Realistic Atmosphere Mixes

Charakan

Mongoose
Following on from the exceptionally positive feedback on my realistic taints thread I was hoping to ask some of the more scientifically minded members of the Traveller community for some realistic examples of exotic, corrosive and other none breathable atmosphere codes.

Your help as always is appreciated :) .
 
Non Breathable Atmospheres:

Exotic:
Nitrogen-Carbon Dioxide (primitive Earth)
Nitrogen-Methane (primitive Earth or Titan)
Carbon Dioxide (Mars and Venus)

Corrosive:
Chlorine (small %)
Flourine (very small %)

Insidious:
Chlorine (large %)
Flourine (small %)
Hydrogen (small %) - Needs to be a BIG world (Size A minimum)

Common inert gasses include:
Nitrogen
Carbon Dioxide
Helium (for large worlds)
Noble Gasses (like Argon)

EDG may have more info, but this is a start...
 
RTT's about right, the most common gases by far are going to be CO2 or Nitrogen, and maybe some sulphur compounds simply because those are what gets erupted from volcanoes and is heavy enough to stay around the planet over a long time. In colder atmospheres (i.e. the outer zone) you're more likely to find methane, ammonia, and nitrogen. Helium is likely to be retained by very massive worlds (size A+) in the habitable or middle zones.

Corrosive atmospheres are likely to be corrosive because of acids (sulphuric most likely, then hydrochloric and then nitric) more than chlorine and fluorine - the latter are highly reactive and would have to be actively produced, and the only way to really do that is to have some kind of lifeform breaking down a chloride or fluoride and emitting the gas into the atmosphere. They are however very rare elements in terms of geochemistry, and so you're not likely to find them in large amounts (we're talking parts per million, maybe up to a tenth of a percent by mass in the atmosphere at most).

Insidious atmospheres are... well, a bit of a cop-out as defined. Venus has traditionally been defined as a "Corrosive" atmosphere in Traveller, but that's really not doing it justic - it's Insidious all the way. Between the high pressure carbon dioxide atmosphere (90 atms pressure at the surface), 400-500°C temperature hot enough to melt lead, and the sulphuric acid in the air, it's going to beat any kind of protection in pretty short order. Which goes to illustrate that "Insidious" isn't really about being corrosive, it's about all-round environmental hostility. Personally I'd class any world with high radiation or non-stop volcanoes (like Jupiter's moon Io) as an Insidious environment too.
 
Thanks RTT and EDG, I thought that the chlorine would be really reactive from what I seemed to remember from secondary school chemistry (but thats over 20 years ago so I'm more than a little rusty!)

I also new about the presence of sulphuric acid in the atmosphere of Venus from childhood books on astronomy. If someone could elaborate on the reason for this in terms understandable by the layman I'd really appreciate it.

In my old MT campaign none of my players were of a particularly scientific bent (they were D+D players I'd converted to playing SF games) so I just used to tell them the atmosphere in terms of the codes used in UWP creation but I'd like to a little more realism to the feel of my current games.

Thanks again for the feedback.

Edit: Not sure if Venus is volcanically active or if the reason is due to some quirk of chemistry, please excuse my ignorance!
 
Charakan said:
I also new about the presence of sulphuric acid in the atmosphere of Venus from childhood books on astronomy. If someone could elaborate on the reason for this in terms understandable by the layman I'd really appreciate it.

The sulphire dioxide (SO2) molecules in the upper atmosphere get broken down by UV light from the sun, which (when combined with hydrogen formed by the breaking down of other molecules) forms the sulphuric acid molecules.

http://www.esa.int/esaMI/Venus_Express/SEMANY808BE_0.html

UV light can be quite important when it comes to atmospheric chemistry. A lot of the organic stuff in Titan's atmosphere (orbiting Saturn) is formed by UV breaking down methane and nitrogen.


Edit: Not sure if Venus is volcanically active or if the reason is due to some quirk of chemistry, please excuse my ignorance!

The suspicion is that it is active. There's some circumstantial evidence for it (electrical discharges, SO2 spikes, lots of solidified lava flows on the surface) but I don't think an actual volcanic eruption has been detected that's going on while we've been observing Venus. But I can't see much of a reason why it couldn't be volcanically active today.
 
Thanks for the prompt reply, easily understandable explanation and interesting link.

Its a lot more useful than just saying the atmosphere is insidious and will defeat protective measures in x number of hours to give the pcs a reason why.
 
Charakan said:
Its a lot more useful than just saying the atmosphere is insidious and will defeat protective measures in x number of hours to give the pcs a reason why.

Plus, it's kinda daft too when you consider Tech Levels. Sure, it may defeat a TL 8 spacesuit, but would the same environment necessarily defeat a TL 15 environment suit too?
 
EDG said:
Charakan said:
Its a lot more useful than just saying the atmosphere is insidious and will defeat protective measures in x number of hours to give the pcs a reason why.

Plus, it's kinda daft too when you consider Tech Levels. Sure, it may defeat a TL 8 spacesuit, but would the same environment necessarily defeat a TL 15 environment suit too?

Quick & Dirty fix. For every TL above the one in which the environment suit originates, add an hour to its longevity in an insidious atmosphere.
 
EDG said:
Which goes to illustrate that "Insidious" isn't really about being corrosive, it's about all-round environmental hostility. Personally I'd class any world with high radiation or non-stop volcanoes (like Jupiter's moon Io) as an Insidious environment too.
I second that. I'd even class high-radiation worlds as Corrosive - after all, Corrosive only means that you take damage if you go without serious protection. Insidious requires the environment to be able to tear through standard protection within some time, which I'm not sure is possible with radiation.

Regarding man-made (or sophont-made) radiation, up to a certain level, radioactive fallout would probably count as a Taint; above that it'll be Corrosive.
 
I have a DVD produced by BBC called "Space Odyssey: Voyage to the Planets". It details a fictional Grand Tour of the solar system. Venus as portrayed is insidious all the way. The crushing pressure and heat cause the astronauts' equipment to fail at an alarming rate. I kept thinking, "2D6 hours to failure!"

Io was equally nerve wracking. Because the lander and suit had to be shielded against radiation (a nifty aurora borealis effect), only one astronaut could land. Because of her months in low/ zero g, she tired quickly under the weight of the shielded suit. She keeps trying to drag an equipment cart to an interesting geologic feature, and is so exhausted, she almost can't drag herself up the ladder into the ascent stage.

Worth checking out for 'real space" ideas.
 
Jeff Hopper said:
EDG said:
Charakan said:
Its a lot more useful than just saying the atmosphere is insidious and will defeat protective measures in x number of hours to give the pcs a reason why.

Plus, it's kinda daft too when you consider Tech Levels. Sure, it may defeat a TL 8 spacesuit, but would the same environment necessarily defeat a TL 15 environment suit too?

Quick & Dirty fix. For every TL above the one in which the environment suit originates, add an hour to its longevity in an insidious atmosphere.

You should just figure out how much damage the enviroment does each turn and the stats of the suit will take care of the rest. If the enviroment does 2d6 dmg every round then anyone in battle dress is on a sunday picnic, but if you wear a regular low TL HEV suit you might not be so casual.
 
Hi Leo, I remember seeing that a couple of years ago - very good. I was so pleased the BBC did some 'hard science fiction'.

I recommend it to Traveller players.

Leo Knight said:
I have a DVD produced by BBC called "Space Odyssey: Voyage to the Planets". It details a fictional Grand Tour of the solar system. Venus as portrayed is insidious all the way. The crushing pressure and heat cause the astronauts' equipment to fail at an alarming rate. I kept thinking, "2D6 hours to failure!"

Io was equally nerve wracking. Because the lander and suit had to be shielded against radiation (a nifty aurora borealis effect), only one astronaut could land. Because of her months in low/ zero g, she tired quickly under the weight of the shielded suit. She keeps trying to drag an equipment cart to an interesting geologic feature, and is so exhausted, she almost can't drag herself up the ladder into the ascent stage.

Worth checking out for 'real space" ideas.
 
Leo Knight said:
I have a DVD produced by BBC called "Space Odyssey: Voyage to the Planets". It details a fictional Grand Tour of the solar system. Venus as portrayed is insidious all the way. The crushing pressure and heat cause the astronauts' equipment to fail at an alarming rate. I kept thinking, "2D6 hours to failure!"

Wow, how the hell did I miss that one?! I caught a bit of it on youtube and it looks pretty awesome - will definitely have to check it out!
 
EDG said:
Leo Knight said:
I have a DVD produced by BBC called "Space Odyssey: Voyage to the Planets". It details a fictional Grand Tour of the solar system. Venus as portrayed is insidious all the way. The crushing pressure and heat cause the astronauts' equipment to fail at an alarming rate. I kept thinking, "2D6 hours to failure!"

Wow, how the hell did I miss that one?! I caught a bit of it on youtube and it looks pretty awesome - will definitely have to check it out!

It has aired a couple of times on Science Channel in the US.
 
Note that just a few percent too much or too little oxygen can turn an atmosphere hostile to humanity, and even breathable levels of oxygen under a particularly active sun can lead to a variety of problems both short and long term. The least of these would be smog, requiring filter masks. In the absence of the other components of smog (not enough free sulfur, for example), increased incidental ozone will have a similar effect on lungs AND will age most technological devices at an alarming rate.

This kind of gas mix tends to be self-correcting over long periods, but Traveller isn't a game of geologic epochs. It's a game in a "snapshot" of space a few thousand years from now, and snapshots can be pretty wild.
 
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