Player Character Skill Levels

[pasuuli]

So, for those of you who have generated and played several characters:

What is their skill level spread, and the characters' ages? How many level-1, level-2, level-3, and so on? Do you roll for skills completely randomly, or do you select skills?

And more generally, what skill level do you consider to be a "professional" level? Level-3?

 

[F33D]

And more generally, what skill level do you consider to be a "professional" level? Level-3?

From the MRB: "Each rank represents several years of experience using that skill. A character with Level 2–3 in a skill is a skilled professional in that field. A character with Medic 2 could be a doctor; a character with Medic 4 is a famous surgeon or specialist."

A skill level of two (2) would make one a "professional" in most skills.

 

[rust]

Do you roll for skills completely randomly, or do you select skills?

A mix of both, I take care that all characters first get the skills and le-
vels required for their profession and the setting, and then determine
the remaining skills randomly.

And more generally, what skill level do you consider to be a "professional" level? Level-3?

According to the core rules page 51:

A character with Level 2–3 in a skill is a skilled professional in that field.
A character with Medic 2 could be a doctor; a character with Medic 4 is a
famous surgeon or specialist.

Based on this, I consider Level-2 as highly professional, the equivalent of
a doctorate or many years of experience. However, with the Traveller sys-
tem this makes more sense for knowledge skills and much less sense for
purely practical skills.

 

[LegendaryJWP]

This is one of the hardest things to convince new players of: Level 0 doesn't mean rank amateur. That's what unskilled means.

My take is:
Level 0 - baseline competence
Level 1 - good at it
Level 2 - professional
Level 3 - notable
Level 4 - world famous
Level 5 - best in the subsector

 

[pasuuli]

Thanks so far guys. I appreciate hearing about your experience with the system in particular.

 

[rust]

I designed my own skill lists and careers for my settings,
so my only real problem with the system were the rather
bizarre rules for learning and improving skills, which I re-
placed with a system borrowed from another game.

After that the system worked just fine ... :wink:

 

[Hopeless]

I designed my own skill lists and careers for my settings,
so my only real problem with the system were the rather
bizarre rules for learning and improving skills, which I re-
placed with a system borrowed from another game.

After that the system worked just fine ... :wink:

Any particular system?

Been wondering about that myself

 

[LegendaryJWP]

I designed my own skill lists and careers for my settings,
so my only real problem with the system were the rather
bizarre rules for learning and improving skills, which I re-
placed with a system borrowed from another game.

After that the system worked just fine ... :wink:

Given the change in skills, did you go with a finer granularity or more wildcard skills?

And did you change the skill system at all? Because I think that, given that the skill levels are so meaningfully different, the more difficult skill improvement system makes some sense.

 

[mr31337]

I designed my own skill lists and careers for my settings,
so my only real problem with the system were the rather
bizarre rules for learning and improving skills, which I re-
placed with a system borrowed from another game.

After that the system worked just fine ... :wink:

Any particular system?

Been wondering about that myself

I'd also like to know which game system you borrowed from. I'm having real issues with the Mongoose version of skill improvement.

 

[rust]

I use a modified version of the system of the Ringworld RPG,
mainly because it also includes a detailed subsystem of skill
improvement by research and development. While it took a
little effort to translate the system from d100 to 2d6, it was
well worth that effort.

 

[rust]

Given the change in skills, did you go with a finer granularity or more wildcard skills?

It depends on which skills make the most sense and are most
often used in a specific setting. For example, in my favourite
water world setting combat is very rare, so I combined all the
various combat skills into a Melee Combat skill and a Ranged
Combat skill. On the other hand this setting needs a couple of
new skills with a high granularity, like an Animal Handling skill
with specializations for different species of animals imported
to the water world from several other worlds.

And did you change the skill system at all?

For most settings I did modify it, sometimes with learning ba-
sed on experience / successful use of skills, sometimes with
the introduction of hypnolearning methods, and so on - again
depending on the "feel" of the specific setting.

 

[Dunia]

So, for those of you who have generated and played several characters:

What is their skill level spread, and the characters' ages? How many level-1, level-2, level-3, and so on? Do you roll for skills completely randomly, or do you select skills?

And more generally, what skill level do you consider to be a "professional" level? Level-3?

I have played only one character since we started to play MGT.

Name: Eilania Cha'at
Race: Darrian
Class: Special Arm/Scientist (3 terms) (we started adventuring at 1104 so by now it should be: 6 terms)
Rank: Lt Colonel (started as Captain)
Stats: Str (5), Dex (6), End (5), Int (16), Edu (17), Soc (11*), Psi (5), New Stat we added: Cha (9)
* Started as 5 but it has risen through RP and doing a lot of meritorious work for the Confederation

Admin -1, Deception -0, Gun Combat (Energy Pistol) -0, Intrusion -1, Investigate -1, Jack of all Trades -1, Languages (Te-Zapeth) - 4*, (Imperial) -3*, (Sagamaal) -3, (Scandinavian) -2, (Oynprith) -0 (Trokh) -3, (Zdetl) -1, Melee (Blades), Recon -1, Science (Archeology) -6, (History) -3, (Linguistics) -2 (Philosophy) -2, (Psionicology) -1, (Psychology) -0, Stealth -0, Trade (Instruction) -2, Vacc Suit -0
Psionics: Telekinetics -0
* We let all races start with 4 in their own language and 2 in Imperial (Imperials get 4 in Imperial and 2 in Vilani).

This character has been around quite a lot and I have played her for like 3 years now about once per week. So she has accumulated a lot of new skills and we are currently in the year 1115.
The funny thing is that no one in the Group knows that I am a Special Arms. They believe both in and out of game that I am just a scientist belonging to the Zlodh University. The Special Arms use me to uncover ancient artifacts and knowledge from the pre-Maghiz time, while the group believes that I try to do this for the university. The rest of group is very fun as well. We have alot of scientific/scout characters and we really do suck at fighting

Our skill levels are:
Level 0 - baseline competence
Level 1 - good at it
Level 2 - professional
Level 3 - Experienced Professional
Level 4 - Notable
Level 5 - world famous
Level 6 - renowned over the sub sector
Level 7 - renowned over the sector
Level 8 - renowned over the Chartered Space

 

[Lemnoc]

My sense about this is additional levels above 2 and it starts to get unlikely a character would be "Travelling" in the traditional ragtag knock-about sense. Level 3, oh sure, why not? Level 4, and someone somewhere is going to want to PAY you big money to please, please not risk your hide as pirate fodder aboard some leaky backwater tramp freighter.

ADD: I see the levels, in Traveller at least, as being a sort of "orders of magnitude" thing, vastly superior, rather than a linear progression.

I might start assigning notoriety/fame to highly skilled characters. Great for taking hostage and ransoming.

 

[CosmicGamer]

Level 4 - Notable
Level 5 - world famous
Level 6 - renowned over the sub sector
Level 7 - renowned over the sector
Level 8 - renowned over the Chartered Space

While I understand what you are getting at, there is no reason someone with high skill will be famous or renown.

An example would be someone with cat burglar type skills. While the crimes they commit may be known, the higher level of skill would predicate they are not known for their skill at all.

Another example could be someone that is high skill level but lives on an isolated world with little contact with the outside.

That scout who missjumped and crashed on some planet with supper harsh conditions has gained a pretty high survival skill over the last 15 years he's been there.

I'd think it's more likely for an entertainer or athlete to be better known in a wider area than someone with a high level in vacc suits or Zero-G.

One expert in rifles might be a military sharpshooter who is only known by a few people in the military while another is a bounty hunter known by law men and criminals and yet another is a competitive shooter in sub sector wide competitions.

My point is that I wouldn't make a direct correlation between a skill level and how well known someone is.

 

[Lemnoc]

Another example could be someone that is high skill level but lives on an isolated world with little contact with the outside.

That scout who missjumped and crashed on some planet with supper harsh conditions has gained a pretty high survival skill over the last 15 years he's been there.

Let's take your example, though. Is this character going to have a generalized high survival skill across any and all situations, or a particular kind of survival skill in a particular area?

See, I wouldn't think this character rates a skill level of more than 3, but I might grant him a many a modifier when he's back in his own wheelhouse.

And I do think a cat burglar of skill 4 is going to attract a LOT of (unwanted) attention and notoriety. From LE and rivals. That's about at the level of the Brinks diamond heist, IMO.

 

[Saladman]

Somewhere I've seen the claim that 4 is the usual max rank for skills. That's not actually explicit in the core book, and it is kind of a big thing to leave out if it was intended, but for me it does make sense out of the system. (If you want a higher bonus, you just have to work skill chains or assistance.) Yes, Traveller Your Way, not trying to change Dunia's game, but its worth pointing out to the OP many games won't use ranks above 4.

Similar to others since its taken from the book, my take on skill ranks is:
0 - trained, certified or at least competent. Medic 0 might be a paramedic or nurse.
1 - several years experience. Medic 1 could be a paramedic or nurse with more job experience.
2 - professional certification in academic fields, or experience and respect amounting to it in practical fields. Medic 2 qualifies as a doctor if they want to, whatever career path got them there. Advocate 2 is a practicing lawyer, engineer 2 may be the chief engineer on a small to mid-sized ship or a department head on a capital ship. For things like mechanic, trade, steward or drive, if its their highest skill, they're recognized informally as old hands in their field, or if dirtside, may own their own business or shop.
3 - expert or specialist. Medic 3 is a supervising physician at a hospital or a highly paid specialist.
4 - justifiably famous for insight or achievement, at least within the field.

What is their skill level spread, and the characters' ages? How many level-1, level-2, level-3, and so on? Do you roll for skills completely randomly, or do you select skills?

All random baby! Which I've seen give people some difficulty when they're coming from other systems, but it really does work out taken on its own terms. Especially with connections and skill packages to backstop anything you think you're missing. It does mean skill spreads can vary somewhat between characters, there's no fixed number of skills by ranks.

I cap terms at (usually) 4, to get around the Adventuring Admiral problem. So now I see a lot of 34 year old PCs for some reason. Sometimes a 30 year old if all physical stats are on a lower break point and they don't want to risk aging. A 1 or 2 term character can actually hang if the player is up for it, but the skill difference is more obvious, and not necessarily fun for everyone.

I might start assigning notoriety/fame to highly skilled characters. Great for taking hostage and ransoming.

That is an excellent idea I am going to steal.

 

[locarno24]

This is one of the hardest things to convince new players of: Level 0 doesn't mean rank amateur. That's what unskilled means.

My take is:
Level 0 - baseline competence
Level 1 - good at it
Level 2 - professional
Level 3 - notable
Level 4 - world famous
Level 5 - best in the subsector

That's my understanding as well.

Level 4 is field-leading, be that Cambridge professor (science), Respected Ambassador (Diplomat/Persuade), Olympic Athlete (Athletics/Gun Combat) or whatever.

I also agree that anyone with a level 4+ skill is going to either be recognisable and identifiable within a subsector if people wish to spend the effort to do so, or is instantly suspicious if they demonstrate this whilst 'unidentifiable' - a man with no recognisable background who demonstrates Melee Combat (Unarmed)/4 is likely to get the Agent Coulson conversation* with someone from the Imperial Scout Service.

Yes, all right, a thief/assassin using Level 4 skills won't be known his or her self, but (assuming people are aware they exist at all, are the sort of individuals with media nicknames).


* You made a group of highly trained professionals look like minimum wage mall cops, etc, etc...

 

[CosmicGamer]

Another example could be someone that is high skill level but lives on an isolated world with little contact with the outside.

That scout who missjumped and crashed on some planet with supper harsh conditions has gained a pretty high survival skill over the last 15 years he's been there.

Let's take your example, though. Is this character going to have a generalized high survival skill across any and all situations, or a particular kind of survival skill in a particular area?

See, I wouldn't think this character rates a skill level of more than 3, but I might grant him a many a modifier when he's back in his own wheelhouse.

And I do think a cat burglar of skill 4 is going to attract a LOT of (unwanted) attention and notoriety. From LE and rivals. That's about at the level of the Brinks diamond heist, IMO.

No reason for me to get off the point and discuss the individual examples unless you specifically want me to so that you understand where I'm coming from.

My point is that I wouldn't make a direct correlation between a skill level and how well known someone is.

Are you saying that you believe in all circumstances for all possible careers, skills and characters there always should be a direct correlation between a skill level and how well known someone is?

 

[F33D]

And I do think a cat burglar of skill 4 is going to attract a LOT of (unwanted) attention and notoriety. From LE and rivals. That's about at the level of the Brinks diamond heist, IMO.

Quite correct. Within their sphere of operation (in this case crime world & law enforcement) they will be known, if only by reputation/jobs pulled off, far and wide. I think one of the posters took the scale totally literally without thinking it through. Being known subsector wide doesn't mean by every Tom, Dick & Harry on the street of course.

 

[LegendaryJWP]

And I do think a cat burglar of skill 4 is going to attract a LOT of (unwanted) attention and notoriety. From LE and rivals. That's about at the level of the Brinks diamond heist, IMO.

Quite correct. Within their sphere of operation (in this case crime world & law enforcement) they will be known, if only by reputation/jobs pulled off, far and wide. I think one of the posters took the scale totally literally without thinking it through. Being known subsector wide doesn't mean by every Tom, Dick & Harry on the street of course.

Think Ocean's 13 - there were several very famous (within the LE and hustler communities) crooks in that story - LeMarc was famous enough that The NIght Fox was trying to prove he was as good. Not to say that Danny Ocean wasn't also near that same pinnacle of achievement, but we're too close to him in the story to really see that.

And yet, outside their rarified circles, nobody would know them from Adam.