Spacecombat - couple of questions

[Denalor]

…something that would incrementally improve damage…
... unless "a number of dodges" refers to the complexity of the software's piloting skill rather than the number of dodge…
…an interpretation of things as "mini-rounds" or subsections of the round…

Gosh… you know, I’m just trying to make some sense of the rules given. I do not intend to come up with a complete new rule-set for space-combat… Your ideas are definitely worth considering, but probably - at this point and at least for me – only useful for a game designer. Well, we’ll see what High Guard comes up with.

Sorry if I actually implied that I think that to hit roll is a single push on the button. There is a severe misunderstanding here. I do think that there are indeed many shots fired and that there is a lot of rolling, weaving and dodging in those 6 minutes… but even so it changes absolutely nothing for my suggestions. But: you have to balance the whole thing. You cannot have multiple shots but then only a single dodge roll which applies to all those shots. You could possible come up with something like: you are only spending a single thrust point for a dodge, but you actually roll against each single shot fired at you… but then you have again the total disregard for the advantage of fast ships. That old free trader is simply not fast enough to do all that rolling and weaving… but the corsair is ! And please don’t ask me, what the hell the Falcon actually is in Traveller-rules ! Probably Han has a F-power plant and F-Manoeuvre drive and 24tons less cargo space…hmm, probably also has a F-Jump drive leaving 39tons cargo space, a smuggler indeed and no honest trader.

unless "a number of dodges" refers to the complexity of the software's piloting skill rather than the number of dodge rolls. e.g. Simple software can do a number of basic manuevers to avoid fire. Complex software can recreate a number of dodges akin to the evasive skills of ace pilots.

This is all very fascinating. Call me a rules-freak, but: How would you translate that into rules ? Discussion is fine, but give me a rules-translation and I might be with you.

A ship with 12 turrets is going to absolutely obliterate it

And that’s the way it should be ! If your puny 200dton free trader is willing to face a 1.000dton spacecraft (actually your 12 turrets imply at least 1.200dtons…) designed for combat he is a daring captain indeed.
We are obviously having a complete different approach to this situation. You see the Falcon surrounded by a multitude TIE-fighters and that Star Destroyer… and survive… well, that’s Space Opera… for me Traveller is not Space Opera, and thus the Falcon would have been obliterated quite quickly. Nothing wrong in playing Space Opera with the Traveller rules… but you will have to tweak a couple of rules there, right ?

If you have 3 missiles fired at the same time chasing your ship do you only get to Dodge 1 missile

You kindly forget point defence and – in case of smart missiles – EW. Even so, I did suggest that if it’s a flight of missiles fired from the same turret or bay a single dodge wil ldo the job (spend one point of thrust, do one pilot roll, if successful apply DM-2 to all missiles).

 

[Denalor]

Sample space fight using the rules as in the first post, staring at long range (12.000km

Opponents
Free Trader FancyFree
Thrust: 1, no software, Turret (Sandcaster, Pulse Laser, Pulse Laser)
Hull 4, Structure 4, Armour 4
Commander: Lucien (Tactics (naval) 5, Leadership 3, Mechanic 2)
Pilot: Aiken (Pilot 3, Sensors 4)
Gunner: Erik (Gunner 3, Mechanic 2)
Damage Control: Robert (Mechanic 6)

Vessel B: Pirate
Thrust 2, Fire Control 1, Turret 1 (Beam Laser, Missile), Turret 2 (Beam Laser, Missile), Basic Civilian Sensors
Hull 4, Structure 4, Armour 4
Commander: A (Engineer (Jump Drive) 2, Leadership 3)
Pilot: B (Pilot 3)
Gunner 1: C Gunner 2
Gunner 2: D Gunner 2
Sensors: E: Sensors 2, Mechanic 3
Initiative
Pirates: roll 10; result 11 (three reactions allowed)
FancyFree: Tactics roll 8 +5 = 13, Effect 5; roll 9, result 14 (four reactions allowed)
ROUND 01
FancyFree
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 3 +2(Pilot) = 5, fail by effect 3, DM+0!
First pulse laser: Roll 11 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) = 12, hit with effect 4 ! Damage roll 5 +4 (Effect) -4 (Armour) = 5, two single hits !
Second pulse laser: Roll 7 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 4 -4 (Armour) = 0, no damage !
Hit rolls 10 (Manoeuvre Drive, Thrust of Pirate reduced to 1) and 3 (Sensors, all sensor rolls DM-2)
Ship Action Phase:
Aiken tries to get a sensor lock on the pirate vessel: roll 8 +4(Sensors) = 12, success !
Lucien changes position to Damage Control

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
Due to the damage on its drive, the pirate vessel cannot apply thrust this round
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Both gunners fire at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 7 +3(Gunner) =10, success) and by trying to dodge (roll 12 +3(Pilot) =15, success with 7 effect; DM-4).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 11 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -4(Dodge) -1(Range) -2(multiple action) = 7, miss ! Missile Launch roll 8 +1(firecontrol) +2(Gunner) -2 (multiple action) = 9, Missile 01 will impact on 7+
Turret 2: Beam Laser 2 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) -2 (multiple action) = 1, miss ! Missile Launch roll 7 +2(Gunner) -2 (multiple action = 7, Missile 02 will impact on 9+
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer changes position from sensors to damage control.

ROUND 02
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 5 +2(Pilot) = 7, fail, DM -1!
First pulse laser: Roll 12 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 13, hit with effect 5 ! Damage roll 2 +5 (Effect) -4 (Armour) = 3, one single hit !
Second pulse laser: Roll 8 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 9, hit with effect 1 ! Damage roll 2 +1(effect) -4 (Armour) = -1, no damage !
Hit roll 5 (fuel, leakage of 5tons per hour)
Ship Action Phase:
No Action

Missile 01 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (5 remaining to get to medium range)
Missile 02 (9+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (5 remaining to get to medium range)

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
Due to the damage on its drive, the pirate vessel cannot apply thrust this round
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Both gunners fire at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 9 +3(Gunner) =12, success) and by trying to dodge (roll 8 +3(Pilot) =11, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 4 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -3(Dodge) -1(Range) -2(multiple action) = 2, miss ! Missile Launch roll 7 +1(fire control) +2(Gunner) -2 (multiple action) = 8, Missile 03 will impact on 8+
Turret 2: Beam Laser 7 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) -2 (multiple action = 6, miss ! Missile Launch roll 9 +2(Gunner) -2 (multiple action) = 9, Missile 04 will impact on 7+
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the sensor system 4 +3(Mechanic) = 7, no hits repaired !

ROUND 03
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 11 +2(Pilot) = 13, success, DM-3 !
First pulse laser: Roll 3 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(Dodge) = 2, miss ! Second pulse laser: Roll 9 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(Dodge) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 5 +0 (Effect) -4 (Armour) = 1, one single hit !
Hit roll 10 (Manoeuvre drive, second hit, thrust 1)
Ship Action Phase:
No Action

Missile 01 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)
Missile 02 (9+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)
Missile 03 (8+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (5 remaining to get to medium range)
Missile 04 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (5 remaining to get to medium range)

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
Due to the damage on its drive, the pirate vessel cannot apply thrust this round
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Both gunners fire (this time only the beam lasers) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 10 +3(Gunner) =13, success) and by trying to dodge (roll 10 +3(Pilot) =13, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 12 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -3(Dodge) -1(Range) = 11, hit with effect 3 ! Damage 6 +3(effect) -4(Armour) -4(sand) = 1, one single hit ! Hit 12 (hull, hull 3)
Turret 2: Beam Laser 5 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 6, miss !
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the sensor system 5 +3(Mechanic) = 8, one hit repaired ! Sensors no longer at DM-2

ROUND 04
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 6 +2(Pilot) = 8, success, DM-2 !
First pulse laser: Roll 10 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -2(Dodge) = 10, hit with effect 2 ! Damage roll 6 +2 (Effect) -4 (Armour) = 4, one single hit ! Hit roll 7 (Armour, Armour 3)
Second pulse laser: Roll 8 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -2(Dodge) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 2 +0 (Effect) -4 (Armour) = -2, no damage !
Ship Action Phase:
No Action

Missile 01 (7+) and Missile 02 (9+) are about to impact. FancyFree reacts with point defence. Roll 11 +3(gunner) -1(range close) =13, missile 01 destroyed ! Roll 4 +3(gunner) -1(second shot) -1(range close) = 5, missile 02 is not destroyed ! Hit roll 3, missile 02 does not impact.
Missile 03 (8+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)
Missile 04 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
Due to the damage on its drive, the pirate vessel cannot apply thrust this round
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Both gunners fire (this time only the beam lasers) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 5 +3(Gunner) =8, success) and by trying to dodge (roll 7 +3(Pilot) =10, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 9 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -3(Dodge) -1(Range) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage 9 +0(effect) -4(Armour) -2(sand) = 3, one single hit ! Hit 11 (Sensors, sensor checks at DM-2)
Turret 2: Beam Laser 4 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 5, miss !
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the manoeuvre drive 8 +3(Mechanic) = 11, two hits repaired !
The pirate still suffers from a single fuel hit and from a single armour hit

ROUND 05
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 3 +2(Pilot) = 5, fail, DM+0 !
First pulse laser: Roll 6 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 3 +0 (Effect) -3 (Armour) = 0, no damage
Second pulse laser: Roll 8 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 9, hit with effect 1 ! Damage roll 4 +1 (Effect) -3 (Armour) = 2, single hit ! Hit 7 (Armour, Armour 2)
Ship Action Phase:
FancyFree suffers from a hull hit and a single sensor hit. Robert tries to repair the sensor system: 7 +6(mechanic) = 13, sensor system repaired !


Missile 03 (8+) and Missile 04(7+) are about to impact.
FancyFree reacts with point defence. Roll 11 +3(gunner) -1(range close) =13, missile 03 destroyed ! Roll 3 +3(gunner) -1(second shot) -1(range close) = 4, missile 04 is not destroyed ! Hit roll 7, missile 04 impacts with 0 effect ! Damage 4 +0(effect) -4(Amour) = 0, no damage !

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
The pirate uses 1 thrust to try to get into a favourable position for his gunners: 12 +2(pilot) = 14, effect 6, the gunners will get DM+2 !
Both gunners fire (all weapons) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 11 +3(Gunner) =14, success) and by trying to dodge the first beam laser (roll 8 +3(Pilot) =11, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 6 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -3(Dodge) -1(Range) -2(multiple action) +2(pilot mod) = 5, miss ! Missile Launch : 7 +2(gunner) +1(Fire Control) +2(Pilot mod) -2(multiple action)= 10, missile 05 will hit on 7+
Turret 2: Beam Laser 3 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) -2(multiple action) +2(pilot mod) = 4, miss ! Missile Launch : 5 +2(gunner) +2(Pilot mod) -2(multiple action) = 7, missile 06 will hit on 9+
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the fuel leak 6 +3(Mechanic) = 9, fuel leak repaired !
The pirate still suffers from 2 armour hits

ROUND 06
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 5 +2(Pilot) = 7, fail, DM-1 !
First pulse laser: Roll 7 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 1 +0 (Effect) -2 (Armour) = -1, no damage
Second pulse laser: Roll 8 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 9, hit with effect 1 ! Damage roll 6 +1 (Effect) -2 (Armour) = 5, two single hits ! Hit 4 (Manoeuvre Drive, Thrust 1) and 2 (Sensors, DM-2 Sensor checks)
Ship Action Phase:
FancyFree suffers from a hull hit.

Missile 05 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will be in medium range after another 5 thrust)
Missile 06 (9+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will be in medium range after another 5 thrust)

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
Both gunners fire (beam lasers only) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 8 +3(Gunner) =11, success) and by trying to dodge the first beam laser (roll 5 +3(Pilot) =8, success).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 4 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -2(Dodge) -1(Range) = 4, miss !
Turret 2: Beam Laser 5 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 6, miss !
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the sensor hit 8 +3(Mechanic) = 11, sensor hit repaired !
The pirate still suffers from 2 armour hits and a single manoeuvre drive hit

ROUND 07
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 11 +2(Pilot) = 13, success, DM-3 !
First pulse laser: Roll 12 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(dodge)= 11, hit with effect 5 ! Damage roll 6 +5 (Effect) -2 (Armour) = 9, double hit ! Hit 12 (hull, Hull 2)
Second pulse laser: Roll 9 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(dodge)= 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 6 +0 (Effect) -2 (Armour) = 4, single hit ! Hit 7 (Armour, Armour 1)
Ship Action Phase:
FancyFree suffers from a hull hit.

Missile 05 (7+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)
Missile 06 (9+) applies 5 thrust towards FancyFree (will impact next round)

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
Both gunners fire (beam lasers only) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 5 +3(Gunner) =8, success) and by trying to dodge the first beam laser (roll 2 +3(Pilot) =5, fail, DM+0).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 9 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -1(Range) = 11, effect 3 ! Damage 9 +3(Effect) -4(armour) -4(sand)= 4, single hit ! Hit 9 (Turret; attacks suffer DM-2)
Turret 2: Beam Laser 3 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 4, miss !
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries to repair the drive hit 11 +3(Mechanic) = 14, drive hit repaired !
The pirate still suffers from 3 armour hits, 2 hull hits.

ROUND 08
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 3 +2(Pilot) = 5, fail, DM+0 !
First pulse laser: Roll 3 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -2(turret hit)= 3, miss !
Second pulse laser: Roll 8 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -2(turret hit)= 8, hit with effect 0 ! Damage roll 4 +0 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 3, single hit ! Hit 10 (Manoeuvre Drive, Thrust 1)
Ship Action Phase:
Robert tries to repair the turret hit: 11 +6(mechanic), fully repaired
FancyFree suffers from a hull hit.
They will need to repair once they reach a spaceport: turret hit, sensor hit

Missile 05 (7+) and Missile 06 (9+) are about to impact. The free trader makes a point defence: 11 +3(Gunner) -1(range close) = 13, missile 05 destroyed ! 8 +3(Gunner) -1(second defence) -1(range close) =9, missile 06 destroyed !

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
Both gunners fire (beam lasers only) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 7 +3(Gunner) =10, success) and by trying to dodge the first beam laser (roll 10 +3(Pilot) =13, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 9 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -1(Range) -3(dodge) = 8, effect 0 ! Damage 8 +0(Effect) -4(armour) -5(sand)= -1, no damage
Turret 2: Beam Laser 10 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 11, hit with effect 3 ! Damage 7 +3(Effect) -4(armour) -4(sand)= 2, single hit ! Hit 11 (Sensors, DM-2 to sensor checks)
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries again to repair the drive hit 11 +3(Mechanic) = 14, drive hit repaired !
The pirate still suffers from 3 armour hits, 2 hull hits.

ROUND 09
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 5 +2(Pilot) = 7, fail, DM-1 !
First pulse laser: Roll 10 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 11, hit with effect 3 !
Second pulse laser: Roll 10 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 11, hit with effect 3 !
Damage roll 4 +3 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 6, two single hits ! Hit 10 (Manoeuvre Drive, Thrust 1) and 6 (Hull, hull 1)
Damage roll 3 +3 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 5, two single hits ! Hit 10 (Manoeuvre Drive, Thrust 1, 2nd hit) and 3 (Sensors, sensor checks DM-2)
Ship Action Phase:
Robert tries to repair the turret hit: 11 +6(mechanic), fully repaired
FancyFree suffers from a hull hit.
They will need to repair once they reach a spaceport: turret hit, sensor hit

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
Both gunners fire (beam lasers only) at the FancyFree. The free trader reacts by both firing sand (roll 5 +3(Gunner) =8, success) and by trying to dodge the first beam laser (roll 10 +3(Pilot) =13, success, DM-3).
Turret 1: Beam Laser 10 +2(Gunner) +1(FireControl) -1(Range) -3(dodge) = 9, effect 1 !
Turret 2: Beam Laser 8 +2(Gunner) -1(Range) = 9, effect 1 !
Damage 8+1(Effect) -4(armour) -3(sand) = 2, single hit ! Hit 4(Manoeuvre Drive, -1 Thrust)
Damage 7 +1(Effect) -4(armour) -4(sand) = 0, no damage !
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries again to repair the drive hit 5 +3(Mechanic) = 8, one drive hit repaired !
The pirate still suffers from 3 armour hits, 3 hull hits, 1 sensor hit, 1 manoeuvre drive hit.

ROUND 10
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 5+2(Pilot) = 7, fail (DM-1)!
First pulse laser: Roll 11 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 12, hit with effect 4 !
Second pulse laser: Roll 12 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -1(Dodge) = 13, hit with effect 5 !
Damage roll 4 +4 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 7, two single hits ! Hit 5 (Fuel, 1 ton leakage per hour) and 5 (Fuel, 10% fuel destroyed, 2,4 tons fuel destroyed)
Damage roll 3 +5 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 7, two single hits ! Hit 8 (Hull, Hull 0) and 11 (Sensors 2nd hit, no sensor checks allowed, no attacks allowed)
Ship Action Phase:
Robert tries to repair the drive hit: 6 +6(mechanic) = 12, fully repaired !
FancyFree suffers from 1 hull hit.
They will need to repair once they reach a spaceport: turret hit, sensor hit, manoeuvre drive hit

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
No attacks possible due to second sensor hit
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries again to repair the sensor hit 8 +3(Mechanic) = 11, two sensor hits repaired, sensors fully functional again !
The pirate commander plots a course to the Glisten system. Astrogation 8 +4(easy) -1(jump distance) -2(taking less time), success !
The pirate still suffers from 3 armour hits, 4 hull hits, 2 fuel hits, 1 manoeuvre drive hit.

ROUND 11
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied.
Erik shoots at the pirate vessel, which tries to dodge (apply 1 thrust). Dodge roll 9+2(Pilot) = 11, success, DM-3 !
First pulse laser: Roll 6 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(Dodge) = 5, miss !
Second pulse laser: Roll 12 +3(Gunner) -2(Range) +1(Sensor lock) -3(Dodge)= 11, hit with effect 3 !
Damage roll 6 +3 (Effect) -1 (Armour) = 8 two single hits ! Hit 9 (Internal !; no Bay exists: structure damage, Structure 3) and 8 (Internal ! Structure, Structure 2)
Ship Action Phase:
Robert tries to repair the drive hit: 6 +6(mechanic) = 12, fully repaired !
FancyFree suffers from 1 hull hit.
They will need to repair once they reach a spaceport: turret hit, sensor hit, manoeuvre drive hit

Pirate
Manoeuvre Phase:
No thrust applied
Combat Phase:
No thrust applied
No attacks
Ship Action Phase:
The pirate engineer tries again to repair the drive hit 8 +3(Mechanic) = 11, drive repaired.
The commander desperately activates the jump drive 11 +2(Engineer) = 13, effect 5. Jump 7 +5(effect) -8(within 100D) = 4, inaccurate jump !
The pirate still suffers from 3 armour hits, 4 hull hits, 2 fuel hits.

 

[Paladin]

…something that would incrementally improve damage…
... unless "a number of dodges" refers to the complexity of the software's piloting skill rather than the number of dodge…
…an interpretation of things as "mini-rounds" or subsections of the round…

Gosh… you know, I’m just trying to make some sense of the rules given. I do not intend to come up with a complete new rule-set for space-combat… Your ideas are definitely worth considering, but probably - at this point and at least for me – only useful for a game designer. Well, we’ll see what High Guard comes up with.

High Gaurd doesn't help much. Most of the expansion deals with "barrages" from larger ships. From the skimming I did on a friend's book it doesn't do much for small ship combat.

Sorry if I actually implied that I think that to hit roll is a ingle push on the button. There is a severe misunderstanding here. I do think that there are indeed many shots fired and that there is a lot of rolling, weaving and dodging in those 6 minutes… but even so it changes absolutely nothing for my suggestions. But: you have to balance the whole thing. You cannot have multiple shots but then only a single dodge roll which applies to all those shots. You could possible come up with something like: you are only spending a single thrust point for a dodge, but you actually roll against each single shot fired at you… but then you have again the total disregard for the advantage of fast ships.

Let me back up a bit. I agree with you on your interpretation on the rules as is. I'm just not sure I like it. I like realism, but I also like a good bit of flare in my space combat sequences. The new Battlestar Galactica is a better model for space combat than Star Wars in my mind, but it lacks a good deal for freighter/trader scale ship combat. You get the gnat starfighters that zip everywhere or the large capital barrage ships with not much in between.

That old free trader is simply not fast enough to do all that rolling and weaving… but the corsair is ! And please don’t ask me, what the hell the Falcon actually is in Traveller-rules ! Probably Han has a F-power plant and F-Manoeuvre drive and 24tons less cargo space…hmm, probably also has a F-Jump drive leaving 39tons cargo space, a smuggler indeed and no honest trader.

Falcon conversion - different thread with lots of circles to run in.

unless "a number of dodges" refers to the complexity of the software's piloting skill rather than the number of dodge rolls. e.g. Simple software can do a number of basic manuevers to avoid fire. Complex software can recreate a number of dodges akin to the evasive skills of ace pilots.

This is all very fascinating. Call me a rules-freak, but: How would you translate that into rules ? Discussion is fine, but give me a rules-translation and I might be with you.

I'm not disagreeing with you by the rules, but as this was a "house rule" discussion I was throwing out ideas. By the rules:
"A ship may make a number of manoeuvre actions per combat phase equal to the amount of Thrust allocated to manoeuvring."..."A manoeuvre action can be used to:"..."Dodge incoming fire: Any leftover Thrust can be spent as a reaction to dodge incoming fire."..."One point of Thrust allows a single dodge."

One other spin on this discussion is how "Help line up a shot" works. It's a 1 pilot /1 thrust action and gives the bonus to ALL gunners. Makes sense, but in that case you get 1 action for a benefit to multiple turrets...

Corsair vs. Free Trader

Corsair
Line up Shot+2 with solid success; Fire Control +2; Gunner +2; Sensor Lock + 1; Target dodges -1; medium Range (0) = +6 to Hit
That's auto success for 3 shots and 83% success if multiple actions are taken. 6 Beam Lasers = 5 hits on average.
2d6 damage = average result of 7 damage vs. 4 hull = 3 damage = 5 hits a round. Which means you are already internal in 1 rd and destroyed in round 2.

Increase, the Corsair to a larger ship and the space combat sequence gets UGLY in a hurry.

A ship with 12 turrets is going to absolutely obliterate it

And that’s the way it should be ! If your puny 200dton free trader is willing to face a 1.000dton spacecraft (actually your 12 turrets imply at least 1.200dtons…) designed for combat he is a daring captain indeed.
We are obviously having a complete different approach to this situation. You see the Falcon surrounded by a multitude TIE-fighters and that Star Destroyer… and survive… well, that’s Space Opera… for me Traveller is not Space Opera, and thus the Falcon would have been obliterated quite quickly. Nothing wrong in playing Space Opera with the Traveller rules… but you will have to tweak a couple of rules there, right ?

Definitely would need tweaking. Facing a ship in combat would be suicide, but as is any attempt to run for your life is also suicide. You have no choice but to surrender, as surviving more than 2 rounds is unlikely at best, espically if they launch support fighters. The fun and suspense of running for your life is classic for smugglers but doesn't seem a viable option in Traveller by the core rules.

I think some of the issue may be the differences in scale/capabilities of ships from other systems being carried forward to Traveller.
Fighters = fast & maunverability
Freights/Trader ships = wide range, but decent speed/manuverability possible
Larger ships = typically slower boats but can military vessels are faster; near zero manuverability in relation to smaller craft; but vary against ships of the same scale.
If that concept can be adapted it would make things more interesting in my mind.

If you have 3 missiles fired at the same time chasing your ship do you only get to Dodge 1 missile

You kindly forget point defence and – in case of smart missiles – EW. Even so, I did suggest that if it’s a flight of missiles fired from the same turret or bay a single dodge wil ldo the job (spend one point of thrust, do one pilot roll, if successful apply DM-2 to all missiles).

Forgive the vagueness. 3 turrets from one ship each shooting 1 missile in a single round at an identical time. Hypothetical, not the current rules. It just seems odd that when 3 missiles following pretty much the same flight plan chasing a dodging ship require 3 different dodges.

 

[Denalor]

The new Battlestar Galactica is a better model for space combat

You know, I have to wait for the series because I'm German. I have just finished Part 4 of the third series and I'm really eagerly waiting for the next ones... becasue I simply like the series a lot (but I would still have prefered a continuation of Fire Fly... sigh)

High Guard doesn't help much. Most of the expansion deals with "barrages" from larger ships. From the skimming I did on a friend's book it doesn't do much for small ship combat.

Yeah, I'm afraid that's what can be expected. Guess I'll buy it anway

...as this was a "house rule" discussion...

Actually I saw it as a "Rules Clarification" discussion, but I'd say that is actually the same

...how "Help line up a shot" works...

Ouch, you're opening Pandora's Box here . Gee, you hit the bull's eye there. This needs some serious pondering...

It just seems odd that when 3 missiles following pretty much the same flight plan chasing a dodging ship require 3 different dodges.

Yup, I do agree... but that's the result of the basic assumption "1 dodge = evade fire from one turret" and applying this rule to the missiles, too.

Anyway, SPACE MASTER has a really, really good rule for that fighter vs battleship issue. In SM you sort of chose the size of the weapon installed (ranging from smallish point defense systems to huge spinal mounts) and relate it to the available thrust (g's) of the opponent vessel.
Thus, that massive spinal mount can only track (and thus fire at) big ships (low thrust/manoeuvreability) but is unable to track the small fighter (high thrust/manoeuvreability).
Thus that massive Battlestar can shoot away at the Cylon Base Ships with huge weapons but cannot track the small Cylon fighters, which is why the Battelstar needs fighters, too. By the way: obviously the missiles employed by both Cylons and the Galactica are also much, much effective than the basic missile of Traveller.
It the same with Star Wars. The biggies of the Death Star cannot track the small X-wings, so they need Tie-fighters to shoot them down.
In Traveller I will not have bay weapons shooting at anything smaller than 50dtons... but that's a house rule indeed.

Unfortunately, I just realised tha tmy example above is wrong.
My example is

1) Ship A
Move, Combat, Ship Action
2) Ship B
Move, Combat, Ship Action

But actually it must be (page 146)
1) Move
Ship A, Ship B
2) Combat
Ship A, Ship B
3) Ship Action
Ship A, Ship B

Funny that no-one commented on that... I'd say no-one actually read through the combat :lol: ... all that trouble for nothing :evil:
Anyway, I won't bother to adapt the example yet... perhaps at another time :wink:

Cheers !