Stunners too powerful?

[Gee4orce]

It's certainly not inconceivable that an terrorist could use an off-the-shelf green light laser to blind an Apache gunship's targetting optics (or even it's pilot), or bring down an airliner.

The kind of lasers you can buy on the web are easily powerful enough to at least temporarily blind a person at a considerable distance - there was a case recently of a commercial pilot being temporarily blinded by some idiot with a laser as he came into land. Luckily, that's what co-pilots are there for...

 

[simonh]

I saw a TV documentary that proported that Hitler was against gassing as a weapon (mustard gas? - some prior experience WWI experience) because it was 'inhumane'.

There's some evidence that germany actually had nerve gas during the war, but assumed that the allies had it as well (they didn't) and decided not to use it for fear of escalation.

On the main point of stun weapons, my brother once ran a RuneQuest game in which the PCs got hold of magic swords that inflicted non-lethal 'stun' damage. Instead of dying, enemies just went to sleep. It turned out to be a terrible idea. They were just as effective as real swords, and you still had the option to kill your enemies after the fight. It took a lot of the risk and drama out of the game.

Simon Hibbs

 

[AndrewW]

From the looks of things stun effects are going to be negated by a full suit of armour. But other damage from the weapon such as impact could still apply.

 

[Woas]

A full suit of armor effects stunners just as much as lethal rounds. Assuming even one 'point' of damage is dealt you get either:

Lethal Weapon: Character is completely non phased by being hit from an actual bullet and his/her Endurance is marked down by 1. More shots are required to knock him/her out/kill the character.

Stunner: Character's consciousness is checked via a 'save or die' like Endurance throw with a -1 DM which will produce failure almost 75% of the time (assuming no other +/- DMs). If the check is failed the character is completely helpless and unconscious for one minute (10 combat rounds) wherein they may start making Endurance checks to potentially wake up.

From the looks of things stun effects are going to be negated by a full suit of armour. But other damage from the weapon such as impact could still apply.

 

[AndrewW]

A full suit of armor effects stunners just as much as lethal rounds. Assuming even one 'point' of damage is dealt you get either:

Not from what I'm going by. But sorry not saying anymore then that about it for now.

 

[lurker]

Both ways folks, both ways. I'd rather the local authorities have a very capable stunner to rely on so they don't use deadly force on my characters comrades when they get out of line (My characters never get into trouble!).

Sleeping gas grenades, tranquilizer darts, chloroform, all of these are legitimate ways of knocking someone out and then having your way with them. Don't see why there is an uproar about stunners.

Perhaps you are equating them to technology you are familiar with? The stunners are TL8 or better - this is future technology. Our current technology, according to the book, is between TL7 and TL8. Think of the very best stun weapon currently being designed in a test facility today, and these military/law enforcement grade stunners are specifically designed to knock out its target, not just temporarily immobilize them.

Possabilities:
- Perhaps in YTU you adjust the law level for restricting stun weapons because too many citizens use them on each other for robbery, rape, or just controlling their unruly children.

- For less effective stunners
1) Adjust the Endurance roll to Must roll over the amount of 'damage' (after armor is subtracted) using an End DM.
2) Stun 'damage' goes to Endurance (Tracked separate from regular damage). An endurance check is only needed if you sustain stun 'damage' which brings your endurance down to 0. Repeated successful attempts to stun have cumulative 'damage'. Possible -1 DM for each round stunned.
3) Make the endurance check routine (+2DM) instead of average. Possibly adjust the difficulty of the check based on the TL of the weapon.
4) Give different types of armor a DM against stunners.

Regaining Consciousness. This is an endurance check (and endurance would be at normal level since stun 'damage' is ignored). Normally you can't do this check for 1 minute, which is 10 rounds. you could however:
1) rule that an immediate check can be made if certain things are done to the stunned individual. Possibilities: smelling salts, adrenalin injection
2) if unconsciousness was caused by a stun weapon, allow the check to occure after X number of rounds. You decide what X is. You can get complicated here by using the effect of the stun attack, the persons Endurance, and so on as modifiers to X.
3) The Unconsciousness endurance check occurs after 10-60 seconds, roll 1d6 to see how many 10 second increments.
4) The Unconsciousness endurance check can occur sooner similar to going faster/slower and the time frames on page 50. Instead of a average check after 1 minute, do a difficult check after 6 seconds (one round) and every 6 seconds after, if it fails.

As usual, these are just some thoughts for you to ponder and I have not play tested it. My personal preference is to not modify the rules and only create house rules for things that are not covered.