Player’s Guide: a disappointed review of a wonderful book

Here’s a quick personal review.
The book is hardback, B&W, 115 pages for $29.95. A bit expansive, but that’s Conan…
The cover is nice and the overall quality of the book has greatly improved since 2nd Ed and RttRoK. It seems that Mongoose finally managed to master their printing facility. The binding looks fine, the cover does not bend, the printing is less dark and grey shadings are well used.
The book is organized as follows:

-Background and Personalities (15 pages)
Lots of “background” tables to determine your character past. Fun, but you can live without them…
-Character Variants (8 pages).
Ok, why not. I’m not sure to see many male Amazon players, though… At the end of the chapter, there’s the list of all race/class variants from the earlier supplements.
-Character Packages (21 pages)
A very long but quite hollow chapter detailing character trappings by race and class. Information on clothing can prove colourful but the package lists are really boring.
-The Trading Post (5 pages)
A description of hyborian musical instruments along with a couple of new weapons.
-Unusual Items (5 pages)
Some new “magical items” in the Conan way.
-Feats (12 pages)
I guess there’s no OGL books without them. Completely lame to me. Moreover, most of them are reprints from RoK. The best thing in this chapter is the complete list of feats from all older books.
-Naming Charts (12 pages)
Lists of names by nations. A nice gaming aid for any hyborian campaign.
-Noble Titles (8 pages)
A description of noble titles and ranks, by nation. I found this part pretty nice to flesh out hyborian nobility. I resented the absence of the Turanians (although Hyrkanian nobility is described). I’ve always felt that Turan had been a bit overlooked in the game…
-Tips on Roleplaying in the Hyborian Age (2 pages)
Rantings on roleplaying by Vincent. You want to read them…
-The Reins of Power (4 pages)
Tips on what to do with your character once he’s big and mean. No “Epic Level” rules though. Probably a summary of what we could expect from Hyborian Empires (another planned book that was never released).
-Sorcerers Great & Small (10 pages)
New spells and magic. Again quite unavoidable in a D20 book. The compiled spell list is quite a handy tool.
-Hyborean Age Voices (8 pages)
A compilation of « interviews » of people from various cultures. Quite stereotypical (I guess that’s the goal, anyways…) but fun to read.
-Index (2 pages)
Well, it’s all in the name…

The book contains mostly new material (with of the exception of feats and of compiled lists) and can be considered as such as the “real” first 2nd supplement.
Although the book can prove useful, I found it desperately lacking of depth. The PGH looks more like a compilation of S&P articles than a real supplement, most of them being even less useful than those reprinted in the Conan Compendium. The contents are a bit hollow for the steep thirty bucks price. Maybe thirty more pages or a lesser price (with a softcover) would have made it easier to swallow…
 
My take on the book is that it is possibly useful to GM's and possibly useful to newbie players.

The background tables are just what you'd find in the old DnD supplements. Any player who really cares about his character, can do this without tables. Though, I have used them to flesh out one of my player's noble characters.

I liked the Character variants. The races are probably too exotic for most players, but for the GM, good stuff.

Character packages. Useful for flavor. More for the GM as the party travels from country to country.

Trading post. Mostly obscure stuff you'd find in the Black Kingdoms. With a bit from Hyrkania, Khitai, Vendhya and Stygia. Again, useful for flavor.

Noble titles section was useful. Wish there had been a Zamoran section.

Sorcery section seemed very powerful. Lots of 'You Die' spells. And an "I pull your eyeballs out!" spell.

Feats are a reprint and most of the rest of the book fluff.

The interviews weren't useful, in fact they were downright weird. The Vendhyan merchant 'boasting' that Vendhya has free, universal health care seemed anachronistic in the extreme.

My first impression; that the book is possibly useful to GM's and newbie players, stands. I can't see any of the five players that I GM for buying or getting any use out of this book.

I'll get some use out of it. I like lots of flavor for various cultures. So what the people wear and what insturments they use are useful for me to get the culture down. I believe if you don't explore what makes Aquilinia different from Shem, they why not just play in Greyhawk.

The nasty spells will come in handy when they face the evil sorcerer (later).

All in all, I'm glad, as a GM, that I have the book.
 
bradius said:
The interviews weren't useful, in fact they were downright weird. The Vendhyan merchant 'boasting' that Vendhya has free, universal health care seemed anachronistic in the extreme.

Yet accurate for Vedic India, according to my research I put into it.
 
I liked the Character Package section of the PG. I ran the scenario from the thunder River supplement at a local convention last night and used CP section. I think it gives a really good understanding of the cultural and technological differences of each nation. I plan to use it each time the party comes to a new country.

Anything which helps differentiate the cultures is good. Again, I'm really happy with the Character Package section.
 
I really liked the packages, naming charts, noble titles, and very much appreciated the Hyborean Voices section. Keep 'em comin' Vincent!

My main criticism of the book is the same for a lot of the books....small page count with hard covers, especially with the binding and black and white....sheeeeeeeesh :cry:

The index is nice but not quite as thorough as what I was hoping for.
 
VincentDarlage said:
LucaCherstich said:
I received this book last Friday, I think this is an essential book... a good and essential book but some DECENT proofreading (and useful figures, i.e. weapons) should make this book perfect.

I know early on, several fans worried that the book made the Hyboria's F series obsolete. I wrote it so that it wouldn't, but perhaps you (or someone else who has the Player's Guide) could offer your opinion on whether it does or does not (as I am, of course, biased).

Hyboria's F series was based on divisions made by Class.
Here, in the PG the emphasis is on the "race" type, so this book does not make obsolete the Hyboria's F series.
Packages, Names, Titles, backgrounds, etc... are all useful tools to make new characters more grounded in the setting.
I still feel this book is very good but I also still feel it is faulted by a terrible editing and cuts which were imposed on the author.
E.g. the introductive paragraph on magic items firstly says that there will be numerous objects....and then only 2 of them are presented.
It is clear that something was cut there and the editor who cut it forget to modify the introductive paragraph.
This is just an example (for more of them, see my first post) but, to me, this means that an opportunity for a good book was just wasted and my money was also, at least partly, wasted.
I would still suggest other players to buy this book, although they must know what they are buying BEFORE they pay the money.
Furthermore I think that this must be known also by those who decide things in Mongoose: as a customer I'm not satisfied by this product, so please think seriously about paying some good editor/proofreader.

A question for Vincent.
Possibly this question sounds stupid, but I need to know it. Regarding the packages of many Ghulistani: what are the game statistics of those stones ?
I suppose they are thrown just by hand and not by a sling: am I right?
 
LucaCherstich said:
Hyboria's F series was based on divisions made by Class.
Here, in the PG the emphasis is on the "race" type, so this book does not make obsolete the Hyboria's F series.

I never thought of it that way. Neat.

LucaCherstich said:
It is clear that something was cut there and the editor who cut it forget to modify the introductive paragraph.

Well, in this case it was an author edit. I intended more magic items, but the ones I came up with, I just didn't like. I forgot to edit the introduction after I jettisoned the crap I wrote. The editor didn't have a chance to cut them and tell me they sucked.

LucaCherstich said:
A question for Vincent.
Possibly this question sounds stupid, but I need to know it. Regarding the packages of many Ghulistani: what are the game statistics of those stones ?
I suppose they are thrown just by hand and not by a sling: am I right?

Typically they are thrown by hand, but I am sure they had slings, too. I would call it an improvised weapon. Maybe 1D4 or 1D6 damage, x2 Crit, 10 or 20 ft. range increment, perhaps.
 
Wow. I am very impressed with this dialogue. Vincent, you have addressed each criticism, gripe, and query. My opinions of Mongoose have been rushing up and down since I heard of them only months ago:

Great indie company of Brits that got Conan
Rather big company with no quality control
Company that bought new printing technology to fix printing problems
Small company with, still, no quality control
Company with Flaming Cobra that might distribute my games
RPG *and* Miniature company sadly understaffed
Collection of fans and writers who tried starting a company from a garage
Company trying hard to communicate with fans and provide great games
Decent sized company with, still, no quality control

And now...

Company with GREAT people promising a little too much each month

Still, you are on an upswing for me. I'm an editor who does lots of layout and text work, and I know how painstaking it is. I also know the hassle of changing one rule and having to fix it eight places. Good luck. I haven't seen this book, and I probably won't start a Conan group (not a free-loader, but just more interested in creating), but I might go buy a bunch of Mongoose stuff at the local shop just to help out. Not as though you need charity, but, you know, so I can support your efforts.
 
Hervé said:
Here’s a quick personal review.
Thanks for the detailed review.
I am not impressed by the content though. I bought Tito's trading post some times ago but I don't think I'll go for this one.
 
The King said:
I am not impressed by the content though. I bought Tito's trading post some times ago but I don't think I'll go for this one.

Although I am disappointed by the comparison to Tito's, I would like to know what would have impressed you. What should I have included in the Player's Guide (that wouldn't have made the Hyboria's F series obsolete)?
 
VincentDarlage said:
Although I am disappointed by the comparison to Tito's, I would like to know what would have impressed you. What should I have included in the Player's Guide (that wouldn't have made the Hyboria's F series obsolete)?

I liked the PG. The naming tables (especially Stygian and Shemite), titles of royalty, notes on roleplaying, character background and rules for creating PCs with mixed parentage we're all very impressive.

The F series was about classes. The PG is about races. I would have added lots of racial/country feats and more country-specific items, and then done away with the sorcerous items since most of those are out of reach of PCs.

In any case, I purchased a copy and in no way am I unsatisfied.
 
Yeah, please don't think that the Player's Guide... is another "Tito's...". I don't feel that it is. I enjoy my copy of the Guide too.
 
LucaCherstich wrote:
Hyboria's F series was based on divisions made by Class.
Here, in the PG the emphasis is on the "race" type, so this book does not make obsolete the Hyboria's F series.

Vincent Darlage wrote:
I never thought of it that way. Neat.

Possibly you never thought the book in that way...but this is the impression I had reading it, whether it was or not your intention.
I'm not saying that this is a "Race book" (e.g. "Races of Faerun", "Races of Eberron") but you mention things (e.g. names, many packages like the Hyrakanian, ecc.. ) which apply to many Characters of the same Ethnic group, whatever class they are in.

LucaCherstich wrote:
It is clear that something was cut there and the editor who cut it forget to modify the introductive paragraph.

Vincent Darlage wrote:
Well, in this case it was an author edit. I intended more magic items, but the ones I came up with, I just didn't like. I forgot to edit the introduction after I jettisoned the crap I wrote. The editor didn't have a chance to cut them and tell me they sucked.

Whoever did it, he had the fault of not fixing the introduction.
I do not care who's fault but there are numerous cases like this in the book (e.g. why the "Turanian" names are ALPHABETICALLY before the Nemedian?).
Clearly SOMEBODY had to be more carefull in checking such things...whoever this "somebody" is.
Maybe you were not careful as an author...but I still think that anybody who call himself editor or proofreder MUST notice such things.
 
VincentDarlage said:
The King said:
I am not impressed by the content though. I bought Tito's trading post some times ago but I don't think I'll go for this one.

Although I am disappointed by the comparison to Tito's, I would like to know what would have impressed you. What should I have included in the Player's Guide (that wouldn't have made the Hyboria's F series obsolete)?
You shouldn't, because I find Tito's quite useful as,it has all the material gathered in the same place.

My critic to the Player's Guide isn't personaly directed against you, I just think this book isn't superfluous. This is probably due to the setting itself and possibly the system.

a) about the system: there are too many feats compared to what is available to players. Moreover feats are only a game mechanics and doesn't bring much as to the way to play specific characters (excepted in given situations).

b) about the setting: I don't find many difference between, say, a Stygian and an Aquilonian soldier (but the same can be said from many settings, including The Forgotten Realms for instance). 2 players could probably play them in their own way, but the same player wouldn't play them very differently (unless he has some gaming experience).

Moreover I don't see the usefulness of naming charts and noble titles (20 pages) because such things can be found quite easily on the net (unless you use some ahistorical context).

In order to let you know what I expect from a book, I would say the best chapter in the Hyboria's F series is all the info about the wilderness life/travel in H. Fiercest. In fact I think this is one f the best piece of text I ever read in Conan RPG.

As I said, it's just my personal feeling and though many may find this book useful it is hard to content everyone.
 
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