Suppliment 14: Space Station talk

Reynard

Emperor Mongoose
Thought I'd have a section for anything concerning SSs since there can be a variety of topics about them.

"Low earth orbit is only slightly above the Earth, by outer space standards, 124 - 1240 miles (200 - 2000 km) in altitude. Below 124 miles, orbits rapidly degrade, causing surface impact, and above 1,240 miles or even less, the Earth's radiation belts damage electronic equipment, necessitating special shielding. The region from 1,243 miles altitude to geostationary orbit (35,786 kilometers or 22,236 mi) is known as Medium Earth Orbit. Low earth orbit, medium earth orbit, and geostationary orbit are known as LEO, MEO, and GSO respectively. By comparison, the Moon orbits the Earth at an altitude of approximately 384,399 km (238,854 mi), putting GSO at about 10% of the way to the Moon. LEO is only about 1% of the way to the Moon."

I thought this would be a good imagery for where stations are located with Earth conditions as a baseline UWP 777---. Gravity and atmosphere would adjust where LEO, MEO and GSO would be.

No flaming here. I looked over all the editions of Traveller I have concerning grav vehicles and the universally vague "reach orbit". Now that we have the supplement listing actual orbits of Orbital (low orbit), Geosynchronous (Medium orbit) and Geostationary this is important. MegaTraveller, Traveller: The New Era and T5 give interesting information by separating grav thrust into lifters, g-drives and maneuver drives which actually helps explain why vehicles can't break orbit. MT and TTNE were still vague about what orbit means but T5 actually shows lifters and g-drives can reach LEO and MEO orbits respectively. Let's combine the two for Mongoose simplicity making grav vehicles able to reach Geosynchronous orbit which is significant to determine which types can actually have non-maneuver drive traffic. This also corresponds to ships picking up and launching those air rafts and G-carriers.

I believe in other discussions we established vehicles can make short hops in space between spacecraft and that would now include stations. That's very significant! That means a station will have dedicated vehicles operating near the parent station in a variety of functions as well as grav assisted drones and robots in a manner reminiscent of those shuttles, haulers and maintenance units are airports. Looks like The Vehicle Book now works with Space Stations.

I picture travellers jumping out of the grav bus service running for their scheduled grav shuttle ready to intercept the geosynchronous station approaching the downstation flight window to catch a starliner out system.
 
MT actually had grav vehicles that were interplanetary capable...

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Yep, I always figured at after about TL-12 the line between "car", "airplane" and "orbiter" are almost completely gone.

The shuttles referenced in the Traveller books are either lower tech, or designed to get you to GSO or beyond. If you have a station in LPO (Low Planetary Orbit), by TL-9, Air/Rafts (with appropriate protection) are capable of reaching it. Thus, by TL-9, the International Space Station (or its children) will be reachable by the very rich in their new "air cars".

By TL-12, just about everyone is using Grav Vehicles and low orbit is CROWDED.
 
I found that particular vehicle in the 101 Vehicles catalog. Odd it's the only grav vehicle to be listed as interplanetary of all the MegaTraveller examples in all the books. The design rules in the Referee Manual states grav vehicle standard operation is within an atmosphere which is where space station orbits are while 'space-faring' involves the need for a maneuver drive which operates away from strong gravity wells. In the vehicle design section, there was an errata to the Design Evaluation section for thrust based vehicles in which TOP VACUUM SPEED was replace with TOP MAX ACCEL and the table determines speeds in an atmosphere. This includes spacecraft operating within an atmosphere. Sounds like someone forgot the rules or didn't bother stating definite exceptions to the rules.

So, for our purposes in MgT grav vehicles follow the reach orbit rule and can access/ operate around LEO and MEO stations.
 
Reynard said:
In the vehicle design section, there was an errata to the Design Evaluation section for thrust based vehicles in which TOP VACUUM SPEED was replace with TOP MAX ACCEL and the table determines speeds in an atmosphere. This includes spacecraft operating within an atmosphere. Sounds like someone forgot the rules or didn't bother stating definite exceptions to the rules.

No. Max accel is in G's. The design I posted did it correctly. Also, "in atmosphere" is meaningless as grav vehicles can operate with no atmosphere. The MT design rules/sequence state no maximum altitude for grav vehicles. Unless there is errata I never saw
 
Except for that Hopper, all other grav vehicles are only rated for atmospheric use. That's what the errata did when it corrected the thrust to acceleration table removing vacuum from the table's title. In other words, they DO say grav vehicles are planet bound in a gravity well. And MgT does say "CAN EVEN REACH ORBIT".
 
I've always treated grav vehicles as capable of reaching low orbit, maybe even geo, but they would be puttering out about then. In theory, I guess, you could use an air/raft to coast between say the Earth and the moon, but that would be really an act of desperation.

Come to think of it, a thruster pack add-on would be a nice gear upgrade to a lot of player vehicles, allowing them to do silly things like travel in space in an air-raft. Better add in the chemical toilet too!
 
I think another reason vehicles are restricted to planetary orbit is they aren't actually built to protect against hard radiation. LEO and MEO orbits are still well within both protective atmosphere and magnetic fields. This is also what saves out space stations today. I'm sure none are made to keep out the really bad stuff in a hard vacuum.

I saw the grav liner in The Vehicle Book but it's too... complicated for shuttle duty to a station. Need to be made as a shuttle bus rather than an airliner. In other words cheap.

A question about The Vehicle Book. Should a vehicle able to reach LEO and/or MEO have the Vacuum Environment Protection or is the Life Support, Short Term sufficient to compensate for high altitude, low pressure environment as other vehicles such as airliners use?
 
Reynard said:
I think another reason vehicles are restricted to planetary orbit is they aren't actually built to protect against hard radiation.

Trav higher TL EV suits protect against that. Including it in a vehicle would be trivial.
 
I would think operating most enclosed vehicles in EV suits would be clumsy and impose penalties to operation. The majority of grav vehicles are also examples of shirt sleeve environments especially passenger vehicles. This makes sense that keeping that same shirt sleeve operation in the vacuum environment above the geostationary level would be the realm of Small Craft.
 
I combed though CT, MT & MgT. The "feel" is low orbit max. Oddly enough there was never a rule created in the ship/vehicle design rules.

Since it is proposed that it should be based on an inferior grav drive as compared to a ships grav drive, it should be figured on the grav well in which it operates.

Something like max ceiling of 20 km for every 0.1 G of gravity of the world. This would give it a max altitude of 200km on Earth. That is a LEO range.
 
My gut tells me grav vehicles should make it to geostationary. It's sort of like the top the parabolic curve that the "antigrav" in the drive can push against.
 
Imeanunoharm said:
My gut tells me grav vehicles should make it to geostationary. It's sort of like the top the parabolic curve that the "antigrav" in the drive can push against.

Could be. That's an easy rule that automatically scales.
 
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