Narn E-mine Variants

[katadder]

hey guys, if you been playing since 1st ed you may have remembered the narn e-mine variants. was thinking we could bring most of these back as house rules. I cant remember the fluff for each one but have done rules for them, modified obviously to represent the fact they come from the new TD e-mines and other minor changes (as previous ion one was a bit too powerful). also no short charge one as too easy to stop fighters with it.

Narn E-Mine Variants:
any narn ship may swap its e-mine for one of the following variants which it keeps for the whole battle as long as it has an e-mine launcher (so not the g'karith). The variant will still be one shot or slow loading as per the normal e-mine on the ship its going on and keep the same AD.

Wide Burst:
These e-mines use more of their explosive force for increased area saturation but cause less damage.
E-mine with 5" blast, DD

Ion Burst E-mine:
These e-mines are used more to disrupt the enemy than to cause actual damage, overloading computer systems and sowing havoc amongst formations.
E-mine with single damage and comms disrupter effect.

Long Range E-mine:
The Narn can shoot e-mines at longer distance if they are properly configured however they lose some of the explosive power doing this.
E-mine with +50% range, AP, DD

Ship Breaker:
The Narns heaviest weapon, able to cripple a ship in a single salvo but fortunately for their opponents very short ranged.
Loses E-mine trait. Range 10", SAP, QD

perhaps this would increase people wanting to use g'quans as one of these with ship breakers before was always nasty. i know its no longer as good but still a 6AD SAP QD weapon is still pretty nasty.

 

[kitsune106]

Nice. I like them. they make sense two. although, won't the advanced emines have an absurb range then?

 

[katadder]

only on long range ones, and to be honest why would you bother taking long range e-mines on an advanced launcher?

 

[kitsune106]

not sure. that is a good question.

the ship breaker would be frightening on some ships, especailly if they can get close enough to use them. don't see them much use on a Dag Kar, but if a ship with a 8AD energy mine is able ot use them, ouchies, epsecially if they crit.

 

[katadder]

yep they do. but thing is ships in 1e used to have 2 tubes of ship breakers usually which were just plain painful. g'quans could throw 12AD of SAP DD (i think was only double) every other turn. now it gets the equivalent for one turn only.

 

[katadder]

wow no one jumping on these and saying overpowered or anything perhaps DB can add it to house rules doc?

 

[Burger]

Urr long time since I looked at e-mine variants in 1e. Are they basically the same? If so, then I don't know why they were removed in the first place, and support bringing them back!

 

[katadder]

these are slightly differant.
in 1e ship breakers were TD, but obviously standard were only single damage and each ship had more tubes hence the QD ship breakers.

1e wide burst and long range I think lost half AD, but being TD I have just dropped them to DD and lost the AP.

1e ion ones were weak and negated current SA and disallowed one next turn, so instead of weak have made them single damage and changed the overpowered special effects to be equal to a comms disruptor.

 

[Burger]

Sounds good - presumably they are only allowed on TD e-mines (ie. not G'Karith )

 

[katadder]

yep, g'karith has pulsar mines doesnt it?

 

[Burger]

Yeah but 1e variants were allowed on that (it went on the energy mine trait, not the name of the weapon)

 

[katadder]

dont think they did, otherwise that thing was an underused ship. it went on the energy mine weapon name, which is what all e-mines but the g'karith are called in the narn fleet. anyway added a bit into the exchange rules for them.

 

[Burger]

OK I stand corrected, my memory might be a bit rusty. Still best to clarify though, to avoid the beardy brigade :lol:

 

[Methos5000]

Narn E-Mine Variants:
Wide Burst:
These e-mines use more of their explosive force for increased area saturation but cause less damage.
E-mine with 5" blast, DD

Seems pretty balanced. Covers more area but drops a damage level and loses AP

Ion Burst E-mine:
These e-mines are used more to disrupt the enemy than to cause actual damage, overloading computer systems and sowing havoc amongst formations.
E-mine with single damage and comms disrupter effect.

This seems okay although Comms disrupters themselves have always seemed backwards. They are designed to disrupt communications...yet only internal ship communtions are broken up (SA) not ship to ship communitions (a factor in the initiative score). I understand why they have the effect they do for game purposes but they just don't seem to work properly. However if it affected SA and Init then they would probably be too powerful.

Long Range E-mine:
The Narn can shoot e-mines at longer distance if they are properly configured however they lose some of the explosive power doing this.
E-mine with +50% range, AP, DD

seems fine, it might be the least used one as with many of them already having a 30" range (and some even longer) on many table setups it may not be needed.

Ship Breaker:
The Narns heaviest weapon, able to cripple a ship in a single salvo but fortunately for their opponents very short ranged.
Loses E-mine trait. Range 10", SAP, QD

perhaps this would increase people wanting to use g'quans as one of these with ship breakers before was always nasty. i know its no longer as good but still a 6AD SAP QD weapon is still pretty nasty.

I see this one really nasty on the G'Vrahn. It being faster, more maneuverable and lack of lumbering compared to the G'Quan it will be able to close to that 10" range much easier and not avoid as easily. The G'Vrahn having a 6AD 10" F SAP QD S/L weapon that can crit could be scary for some opponents.

 

[katadder]

yeah maybe, thats my only real worry ship and only balance problem, but it does mean the g'vrahn actually having to close instead of just poncing around out at mag gun range.

perhaps could say advanced e-mine launchers cant use them, but then this would effect the KBT too. damn g'vrahn being too good at stuff.

although I guess its only like a warlock having heavy missiles wihch are only TD but can fire every turn. and thats the same speed.

one thing with the ship breakers, they can be dodged, intercepted and dont ignore stalth.

 

[Foxmeister]

wow no one jumping on these and saying overpowered or anything perhaps DB can add it to house rules doc?

I have some comments!

Wide Burst

I can see this as being viewed as broken. Keeping fighters 6" apart is hard, but not impossible, but at 10" it really does become too difficult. If such a variant was to exist, I'd probably say that it should be possible to dodge it, but even then that may not be enough.

Ship Breaker

Ok for O/S e-mines, but I don't think it works for S/L variants.

Regards,

Dave

 

[katadder]

wide burst was always part of the game and not that heavily used and it is slow loading but not AP.

ship breakers are only really a problem on the g'vrahn because of its speed. a dag'kar usually doesnt want to get that close and is too slow, the KBT is also very slow.
as said in previous post though the g'vrahn firing these every other turn doesnt have as much potential as a warlock firing heavy missiles every turn.

 

[kitsune106]

Say, woudl you have to declar what e-mines you are using at the start of a battle? since i can see soem pretty nasty tactics, especially if you don't ahve to declare what e-mines you are using. think about a dag kar loaded iwth ship beakers, and moved into range, your opponent thinking it is foolishy, but ignoring it for that G'Qan which is max accelrating towards your ship, then unleashing the ship breakers with teh dag-kar, while the G
Quan opens up with wide bursts, or nrmal e-mines.....

 

[katadder]

i would say so. am sure people normally declare what missiles are on a ship so same with these. acta is about being totally open about your fleets.

 

[kitsune106]

true. was just curious. woudl be neat if yisntead you coudl write down on a sheet, or pieces fo paper, then the first time it fires te variant, you show what it has? since unless they hae sensors that can tell you exactly what ammo they have in teh tube, you don;t know what exactly they are packing, right?

just a thought, and most likely completely random.