Ship Design Philosophy

[Condottiere]

Starships: Or Skipships

210. At acceleration factor one, the Freetater class cannot outrun anything.

211. And barely protected at armour factor two.

212. There's nothing really, except goodwill towards Solomani, that would prevent someone from trying to pirate it.

213. It's not just a question of preventing damage, like sandcasting and point defence weapon systems.

214. Nor duelling lasers.

215. It has to be something that really hurts, like a wasp's sting, and might disable the raider before he closes, or cause too much damage to bother with the Freetater.

216. Civilian authorities aren't likely to tolerate a civilian spaceship with really energetic energy weapon systems, like particle accelerators nor fusion guns.

217. the mining laser drill is notoriously short ranged and inaccurate against moving targets.

218. Rumour is that missiles are going to get more punch in the next High Guard reprint.

219. But since we're not there yet, we'll have to ignore that rumour.

 

[Condottiere]

Starships: Or Skipships

220. Authorities are likely to permit missile launchers on spaceships on sufferance, considering it doesn't really take much to switch out a standard for a nuclear variant.

221. Also, smart ordnance tends to be expensive.

222. Vertical launch system, or in our case, missile pack, might be a simple solution.

223. Though I don't believe it's been mentioned, yet, in Mongoose Second.

224. Though, more precisely, replace them missiles with torpedoes.

225. Technological level fourteen, factor fifteen acceleration advanced torpedoes.

226. The high technological level compensates for the lack of one in either ship construction or tactical computer programmes.

227. The speed ensures that the pirate can't run.

228. The high damage potential could knock out the corsair.

229. And since it's a sealed launcher, there's an ambiguity as to what's in there.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

1. Making my way through the tutorial missions.

2. So far, I tend to design warships to overcome presented by, or create them for, the opposing artificial intelligence in the scenario.

3. Optimization within the virtual space, as opposed the actual universe, creates some really weird gun layouts.

4. You could place wing quadruple turrets side by side in front, a pair behind on barbettes, and that I suppose would be that variant of a spinal mount.

5. Operational and strategic considerations are sidelined in the tutorials, and I suppose on the one off battles.

6. Sounds like Trillion Credit Squadron.

7. Maybe someone should have a go at trying to develop and sell that as a computer game.

8. I sort of starting to develop a great deal of respect for the interwar Royal Navy, considering the limitations they were operating under, and what they managed to squeeze into the arms limitation treaties.

9. And out of.

 

[Condottiere]

Starships: Or Skipships

230. you could assume that if the Harrier had enough space, you could have embedded three torpedo cradles for the hardpoint.

231. Presumably, you might have been able to embed one torpedo cradle per firmpoint.

232. The point is, or would be, that you can reload the cradles internally, if you add on the reloading volume and equipment.

233. That point is important to remember, since we now get to the vertical launch system option.

234. You could internalize a torpedo grapple.

235. In theory, it costs but takes up no volume.

236. A grapple can hold two torpedoes each.

237. Despite taking up no tonnage externally, you would need to allocate enough for the torpedoes, at least, internally.

238. The hardpointed variant can hold four.

239. Either variant, must be reloaded externally.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Armaments and Torpedoes In The Expanse | The Expanse Lore

There are many types of weapons used in space combat within The Expanse but none are as prominent or as historically significant as the Torpedo. Today we will take a look at how Torpedoes(or missiles) are deployed and utilized within The Expanse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CA_v2bMxcTw

 

[Condottiere]

Starwarships: MCRN Light Cruiser (Pella) Ship Breakdown - The Expanse

One of the finest ship designs in the Expanse. The MCRN Light Cruiser. I hope this video does it justice

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3i9hlNtvgHg


1. Surprisingly clean.

2. The disguise is an interesting option.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

10. Deciding to have a go at campaign mode starting from the late Victorian era.

11. Since you'll move up the tech tree, and preferring to have a one design fits all, that leverages all aspects including cost.

12. Also, too lazy to make a range of designs that obviously are going to be discarded at some later point.

13. I had a theory of strapping the largest gun on the smallest possible hull, which seems like a analogue to a spinal mount, except on movable turret.

14. I thought I be rather original and dub it the Unicorn class.

15. When I first started reading Honor Harrington, I thought what they should have done was to place a turntable at either end in the hammerheads, and place one to five grazers on that platform, which means only one set of guns for either broadside, and a rather nasty surprise to anyone hoping to tailgate you.

16. In theory, you could embed the spinal mount in a rather large hamster cage (along the axis), and shoot at an angle, which is my assumption as to how deep site meson guns aim.

17. Coming back to late Victorian technology, the Japanese appear to have had the same idea, or maybe the French had, and mounted a twelve and a halver in front of the four kilotonne Matsushima class.

18. It had a reload rate of thirty minutes, and reportedly, destabilized the ship.

19. Apparently, Ultimate Admirals allows a twin turret eleven incher on both ends of an three and a half kilotonne armoured cruiser, with a tad over one and a half minute reloading rate.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

20. Turns out that four twelve inchers are bane of battleships, not to mention fellow armoured cruisers.

21. Default armour protection tends one to maintain a certain stand off distance, close enough that four big guns can overwhelm the enemy with shells, far enough away that the secondary armament don't factor in for the return fire.

22. Unfortunately, the slow speed, sacrificed for the armament, made the upgunned armour cruisers vulnerable to torpedo armed torpedo boats and protected cruisers.

23. So I restarted the campaign, and reconfigged the all around cruiser, closer to the Unicorn class universal cruiser.

24. So I kept the forward twin turret of twelve inchers, and replaced the rear one with a twin six incher, which should be able to deal with the small fry.

25. Added a couple of underwater torpedo tubes, so that when I make a close pass by of the enemy, a torpedo will likely puncture it's guts.

26. To ensure that, squeezed out a bit more pony power from the engines, and to balance the hull, added a pair of small gns to the rear.

27. So far, has a better success rate regarding light cruisers and torpedo boats, while the torpedo makes up for losing half the firepower.

28. The armoured cruisers are also five times cheaper than a battleship.

29. Had a go at superfiring the second turret in front, but the bridge got in the way.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

30. In another game, I designed the cheapest possible cruiser, and packed it with casemated six inchers, and gave it a reasonable speed and extended range, which made it an almost perfect colonial cruiser.

31. That didn't really work in Ultimate Admiral.

32. So I thought I try and make an even cheaper version of my conceptualized armoured cruiser, for about half the cost.

33. Also, I wanted a better patrol ship than the rather fragile torpedo boat, torpedo boat being about seven or eight times cheaper than the armoured cruiser.

34. Would have preferred to give the crew spacious quarters, but the tonnage squeeze kept it to standard.

35. Also, minimal bulkheads.

36. Not surprising, the light cruisers sank pretty fast once holed.

37. The two single seven inchers didn't make much of a contribution.

38. So I increased the tonnage by a quarter, speed by a knot, the range to maximum, and the price ballooned by forty percent, but still found lacking in combat.

39. At this stage of the game, not that suitable.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

40. I guess what I was trying to achieve was a large destroyer analogue, which haven't been invented yet.

41. By the time of the Great Patriotic War, destroyers had grown to twenty five hundred tonnes, and outside of the installed equipment, the hull and engineering would have to be cheaper than a light cruiser's, pound for pound.

42. In a way, you want to use presence to power project into the far reaches of Empire, and beyond, into technologically inferior regions.

43. In a way, it would be sort of a bluff.

44. The unprotected cruisers represent a power not actually present, but any conflict with them would invite intervention from the strategic reserve elements that actually were well protected and could power project.

45. During peacetime, it may be a question of the best use of resources to achieve the results desired.

46. The assets deployed would have to be considered expendable, since it doesn't take much to mission kill them.

47. The ratio, in terms of cost, of one to four and below is about right.

48. The armoured cruisers are considered expendable, in the sense that you maintain large numbers of them, and in an attrional contest, you're going to win.

49. So in those terms, the resulting light cruisers aren't worth it.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

50. In Traveller terms, for the Confederation Navy, there would be a clear separation between it's capital assets, and everything below that.

51. Until last year, the Mongoose version of the modern order of battle demonstrated a cruiser gap, starting from two kilotonnes till about two hundred kilotonnes.

52. The patrol ships would imprint the impression of a presence of the Confederation on the dirtside dwellers below and their respective authorities, being armed enough to be taken seriously, and take care of themselves in most situations.

53. In wartime, even in the likely second line roles, they would need to have enough capabilities to at least be able to perform their missions successfully.

54. So in the meantime, will have to be satisfied with the two hundred tonne torpedo boat.

55. Maxed out the range, apparently three and a half kilokilometres, I guess megametres.

56. Gave it a decent thirty two plus knot speed, which appears to be fast enough to deliver the payload in tact to the unappreciative target audience.

57. Optimistically, it has a reload torpedo, and the lightest possible two incher, which in theory, should be a threat to other unprotected torpedo boats.

58. To round it off, minimum bulkheads, and cramped quarters.

59. I guess you could have no staterooms, and then utilize the volume of now empty fuel tanks for the next week or so, during and after transition, the issue being how to account for life support.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

60. Switchable fuel/cargo containers can carry fuel or cargo as needed, although a whole container must be used for one or the other. Swapping from fuel tankage to cargo space requires little more than flushing out the tanks to ensure no liquid hydrogen remains, then loading them up with cargo as needed.

61. Equipment to do this represents most of the cost of a container that otherwise uses standard hull and components like any other part of a ship. Each tonne of capacity in a cargo/fuel container requires one twentieth of a tonne of additional equipment and costs five kiloschmuckers per tonne.

62. The key phrase might be requires little more than flushing out the tanks to ensure no liquid hydrogen remains, which implies not much time is spent on that.

63. So, the moment you fall through the rabbit hole, you send in the mechanic to purge the now empty fuel tank of any lingering hydrogen, and start setting up the camp beds and sleeping bags.

64. As mentioned before, the real issue is how to provide the missing life support.

65. Freshers are relatively easy to have pre installed.

66. If not, there's always a Porta Potty.

67. You can use the now available volume for anything, including a squash court.

68. The artificial intelligence, or the game developers, appear to have come up with what they suppose is the optimum light cruiser configuration.

69. That's twenty five hundred tonne hull with three ranked forward single turret five inchers, and another two pairs along the side.

 

[Condottiere]

Skipship: (Almost) Freetater


. Technological level
.. nine

. Hull
.. two hundred tonnes
.. planetoid
... nickel iron
... wastage
.... twenty percent
... armour
.... organic
.... factor
..... two
... streamlined
.... non
... light
... hull points
.... forty six
.. total cost
... 600 kilostarbux

. Bridge
.. dual cockpit
... tonnage
.... two and a half tonnes
... cost
.... fifteen kilostarbux
.. specialist control centre
... jumping
... tonnage
.... six tonnes
... dice modifier
.... plus one
... cost
.... half a megastarbux
... total tonnage
.... eight and a half tonnes
.. total cost
... 515 kilostarbux

. Computer
.. bandwidth
... five
.. cost
... thirty kilostarbux
.. software
... manoeuvre
.... factor
..... zero
.... cost
..... free
... library
.... factor
..... zero
.... cost
..... free
... jump control
.... factor
..... one
.... cost
..... one hundred kilostarbux
.. total cost
... 130 kilostarbux

. Sensors
.. basic
... lidar
... radar
... dice modifier
.... minus four
... tonnage
.... zero tonnes
... power input
.... zero power points
.. total cost
... free

. Engineering
.. jump drive
... budget
.... energy inefficient
... power input
.... twenty six power points
... tonnage
.... ten tonnes
... cost
.... eleven and a quarter megastarbux
.. manoeuvre drive
... budget
.... energy inefficient
... power input
.... twenty six power points
... tonnage
.... two tonnes
... cost
.... three megastarbux
.. power plant
... early fusion
... budget
.... increased size
... cost
.... one and seven eighths of a megastarbux
... solar panelling
.... tonnage
..... five hundred kilogrammes
.... cost
..... fifty kilostarbux
... fuel consumption
.... default
..... half a tonne in four weeks
.... modified
..... half a tonne in sixteen weeks
.... cost
.....
... power output
...... forty power points
... solar panelling
.... technological level (default)
..... early fusion reactor
..... technological level eight
.... power output
..... basic systems
...... forty power points
..... manoeuvre drive factor one (default)
...... twenty power points
.... tonnage
..... six hundred kilogrammes
.... cost
..... sixty kilostarbux
.. fuel
... tonnage
.... forty and a half tonnes
.. total tonnage
... fifty eight and three fifths of a tonne
.. total cost
... 1.925 megastarbux

. Fuel
.. tonnage
... twenty one
.. cost
... free
.. fuel/cargo containers
... one
.... tonnage
..... twenty
... flushing equipment
.... tonnage
..... one tenth of a tonne
.... cost
..... ten kilostarbux
..


. Armaments

. Accommodations
.. staterooms
.. common areas
.. airlocks
.. cargo hatches

. Additional systems
.. fuel processor
... twenty tonnes per day
.... one power point
... tonnage
.... one tonne
... cost
.... fifty kilostarbux

. Cargo
.. tonnage

160-8.5-58.6-1-20= 71.9

work in progress

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

70. So I had a go at duplicating that, and may have figured out a more efficient gun layout that allows greater coverage.

71. While six minutes does allow some amount of jinking about in Traveller space combat, to align all, if not mosr, weapon systems against a particular target.

72. Doing that in six seconds would definitely need to indicate blindspots, so that only the weapon systems directly pointed at te target can be utilized.

73. You can use the opportunity during that and each subsequent six seconds to manoeuvre the spaceship to align the desired weapon systems with the target.

74. But the problem with a twenty five hundred tonne light cruiser is it's inability to soak up damage.

75. That's why, in terms of costs, you get more with a thirty five hundred tonne armoured cruiser, or, so far, with a two hundred tonne torpedo boat.

76. I don't really expect this torpedo boat template to survive contact with the enemy, just stay afloat long enough to deliver one torpedo, hence why only one reload, though given the option, would have eliminated that as well.

77. There's a similarity to Traveller analogues with either two firmpoints, or two hardpoints.

78. Though if not an interstellar patrol ship, that would be a thirty five tonne plus smallcraft with a torpedo grapple and a beam laser.

79. Protection would be sacrificed in favour of high acceleration and afterburner fuel tankage.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

80. I may have drawn out the war too long, in order to see what happens to the tech tree and increasing the size of the drydocks.

81. So there was an Inglorious Revolution, and I got sacked as First Lord.

82. It may not have helped that I busted the naval budget twice.

83. In the meantime, I tried to Nelson the armoured cruiser design.

84. Managed to place both towers and the funnel in the rear.

85. Looks like the maximum calibre is eleven inches for armoured cruisers, so far.

86. Couldn't superfire another eleven incher twin turret on the bridge.

87. Surprisingly, did get two wing six inch twin turrets there.

88. Towards the end of the war, the armoured cruisers started suffering from the Hood syndrome, so maybe the Germans got better shells?

89. Will have to see if the proto Nelsons work out better.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

90. Tried two pairs of wing six inch twin turrets in front

91. While the rate of fire was (relatively) impressive, the fact that you need to get closer, and the apparent lack of a knock out punch like that of an eleven incher seems a deficit.

92. Decided it may be more efficient just to have one six inch twin turret superfiring, and invest the rest of the tonnage in more protection and speed.

93. Had a go at off setting the wing turrets, but it's not really worth it and upset the balance.

94. The most famous example appears to be the Invincible class of dreadnought armoured cruiser.

95. While it looks good on paper, you really have to be desperate to either shoot crossdeck, or front or back, with the off set wing turrets.

96. Blast effect that close to the superstructure (and crew) isn't healthy.

97. Since we don't have D'deridex class configurations, with a big hole in the middle, not really an issue with us.

98. We could attach a weapon system to one or more hamster cages, to more easily align the weapon system in the direction of the target.

99. Hamster cages need to be the actual minimum tonnage in order to have one or more firmpoits and/or hardpoints, but can be a lot smaller, since they don't need to create gravity.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

100. Add a docking clamp and an airlock.

101. The fact that the hamster cage can rotate along the hull allows them to easily position themselves along the approach path of an intercepting spacecraft.

102. This should speed up the time required for docking.

103. If the intercepting spacecraft has a hamster caged docking clamp of it's own, docking could be down to six minutes, once matching course and velocity is achieved.

104. They could also act as a Roman corvus.

105. The intercepting spacecraft matches velocity and course, and the hamster cage hammers down with a docking clamp and a breaching tube.

106. I suppose it could also be used as a trebuchet.

107. Modern form of keelhauling, by accelerating rotation.

108. I noticed if I don't pay for research and maybe minimize training the manpower pool, I might be able to squeeze out enough money for a more extensive range of battleships.

109. Should be interesting if can squeeze in three twelve inch twin turrets.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

110. That didn't work out on a a ten and a half kilotonne British ironclad.

111. Back to the thirty five hundred tonne armoured cruiser.

112. This time a more extensive armament range to deal with a wider range of warships types.

113. Back and front eleven inch twin turrets, underwater torpedo tubes, and as many two inch secondary guns as can be fitted, as an anti torpedo boat solution.

114. In the rear, a pair of three inch casemated guns to balance off the front.

115. In theory, having a large number of different weapon types tends to be useful.

116. In practice, you'd only install those onto warships that are more or less expendable, which includes heavy cruisers.

117. In peacetime, it doesn't really matter, and so you can house an aviation capability, including catapults, cranes, fuel, floatplanes, and stores.

118. But for a line of battle ship, you'd want to eliminate possible fire hazards and points of vulnerability, like aforesaid aviation fuel.

119. And torpedoes, whether on deck or underwater.

 

[Condottiere]

Spacecraft: The Artemis Program

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_jFN26_1A8


1. Orion capsule.

2. Heat shield.

3. High energy particles.

4. Apollo module fir three crewmembers in six and one fifth cubic metres.

5. Auto docking system.

6. Seven hundred times greater radiation exposure.

7. Lead terrible at shielding highly charge particles.

8. Low zee materials, such as hydrogen, which coincidentally, we tend to flood our interiors with.

9. Lithium aluminum alloy hull, super light, stronger than titanium, highly elastic, excellent at absorbing high energy particles.

A. Composite shielding, heaviest atoms external, lightest atoms internal.

B. Protective clothing.

C. Space weather.

D. Siege mentality.

E. It's coarse, and rough, and irritating, and it gets everywhere.

 

[Condottiere]

Spaceships: Ship Design Philosophy and Ultimate Admiral Dreadnoughts

120. I think Traveller had it correct that you need specialized starwarships.

121. While everyone may take a rather sceptical view of the Imperial class star destroyers, outside of the lack of acceleration, they may actually have had it correct with a single aerospace group of about seventy two TIE fighters, plus utility craft.

122. The reason would be the demonstrated effectiveness of fighters and bombers in the Star Wars universe.

123. The Tigress class is a luxurious exception, because if it's damaged, you could lose both a gun platform and a fleet carrier.

124. It may have been designed more for political and diplomatic effect.

125. Undoubtedly an impressive flagship, keeping the Tigresses together as a cohesive force, whether in a battle squadron of eight or four, depending on whatever the current definition is, is really a waste.

126. A step down would be the assault, strike and/or attack cruisers, which tend to include an aerospace group.

127. These matter a lot less, since they're likely meant to operate independently, and would need a more rounded set of capabilities.

128. Managed to move Edwardian era pre dreadnought campaign.

129. May actually have been the golden age of armoured cruisers, since I enlarged the original design of thirty five hundred tonne using the more or less same armament configuration, to a twelve kilotonne proto battle cruiser, increasing the speed from sixteen to twenty eight knots, and adding all the usual safety mechanisms then prevalent.