Scouts

[LtCmdr]

Hi,

I wanted to check that if I use the scout function to Jam two AD of torpedo's when my oppenent fires, are these two AD "lost" and require reloading or is it that they are just neutralised for this turn?

 

[Myrm]

So far as Im concerned, the weapon is fired - the scout channels don't represent preventing weapons firing, but ECM type effects that prevent them reaching target. The effect only operates 'when the weapon is fired' so the AD have to have fired to be selected for reduction.

As an aside, you cannot split a plasma torpedo, so even if you did try and say the 2AD werent fired and the rest were - then you'd prevent the entire plasma torpedo firing that round, or you would have to reload the rest of the AD to fire the plasma torpedo again as you cannot fire part of it.....and this gets horribly messy and is inconsistent with applying a 'those AD are not fired' house-rule with torps operating differently to other reloadable weapons eg Photon Torpedoes and any other split fire capable system. Rule Zero concepts suggest therefore that even if you were to find some textual loophole that that said loophole be considered unuseable due to messiness.

Bottom line, for an AD to be eligible it needs to have been fired, necessitating reloading.

 

[billclo]

I also would go with the weapon has to be fired before reducing it by 2 AD. Consider it jamming that caused the torpedo to either miss, or have a near miss instead of a direct impact on the target.

 

[scoutdad]

Third times a charm.
The weapons are fired / launched. All the scout does is decrease the likelihood of an impact.

So, short answer is, yes they are "lost" and will require reloading.

 

[LtCmdr]

Much appreciated everyone, cheers

 

[McKinstry]

I'm unclear on the timing. If the attacker fires first in the shooting phase, the scout doesn't get the chance to activate and jam. If the scout activates first and jams that specific ship, why wouldn't that ship simply choose not to fire?

I've never seen the timing of using the scout function explained and the rules don't seem to address when and how they are used, just what they do.

 

[Myrm]

I'm unclear on the timing. If the attacker fires first in the shooting phase, the scout doesn't get the chance to activate and jam. If the scout activates first and jams that specific ship, why wouldn't that ship simply choose not to fire?
I've never seen the timing of using the scout function explained and the rules don't seem to address when and how they are used, just what they do.

Yes, its not well described and certainly confused me. This has cropped up in a number of threads.
This is two of them and the most informative pair.
http://forum.mongoosepublishing.com/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=52164&hilit=scout
http://forum.mongoosepublishing.com/viewtopic.php?f=103&t=51654&hilit=scout

Seems to be declare during attack phase all channels at once...though whether that allows you to fire them off as a defensive thing in defensive fire is up in the air.

When the rules are written up properly this has to be clearly defined.

 

[McKinstry]

Seems to be declare during attack phase all channels at once...though whether that allows you to fire them off as a defensive thing in defensive fire is up in the air.

When the rules are written up properly this has to be clearly defined.

That is how I took the meaning as well however, if that is the case, unless the scout activates defensively out of sequence, any ship firing before the scout activates will be unaffected and any activating after the scout has jammed will simply choose not to fire thus preserving their plasma/photon load.

The simplest fix would make the scout trait equivalent to the escort trait if within LOS of the firing or defending ship ( as appropriate ) for jamming. Since the scout is a high value target, extending the escort trait to weapons isn't a big deal as preserving the scout is usually the best use for its' weapons.