deer over population problem we have at the moment in Scotland (and the rest of the UK).

Back on Topic

If the mini's look anything like the renders - you will have one very happy Scottish Engineer - keep up the good work

 

[adm]

Ummm

1) A few Tholians do have photon torpedoes already.

2) A few Orions can have cloaks in any Cartel.

 

[scoutdad]

Tech Slosh:
A hand'wavium term used to describe the condition existant in the SFU that prevents the Federation from capturing a Romulan ship and reverse engineering the cloaking device.

The big thing to remember is that the Star Fleet Universe has been around for 30+ years (since 1979) nad in that time, it has remained internally consistent. Severla things have been added (new empires, new ship classes, new weapons, etc.); but nothing has changed the intial view SVC had of the Star Fleet Universe.

Part of that original design was the idea that some wepaons would be useable by only a limited number of empires, and he has stuck to his guns for the whole 30+ years. Sure, you ould let every empire have cloaks, and photons, and ESGs, Oh My! But then, there would be no difference between the Federation and the ISC when it came to combat strategies and how the game worked. It would basically become 4th edition 40K in starships, with every empire having virtually identical stats.

Instead, every empire has it's own flavor... and that in itself explains why there are no Federation cloaks. They simply do not work with the Starfleet combat doctrine. No more so that a plasma torpedo armed Hydran ship would work with their preferred miltary strategies.

If you're curious, you can find a complete timeline of the SFU here. Scroll down to Y158 for the Treaty of Smarba. This was teh treaty that sent several mothballed Klingon ships to the Romulans. From these, the Romulans were able to reverse engineer advanced warp tech and eventually build the third generation ships, the 'Hawks.

And there are some examples of tech slosh throughout the SFU. The Hydrans gave several Gatling Phasers to the LDR to keep them from joining with the Lyrans during the General War. The Romulans provided their Klingon allies with Mauler technology, the Federation provided the Tholians with some Photon Torpedoes during the General War, and even the Federation fielded several Plasma Torpedo armed ships along thier eastern border. These fought with the Gorn, so the similar weapons led o similar tactics.

All of this brings us back to the Orions. Jean was correct. The Orion Pirates are loosely based in various cartels. A map showig the areas occupied by the various cartels is here. Typically speaking, the pirates do tend to use the weapons and systems of the empires in whose areas they operate as they are easily to, ehem... obtain. Not that that is a hard and fast rule however; and you can find examples of photon armed Orions operating in Hydran space and Hellbore armed ships operating in Romulan space. And if a Crime Lord has the capital to purchase a cloaking device, he will... and it doesn't matter which cartel he's a member of.

The Star Fleet Battles game and the Federation Commander game have detailed rules that are used to determine what optional weapons you OP ships have. The various wepons are limited in either number, cost, or both. But then again, those games are a bit more detailed than ACTA. And back to the original point of this long missive:

Cloaking Devices. In both the FC game and the SFB game, only Romulans have cloaks on all their ships and the Orions can field cloaking devices on a limited number and the point value is increased by 20%.
Now, if you want to allow cloaking devices on your Klingon ships - the SFU police are not going to break down your door and tell you to surrender your rule books and miniatures. But here are two caveats:
1) The Klingon ships are not pointed to include cloaks. If you add the cloak trait, you should probably bump the point cost. How much? I don't know, but hte 20% value would probably be a good starting point.
2) It's not canon. Much like SFB and FC, what you do in your own play seesions is up to you. But if you're ever playign ACTA: SF at a 'sanctioned' event, you will have to use the sanctioned rules.

 

[scoutdad]

If the mini's look anything like the renders - you will have one very happy Scottish Engineer - keep up the good work

They look exactly like the renders! :wink:

 

[Jean]

And now you see why I call on the experts! They know far more about the SFU ships than I ever will as they have a significant head start over me and my (almost) five years!

adm or scoutdad, do the Tholians in Federation Commander have photons, too? Or is that one of the SFB odd ships out that didn't make it into FC?

Thanks for the save,

Jean

 

[scoutdad]

Yes, they do.

Most of the ship cards list Disruptors in the heavy weapons spot, since that is the most common heavy weapon, but...

Here! is the low-toner version of the Tholian CA available in the Commanders Circle section of the ADB website. It shows Disr in the mounts, but has the optional Photon arming track for those who select photon torpedoes.

[shameless plug]
For thouse who aren't aware. the Fed Comm website [federationcommander.com] has several free downloads related to the game, Federation Commander.
First up would be First Missions
This is a 16 page pdf with enough of the rules to get you started playing Federation Commander, including the Federtion Heavy Cruiser and Klingon D7 ship cards.

After that, I'd recommend checking out the Commander's Circle
There you can view / download / print the monthly newsletter, Commuinque. Each issue contains a new scenario and several ship cards.
You can also print out 100's of official ship cards, weapons charts, play-aids, play test materials, master ship charts, etc.
[/shameless plug]

 

[Jean]

Silly me forgot it! I remember asking SVC about it back last year when I checked Communique #54. Now I have no excuse.