Starting character level?

[Hordes o' Andrew]

I was interested in knowing at what character level people typically start their Conan campaigns.

I ask because after reading the rules it seems like first level PCs are a tad fragile.

 

[flatscan]

The PCs in my campaign started at level 1. They knew they were fragile and took appropriate precautions trying to out-maneuver enemies when they could, knowing to run away when they couldn't. Also, Fate Points are available at first level so there's always 'Left for Dead' as a GM shouldn't be throwing one-shot kill spells at that level.

 

[Jeffreywns]

My primary players started at first level to get the feel of the Conan genre. They had been RPing for decades but I wanted them to learn the ins and outs of Sword and Sorcery. Few heals, importance of skills, non-combat problem solving and such.
Not to mention helping me run games. 75% wounds on the party has them holed up somewhere and I had to adjust the timeline and NPC actions to reflect this.
When others wanted to join the existing group I started them at 3rd level, knowing their participation would be sporadic.

 

[zozotroll]

I started mine at first, and have not actualy killed anybody yet, but have had a couple of left for deads.

if they horde thier fate points and dont burn through them on unneeded things, they are not that easy to kill.

 

[Clovenhoof]

3rd level in most cases.
Only once I had a group start at first level because they were all total rpg newbs and were supposed to get the hang of things first before having to do level-ups. Apart from that, I find levels 1 and 2 too boring because you can't pit those rookies in a decent fight.

 

[Spectator]

3rd level in most cases.
Only once I had a group start at first level because they were all total rpg newbs and were supposed to get the hang of things first before having to do level-ups. Apart from that, I find levels 1 and 2 too boring because you can't pit those rookies in a decent fight.

Totally agreed, the min. I will ever start them is 2nd. Remember the 1st level construct is based on 16 yr. Cimmerian Barbarian leaves homeland, or 17 year acolyte sneaks away from Master sorceror with a few spells, or street urchin 14 yr finally becomes a Thief.

I don't like my players playing teenage pimply faces goofballs (I was one once!), so I gve 3 levels and tell them to add a few years to their starting min. age.

 

[Hordes o' Andrew]

Interesting responses so far. My gut instinct is to start the PCs at 3rd with maximum hit points. I'm a veteran of TSR's Dark Sun setting, and that always struck me as a good level for competent S&S characters who won't go down in a single fight. As a newcomer to the system I didn't consider fate points, but 3rd still feels about right.

 

[Hervé]

I don't like my players playing teenage pimply faces goofballs (I was one once!), so I gve 3 levels and tell them to add a few years to their starting min. age.

I bet a 16 years old cimmerian is everything but a "teenage pimply faces goofballs"!

I think you're reasoning a bit too much with a 21st century state of mind. We can suppose that people living in the hyborian age were becoming adult very early and had a pretty short lifespan (Conan being quite an exception),as it was the case in most ancient and medieval societies.
A 16 years old warrior would probably be the equivalent of a 25 years old 21st century soldier.

As for starting levels, it's pretty much the same problem in all level-based games: too weak at the start, too powerful at the end. The rules becoming pretty broken in the higher levels, I chose to have my players starting at lvl 1, in order to keep them in the 1-10 range as long as possible.

 

[Clovenhoof]

Ah, right, about hit points:
in our current game we don't roll them, but assign fixed values to each HD.
Lvl 1-3: maximum
Lvl 4-10: median (d6=4, d8=5, d10=6)
lvl 11+: 1, 2 or 3 as per Conan rules

So starting the game, a Con 12 Borderer will have 33HP, which is something you can work with.

 

[rabindranath72]

I usually start from 1st level, since I assume that at first level the characters are already quite proficient. I follow the general guidelines in the d20 Call of Cthulhu conversion notes from BRP, which are quite useful to assess the general level of proficiency in more understandable terms.
I also tend to limit maximum level to 10, considering that a 7th level character corresponds roughly to a BRP character with 100% skill scores.

 

[Jeffreywns]

I guess my answer was based on the amount of years I've been playing. Hordes o' Andrew reminded me that Dark Sun was the first time I saw the 3rd starting level idea. Until then a 1-4 hp character was'nt unheard of. And skills were a few non-weapon profincies.
I thought that full hit points added to skills and feats was compatable to any "normal" encounter or situation I would put them in.
And starting at 1st level it gave them a second chance to see if they liked their character concept. Add in the fate point mechanic and a first level Conan character was more survivable and had more options than any first level AD&D or Gurps characters I've ever ran,
But as I said it could be my age talking, "You kids don't know hard. Why back in my day we had to make our D20's."
And this isnt a "what system is best" statement, please don't turn it into one.

 

[Hordes o' Andrew]

I guess my answer was based on the amount of years I've been playing. Hordes o' Andrew reminded me that Dark Sun was the first time I saw the 3rd starting level idea. Until then a 1-4 hp character was'nt unheard of. And skills were a few non-weapon profincies.
I thought that full hit points added to skills and feats was compatable to any "normal" encounter or situation I would put them in.
And starting at 1st level it gave them a second chance to see if they liked their character concept. Add in the fate point mechanic and a first level Conan character was more survivable and had more options than any first level AD&D or Gurps characters I've ever ran,
But as I said it could be my age talking, "You kids don't know hard. Why back in my day we had to make our D20's."
And this isnt a "what system is best" statement, please don't turn it into one.

As someone who started gaming in 1980 with the Moldvay edition Basic Set I can sympathise with your enjoyment of hazardous low level play. That said, the endless cycling through characters that typified my early experiences isn't something I care to repeat today. To each their own.

 

[flatscan]

As someone who started gaming in 1980 with the Moldvay edition Basic Set I can sympathise with your enjoyment of hazardous low level play. That said, the endless cycling through characters that typified my early experiences isn't something I care to repeat today. To each their own.

But with Fate Points you wouldn't be. Other than Coup de Grace's and some one hit kill spells it's actually quite difficult to kill a PC in this game.

 

[Hordes o' Andrew]

As someone who started gaming in 1980 with the Moldvay edition Basic Set I can sympathise with your enjoyment of hazardous low level play. That said, the endless cycling through characters that typified my early experiences isn't something I care to repeat today. To each their own.

But with Fate Points you wouldn't be. Other than Coup de Grace's and some one hit kill spells it's actually quite difficult to kill a PC in this game.

Yeah, I keep forgetting that. :wink:

That said, given the relative paucity of healing I'd still prefer characters to be up and fighting for longer. Comparing starting equipment (i.e. armor) with weapon damage and the likelihood of crits and it seems pretty easy for 1st level guys to be out of comission in a trice. I'd be interested to know if this sort of thing is borne out in play.

 

[Jeffreywns]

Speaking of equipment I now start everyone out with the racial package. Of course that has only been with the new 3rd level players but I plan on making it a regular "rule".
I think it adds more depth to the game and really brings home the ' You are now playing Conan" feel. Do any of you use this book?
Sorry- The book being Players Guide to the Hyborian Age.

 

[Malcadon]

I also do the level 3 start-off point, by tradition of my old D&D games.

Even before Conan, I never been a fan of using 0-level men or the Warrior NPC class for the usual cannon fodder the PCs fight or recruit - I like to use a proper PC class at level 1 or more for them. I like to start the PCs at a heroic level, and level 3 is a good level to deal with such level 1 cannon fodder. I also like to provide the party with a team of friendly henchmen and camp followers to help deal with larger treats and unforeseeable hazards - this is based largely on watching a lot of Harryhausen movies and classic Star Trek episodes (that is, they are an expendable mix of backup troops and red shirted cannon fodder).

 

[zozotroll]

Actualy there is a lot of healing. Between bandage after a fight, and the amount you recover over night you get a lot back every day. But what you dont get is hit them with heal spells until they are full up. Although I do have one player that keeps wanting to bandage a PC more than once per fight. Just old habits.

 

[Vambelte]

I used to start my campaings at lvl 1 and rush the PCs to lvl 3. But that last one we started on lvl 3, and it was a good idea.

 

[tarkhan bey]

I tend to play episodic adventures and with regular changes of characters. Thus it tends to be that the levels are appropriate to the challenge as I percieve it.
My Westermark campaign started at 3rd level. The Shadizar campaign was higher level with the characters starting at 10th level. The Kozak/Zuagir/Turanian adventures used characters who started at 2nd level.
In each of the three setting the players created characters that they thought were appropriate to the that setting. Only in the Westermark did they turn out to be a fairly homogenous group of borderer/soldiers of varied Aquilonian background.
I don't really like to go higher than 10th level though as I think that OGL/D20 becomes a little unwieldy at those levels. My preferred starting levels for experienced D20/OGL players would be around 6-9.

 

[David St-Michel]

My players started off with loincloths and slave shackles.

That had to fight, cheat, steal and kill their way to riches.

And they'll keep fighting, cheating, stealing and killing to get more.