Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
k. As for engineer 0, I did say that was how it worked.
Robot Skills and How the Robot Handbook Cheats on Designs
- Thread starter Terry Mixon
- Start date
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
There is a limit on the number of the skill 0 slots that a robot has. Eight for science and four for language (assuming I conceded that you could buy all specialties at skill 0, which I do not) exceeds it quite handily.
J. L. Brown
Emperor Mongoose
No, Skill/0 does not have a specialty
I think the Skill(all)/x entry is supposed to represent paying the usual 'Bandwidth for /x' for four (or eight) Specialties.
[Edit:] Core Rule Book Update 2022, p 58; getting Skill(Specialty)/1 DOES NOT GRANT Skill(Other-Specialties)/0. Instead, all tasks outside the specialty continue to be rolled at Skill/0. [/Edit]
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Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
Buying Science 0 with INT 15 would still get you Science (all) 3, right? That's what the passage I posted earlier said? If anything, that just reduces bandwidth requirements further, I don't see why this is a sticking point.
Again, you can install more level 0 skills, they just start requiring one bandwidth instead of zero.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
I can live with this, now that I know it exists.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
Okay, I'll concede that but I don't believe the Omega, as an example, had enough bandwidth. Now I need to go look at it again and make it fit in Mcr10.
J. L. Brown
Emperor Mongoose
But there is no Skill(Specialty)/0 to buy. Skill(Specialty)/x is always 1 or greater, and zero-bandwidth skill packages do not grant Skill/1.
So there does not appear to be a way to buy Science(Xenogenetics)/0, Science(Astrochemistry)/0, Science(Planetary Ecology)/0, Science(Psychohistory)/0, and then end up with Science(All)/0. Even if there were, it is not clear that Science(All)/0 would be upgradable at one higher TL and one more Bandwidth to Science(All)/1.
Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
Omega's got more than enough bandwidth, trust me on that. As for the rest - there's a 10% - 20% discount. Even up to 80%. Even then, it allows you to round off the price. Omega's fine.
Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
Could you explain to me why that matters here? Buy Science 0 and Language 0, you're off to the races.
J. L. Brown
Emperor Mongoose
Science/0 does not grant, require, nor allow any Specialties. Nor does Language/0. So the 'buy four Specialties to get (All)' deal cannot apply.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
I can barely buy enough bandwidth, but it can be done. The cost is too high, though, and I'm unconvinced they actually did this. I can make it work with a 35% discount.
I still have doubts about the 0 skills getting specialties.
I still have doubts about the 0 skills getting specialties.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
If I play with the skills, I can make it all legal if I reduce a few others. Now it's all paid for by the book.
Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
Then I refer you to the passage on page 76.
It's identical to any sophont with Science 0 - they can tackle all Science related skills with DM+0, plus their INT (or EDU) DM. Same for robots.
Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
Y'know just buying Science 0 and Language 0 makes it pretty cheap? Only needs +25 Bandwidth like that. I'll concede I was confused about that from the outset, but if anything it makes these designs more permissive, not less.
Bolted on the other bollocks - it's Cr9,360,430. I'd've rounded up to MCr10 too, though I'll admit I like round numbers too much to be unbiased.
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Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
I agree. That does make them more powerful in ways I hadn't counted on.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
Looks like I was out to lunch on all of this. Bollocks. I wasted a good rant.
Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
so just for the record could you confirm that i am indeed a most handsome and generous lover?
And to be fair, I didn't exactly help. A lot of the lark I was on earlier was me assuming it was Science (all) 4, not 3.
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J. L. Brown
Emperor Mongoose
I think you have the bolding wrong, and the rule in question is poorly written.
In this case, Science/0 goes to Science(single particular Specialty)/1+. The Robot still has Science/0 for particular tasks outside the chosen Specialty. Those checks may (often) be modified by attributes; and this still strikes me as pretty generous.
In this case the robot has purchased the (All) Specialty at /1+ by paying for Skill(Specialty)/1+ four or more times. A designer cannoy simply choose the (All) specialty as though it were exactly the same cost as all the other specialties.
In the first case a robot with Gun Combat(Slug)/3 with a +2 DEX modifier applied would have all the Gun Combat(Specialty) checks at 0+2, and Gun Combat(Slug)/5.
In the second case a Robot with Gun Combat(All)/3 with a +2 DEX modifier would have Gun Combat(all)/5 -- but it has paid more bandwidth,
[Edit:] Perfectly good rants wasted aside, I think we are pretty close together on this -- especially in light of the worked sheet above. Huzzah! [/Edit]
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Technetium 98
Cosmic Mongoose
... I bolded the relevant bit. Surely you realise you're being pedantic, right?
This is for the finalisation section - the summary of the robot, which is where the argument started. That's just to make it clear for the reader what the robot is meant to do - that's why it says or list (all).
And what about the third case, the one that's actually relevant here, where the robot purchases Gun Combat 0 with +2 DEX? A person could make all Gun Combat checks - Slug, Energy, whatever - at DM+2. So too could a robot.
Said robot could list Gun Combat (Slug) 2 if they only had slug weapons, so the designer could reasonably expect the player to only ever worry about its skill with Slug weapons, or it could list Gun Combat (all) 2. Either is permitted, either is correct.
Terry Mixon
Emperor Mongoose
You weren’t supposed to tell. Now I have to mention those, ah, mechanical assisted devices.
