Software I'd like to see
- Thread starter Somebody
- Start date
Well, I wrote a pretty complete implementation of MGT world generation today in Ruby. It'll generate any number of worlds, implements the Space Opera and/or Hard SF optional rules, and will also produce subsector listings. It also generates names for the planets, and the population number (randomly generated within the limits of the UPP digit)
Sample output:
I need to add temperature scale generation, but that's about it. Anybody wants it, just PM me. By default it uses the dictionary file on unix systems, searching for nouns, and splices them to produce new words - I want to add a genuine word generation function to it too though.
I"ve generated literally tens of thousands of worlds using this today, and it shows up a few oddities in the MGT world gen system - most notably that you can have ridiculously large populations on tiny worlds, with no impact on tech level. I think I'll add some extra optional rules to add a negative DM for population if the world is very small, and the opposite if it's super-habitable, like a garden world.
Sample output:
Code:
0101 Anamter B18B667-6 N S T NI Ri [ 4M]
0102
0103
0104 Guiacoda E372754-3 Lt [ 81M]
0105
0106 Sipuncpan D679344-3 S Lo Lt [3862 ]
0107
0108 Venroa D1A5ACE-8 Fl Hi [ 33B]
0109
0110 Siriceottine C4A3544-8 P Fl NI [ 992K]
0201 Shrovphorus C681678-6 NI Ri [ 3M]
0202 Physophaga C642666-8 S C NI Po [ 3M]
0203 Nickiones C813530-8 S IC NI [ 880K]
0204
0205
0206
0207 Deuteryld B266A9A-9 N T Hi [ 16B]
0208
0209 Squahve D836777-5 S P Lt [ 52M]
0210 Chdina B5409DC-7 T De Hi In Po [ 9B]
0301
0302
0303 Galliophora D50078B-8 Na Va [ 28M]
0304
0305
0306 Percolium E605697-8 IC NI Va [ 3M]
0307
0308
0309 Clethidae B57A000-0 S Ba Lt Wa [ 0]
0310 Phillen E77B88A-6 [ 749M]
0401 Rumesidaceae C512326-8 S IC Lo [8111 ]
0402
0403
0404
0405 Colt B363554-9 N S NI [ 682K]
0406
0407
0408 Oryzoinidae B621358-9 N T C Lo Po [6031 ]
0409
0410
0501 Gaetric D6B698B-9 S Fl Hi [ 2B]
0502 Ismaeiput C124312-7 R P Lo [9327 ]
0503 Menscury B831436-5 N T Lt NI Po [ 87K]
0504
0505 Aplacomino EA00122-8 Lo Va [ 49 ]
0506
0507 Protogenea D41059D-8 NI [ 245K]
0508 Mishikhwadil B392611-6 N C NI [ 2M]
0509 Spondylerism C773269-5 S R P Lo Lt [ 424 ]
0510
0601 Plasmodimbura C9788B10-4 Ga Lt [ 499M]
0602 Urry C5AA158-8 Fl Lo Wa [ 58 ]
0603 Ubiquiochelys C637733-5 Lt [ 80M]
0604 Melolongism C461530-7 S R NI [ 450K]
0605 Casuarutal C1A1265-8 S Fl Lo [ 724 ]
0606 Nasicnian D5408AC-4 S De Lt Po [ 812M]
0607 Tobacterium B357653-8 S R T Ag NI [ 9M]
0608
0609 Belgombrian DA78958-4 Ga Hi In Lt [ 1B]
0610 Rupiana C400201-8 S C Lo Va [ 906 ]
0701 Isidtherium C935576-8 S NI [ 118K]
0702
0703 Patophora C3A679B-8 S T Fl [ 44M]
0704
0705
0706
0707 Bahtidor D170AEE-3 S De Hi In Lt [ 78B]
0708 Mobussa C9C8410-A Fl NI [ 77K]
0709 Trdetus C5B3266-9 Fl Lo [ 648 ]
0710
0801 Protoccera D49A899-3 S Lt Wa [ 717M]
0802
0803
0804 Artinyja CAC6520-A S Fl NI [ 159K]
0805
0806 Sirennca C536321-5 C P Lo Lt [2649 ]
0807
0808
0809
0810I need to add temperature scale generation, but that's about it. Anybody wants it, just PM me. By default it uses the dictionary file on unix systems, searching for nouns, and splices them to produce new words - I want to add a genuine word generation function to it too though.
I"ve generated literally tens of thousands of worlds using this today, and it shows up a few oddities in the MGT world gen system - most notably that you can have ridiculously large populations on tiny worlds, with no impact on tech level. I think I'll add some extra optional rules to add a negative DM for population if the world is very small, and the opposite if it's super-habitable, like a garden world.
GypsyComet
Emperor Mongoose
Gee4orce said:
Careful with that last one, as the characteristics of "super habitable" are also the characteristics of the "Rich" tradecode. Too much of a bump in population will bump a world right out of Rich, and getting above "A" population also starts to strain the reality of habitable.
A real world example might be useful: A population of 'B' on Earth is the equivalent of modern day, but every person has 100 friends that weren't here yesterday, don't overlap with anyone else's new friends, and all of whom may need to stay in your living room...
GypsyComet
Emperor Mongoose
Paladin said:
The guts of worldgen are not that complex if the language you are using behaves in expected ways. I've been hacking on Chipmunk Basic for a sector generator this past week, and the foibles of the interpreter have been the major time killer. I'm up through bases already, with output to file already dealt with (using MT sector format), and that's maybe 12 hours total. Maybe. This is old school Basic programming, though. The only input I'm asking for currently is the name of the output file...
GypsyComet said:
Yeah - the point is the rules can, as it stands, generate pops of A or or B on world sized 4 or even less - that really stretches credibility, especially when the TL is low too. When you can quickly generate thousands of worlds you see these patterns jumping out.
Another oddity is the generally low tech levels that are generated - Traveller is a SF game, yet the typical world generated is not much higher tech than Earth today, and TL 5 an 6 are very common.
Personally I think MTU will be using 2d6 + dms for TL....
I've been polishing my Ruby world generator. It now generates entire sectors if you like, or just a single subsector, or just a selection of worlds if that's what you want. I now produces nice subsector maps too, using Rmagick.
I supports all the optional rules from the main rulebook too, and calculates population figures (in the square brackets) and temperature of the world. It also works out Red and Amber travel zone codes too (although the frequency needs a little tweak). All names are generated randomly too, some using Vilanii generation tables, and other splicing English proper-nouns.
Here's a snippet of output for one subsector, build with the base MGT rules, plus the map for that subsector:
(formatting's a bit screwed here)
Click for larger size, but even this is reduced from the 300dpi original (good quality for printing)
Still to do: symbols for bases. I think I'll leave X-boat routes as a manual task for the referee to add though.
Because of the licence restrictions about producing software, I can't make this freely available, but if you would like a copy of the script them please just private message me and I'll be glad to send you it. And if you're from Mongoose offering me wads of cash for this, I'm all ears
I supports all the optional rules from the main rulebook too, and calculates population figures (in the square brackets) and temperature of the world. It also works out Red and Amber travel zone codes too (although the frequency needs a little tweak). All names are generated randomly too, some using Vilanii generation tables, and other splicing English proper-nouns.
Here's a snippet of output for one subsector, build with the base MGT rules, plus the map for that subsector:
Code:
Subsector J:
Kistrum Subsector
0101 Mustianist D639440-5 S Lt NI A [ 29K] Cold -10C Representative Democracy , Remnant
0106 Prionelia C586251-7 S Ga Lo [ 881 ] Roasting 128C Feudal Technocracy , Recovering
0109 Pholayllaceae C200300-8 C Lo Va A [6433 ] Hot 60C None , Unusual Custom: Lifecycle
0201 Sigouin D464795-5 S Ag Lt [ 14M] Frozen -86C Impersonal Bureaucracy , Unusual Custom: Nobility
0202 Scician D667544-5 S Ag Ga Lt NI [ 753K] Cold -15C Representative Democracy , Degenerate
0203 Pentctici C86488B-8 S Ga Ri [ 981M] Temperate 20C Civil Service Bureaucracy , Ritualised
0205 Corinthidae C401643-8 IC Na NI Va [ 4M] Frozen -74C Representative Democracy , Unusual Custom: Nobility
0206 Pygobrle C500544-8 S NI Va [ 834K] Temperate 4C Representative Democracy , Unusual Custom: Social Standing
0301 Geneille E464698-6 Ag NI Ri [ 6M] Temperate 6C Impersonal Bureaucracy , Nexus
0308 Antibuoia D567366-6 Ga Lo [8771 ] Temperate 10C Captive Government , Progressive(formatting's a bit screwed here)
Click for larger size, but even this is reduced from the 300dpi original (good quality for printing)
Still to do: symbols for bases. I think I'll leave X-boat routes as a manual task for the referee to add though.
Because of the licence restrictions about producing software, I can't make this freely available, but if you would like a copy of the script them please just private message me and I'll be glad to send you it. And if you're from Mongoose offering me wads of cash for this, I'm all ears
Ironically, I made a suite of Traveller software in high school back in 1982.
Original plan was one program, but it was too large for the memory of the computer. Had to break it down into 3 parts.
1>Character generator and equipment purchase.
2>Subsector and world generation with trade details.
3>World specific encounter tables with creature stats/generation.
It was my semester project, got an A.
The other semester project was a title page drawing program that would output the picture as usable/importable code. It also got an A.
(If you don't know why someone would need a tool like that, back then you couldn't just import a picture, you had to code the pixels on the screen.)
Ancient history.
Hope to see the results of all your attempts soon. I don't think I'm going to spend the time on this project, I've got some others to do still.
Original plan was one program, but it was too large for the memory of the computer. Had to break it down into 3 parts.
1>Character generator and equipment purchase.
2>Subsector and world generation with trade details.
3>World specific encounter tables with creature stats/generation.
It was my semester project, got an A.
The other semester project was a title page drawing program that would output the picture as usable/importable code. It also got an A.
(If you don't know why someone would need a tool like that, back then you couldn't just import a picture, you had to code the pixels on the screen.)
Ancient history.
Hope to see the results of all your attempts soon. I don't think I'm going to spend the time on this project, I've got some others to do still.
BenGunn said:
What do you mean by expandable framework? IMHO one goal of a character generation tool would need to be the ability to design your own careers within the application, and based on that concept I think your estimates are probably reasonable. Making it extensible in that way wouldn't make the chargen engine more complex, but would considerably complicate the UI design as you'd essentially need two UIs, one for character generation and one for career design.
Again purely implementing the world generation system in code is a matter of a few days work, but graphics generation and world customizability would take a bit longer. I'd also want to be able to adjust the world generation parameters within the application to customize it for a campaign setting so again that's more work because you can't hard-code the design sequence and also need a customization UI.
A space combat tool would be useful, not a full game but a 'calculator'.
I think it would be more complex than character generation. High Guard actually complicates things more that it at first seems. The additional options for fuel types, weapon limits and hull sections in capital ships, and damage chart creation add requirements for whole chunks of functionality not required by the TMB system. All doable, but a significant addition of complexity over the core system. Still, 40 days is about 2 months full-time work and that should be enough to come up with a decent application.
I've given this area a lot of thought and overall I agree with your conclusions. The key point in my mind is that a freeware/home grown set of tools could be created quite quickly with basic functionality, but a professional grade set of tools would need to offer a lot more in terms of customisability and features.
Simon Hibbs
BenGunn said:
Mongoose are positioning Traveller as a generic game system, and plan to publish a number of settings for it. They actively suggest and encourage variants, so under those circumstances what counts as official is hardly set in stone.
A commercial application would only sell based on it's utility to it's customers, and a lot of Traveller GMs use variants rules so I believe that at least some customizability would be a vital feature to secure commercial success in the long term. Also as supplements come out with new careers, ship design options and world creation rules you'll need to have a way to add those to the product, so you'll need it to be customizable. You could do it all through hard-coding add-ons but in the long term that would probably turn out to be more work.
I think there would still be a market for hard coded applications, and for example an application that started hard coded but then added customization features in later releases might be an optimal strategy. That way you can get to market more quickly, capturing the market for a more limited product sooner and then grow the market by adding value over the life cycle of the product.
Simon Hibbs
Well, I'm nearing completion of v1 of my own traveller utility written in Excel. At the moment, it can:
- Generate worlds, inc. travel zones (but not name them - would love to know more about what you've done here GeeForce!) (not yet coded for alternative worldgen rules)
- Generate subsectors and map them (ugly Excel-based map at the moment which certainly needs tweaking)
- Generate characters, inc. mishaps, events and fiddly mustering out benefits, for Core Rulebook careers (not yet done Psionic testing, Anagathics or bonus skills for Connections and Group Packages. Also need to add function for fully random characters for NPC generation)
Future plans could include rewriting all this for OpenOffice, adding Trade and Shipbuilding, possibly splitting it off into separate spreadsheets for convenience... but more likely will involve getting it to 95% complete and then finding a sparkly new "project" that piques my interest more
- Generate worlds, inc. travel zones (but not name them - would love to know more about what you've done here GeeForce!) (not yet coded for alternative worldgen rules)
- Generate subsectors and map them (ugly Excel-based map at the moment which certainly needs tweaking)
- Generate characters, inc. mishaps, events and fiddly mustering out benefits, for Core Rulebook careers (not yet done Psionic testing, Anagathics or bonus skills for Connections and Group Packages. Also need to add function for fully random characters for NPC generation)
Future plans could include rewriting all this for OpenOffice, adding Trade and Shipbuilding, possibly splitting it off into separate spreadsheets for convenience... but more likely will involve getting it to 95% complete and then finding a sparkly new "project" that piques my interest more
Here take a look at this.
This is something made for a game i was running. It doesnt have everything OP was asking for but its what ive been using
This is something made for a game i was running. It doesnt have everything OP was asking for but its what ive been using
