10 Ton Freight Handler Pod

[PsiTraveller]

In first edition Traders and Gunboats (page 5) there is a 10 Ton Freight Handler Pod. The ship is a 10 ton pod that has 2 Grappling Arms (1st ed High Guard pg 46). used to haul cargo around. It's an example of a working pod for space construction, etc.

I am trying to make a 2nd edition version and am running into some issues. The Grappling Arm in 2nd edition has a weight limit of 2 Tons (2nd ed. Highguard pg 43), and the Heavy Grappling Arm has a 10 ton weight limit. And the heavy arm is 6 tons of space.

How would you make a 10 Ton working pod move cargo?

I thought of using a Docking Clamp of 5 tons in size and just clamp onto the cargo in question. A Tow cable is another idea, but the push/pull description of the Freight Handler pod has its appeal. I am looking at the idea of needing to move 2 30 Ton modules from a Modular Cutter at a time, with the ability to place them onto external cargo mounts on a ship, or to insert them into a cargo airlock for taking inside a ship.

With a 30 ton upper limit I could use 2 Type 1 Clamps and get away with it that way at 1 Ton each. I am just looking for other ideas, and the ability to clamp onto a bigger ship would be nice as well.

Any ideas?

 

[steve98052]

In space, there's no capacity limit -- things just have to work slower. If a cargo arm with a two ton capacity wants to move a ten ton cargo, it takes five times as long.

Things get complicated when you start thinking about dtons rather than mass tons. Ship construction ignores that, but cargo handling realistically shouldn't.

 

[AndrewW]

I am trying to make a 2nd edition version and am running into some issues. The Grappling Arm in 2nd edition has a weight limit of 2 Tons (2nd ed. Highguard pg 43), and the Heavy Grappling Arm has a 10 ton weight limit. And the heavy arm is 6 tons of space.

The earlier edition Grappling Arm has the same weight limit.

You can use multiple Grappling Arms for objects with more tons then a single arm can handle

I thought of using a Docking Clamp of 5 tons in size and just clamp onto the cargo in question. A Tow cable is another idea, but the push/pull description of the Freight Handler pod has its appeal. I am looking at the idea of needing to move 2 30 Ton modules from a Modular Cutter at a time, with the ability to place them onto external cargo mounts on a ship, or to insert them into a cargo airlock for taking inside a ship.

The 20 ton Utility Pod in Supplement 10: Merchants and Cruiser has a docking clamp and a grappling arm.

.

 

[PsiTraveller]

Thanks! nice catch. A 20 Ton version makes a nice cargo hauler.

 

[Condottiere]

Arms will probably break if manipulating a capacity beyond that stated, the same with docking clamps that are pulling along objects larger than under warranty.

 

[wbnc]

You could use external cargo clamps to secure cargo to the pod.

 

[phavoc]

In general your cargo handler should be relatively small. 10Dton is HUGE to move around items in space. If it were a tug I'd say the size is fine. But a cargo manipulator should be 1-2 Dtons displacement at most. It's not meant to do anything but be outside for a few hours.

The problem I think you are encountering is that the design and rule systems are not structured to support such vehicles. You are better off simply creating it, assigning it some specific characteristics (like hull points) and leaving the rest indeterminate.

 

[Condottiere]

You could assume the minimum being one hull point, which gives a default two and a half tonnes.

 

[PsiTraveller]

Earlier post got eaten so I will post it again. I put a 20 ton unit in my vulcan class ship.
I wanted a unit to push/pull 2 30 ton modules for a modular cutter. 1 ton of M Drive can move 100 Tons at Thrust 1, which is all I need. If I could get a 10 ton unit with a handler arm to latch onto a module and get it connected to a docking clamp of some sort, and then do the same for a second module it lets me unload external cargo mounts

 

[phavoc]

If you are building a 'space-forklift', 1G is pretty overpowered. Something that Tim "the Toolman" Taylor might make.

Work pods should be about the equivalent of torque in space, not speed. 2DT is more than sufficient to create a relatively room cabin for an occupant, power cells and a space to attach a pair of manipulator arms (probably about 4m in length). That fits the idea of a basic work-pod meant to move objects, containers, etc. Speed of .1G should be more than sufficient, as it's not meant to be a speed demon or move objects long distances. Plus you really don't want to be too zippy since you have to decelerate for the same amount of time you are accelerating. I would imagine the pod would have 360 thrust capability so it doesn't have to rotate to decelerate.

 

[PsiTraveller]

I agree Phavoc, I was just trying to match what was done earlier and fit within Highguard rules. The grappling arm based freight pod does not seem to match the reality of what it really needs. Heck 1 ton of fuel should last for a year for 1 ton of power plant.

That being said, a small pod towing 90 tons, or 3 cargo modules for a modular cutter has a certain elegance to it, even it it goes beyond what the classic push/pull two pod description says.
And a 10 ton utility pod that can have a few benches in the 'cargo' section to move a shift change of guys from one orbital habitat to another makes a certain amount of storyline sense. Plus a bathroom. I've driven loaders and after a few hours you will need to stop and pee, so a pod big enough to justify a bathroom of some sort is awesome. My 20 ton version in my vulcan class product has a 3 ton bridge instead of a cockpit. I am assuming it has a potty in it somewhere. Forget being in a cockpit for an 8 hour shift.

 

[phavoc]

I like your idea of cargo hauler. There will definitely be needs for a busy orbital space to haul larger bits of cargo to distant points. A busy planet may have orbital warehouses on the 100D limit to minimize cargo ships entering the gravity well. In that case your cargo hauler will be kept very busy shuttling cargoes back and forth.

My comment was directed towards the idea of a space forklift. Or think of the pod's that hide behind the door's. Can you open the doors Hal?

 

[steve98052]

For the sake of familiar comparison, a full length modern shipping container is typically 8 feet wide, 8.8 to 9 feet high, and 40 feet long. (Normally I'd include meters too, but they were originally defined in US units, it's easy to convert, and we've all seen them.) The lower end of that range is about 5.5 dtons. Allowing for the upper end of that height range, plus a little air space between containers, that's about 6 dtons.

They fit purpose built tractor trailer beds, and US state laws typically limit total vehicle mass to around 40 US tons (36 tonnes), including the vehicle itself. I don't know what the tractor and flatbed weigh, but if we ignore it (or assume that dense cargoes can get waivers), that's up to six tonnes per dton.

So, those figures give an idea of what human scale cargo handling equipment needs to handle. Six dtons and 36 tonnes make a pretty good sized load.

 

[PsiTraveller]

Well if it takes 5 shipping containers to fill a 30 ton cargo module in a modular cutter, and we are looking at large ships moving 10 000 tons of cargo, that is a lot of shipping containers. there better be a fast way of unloading them and sorting them out. Even the ship designs for my Jump Station supplement has 1200 tons of cargo, or 40 30 ton cargo modules. If I did 2 modules an hour you could empty a cargo rack in under 24 hours. This means moving 60 tons of material at a time. Volume, not mass. They could be filled with lead ingots and the anti grav does not seem to care. This is the hand wavey part of the game, and I am fine with that. I just look at some ship designs where 10 000 tons of cargo is being moved per Jump https://www.freelancetraveller.com/features/shipyard/deckcargo.html and you see just how many pods need to be moved per ship.

Jump trains have been discussed on the forum, and it gets to be a logistical nightmare (in my opinion). I can hand wave it away and say that tugs or drones bring the cargo to a spot in space for loading, but 3000 30 ton modules is a lot to move in a short time. Your ship will look like a dragonfly by the time the Jump train is loaded.

 

[Condottiere]

I haven't looked it up, but I bet the dimensions of that thirty tonne module only allow you to carry four six tonne standard containers; you could fill up some of the rest of the space with pallets.

 

[vargr1]

Well if it takes 5 shipping containers to fill a 30 ton cargo module in a modular cutter, and we are looking at large ships moving 10 000 tons of cargo, that is a lot of shipping containers. there better be a fast way of unloading them and sorting them out. Even the ship designs for my Jump Station supplement has 1200 tons of cargo, or 40 30 ton cargo modules. If I did 2 modules an hour you could empty a cargo rack in under 24 hours. This means moving 60 tons of material at a time. Volume, not mass. They could be filled with lead ingots and the anti grav does not seem to care. This is the hand wavey part of the game, and I am fine with that. I just look at some ship designs where 10 000 tons of cargo is being moved per Jump https://www.freelancetraveller.com/features/shipyard/deckcargo.html and you see just how many pods need to be moved per ship.

Jump trains have been discussed on the forum, and it gets to be a logistical nightmare (in my opinion). I can hand wave it away and say that tugs or drones bring the cargo to a spot in space for loading, but 3000 30 ton modules is a lot to move in a short time. Your ship will look like a dragonfly by the time the Jump train is loaded.

Modern container ships can carry 15,000+ TEUs and be unloaded and loaded in a couple of days. Less if you're in Hong Kong.

Well-equipped starports will have no problem moving huge amounts of tonnage.

http://www.emma-maersk.com/specification/