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[barnest2]

For instance I could make:
"The space war of 1322" using traveller rules... But i'd have to make the background up completely.

 

[apoc527]

I've just downloaded the PDF from DTRPG and I'm 3/4 bitterly dissapointed and 1/4 very happy.

For me, it was more like 2/3 vs 1/3, BUT that's enough value out of a typical RPG supplement for my purposes!

 

[rust]

For instance I could make:
"The space war of 1322" using traveller rules... But i'd have to make the background up completely.

Yep, use Aslan, Droyne and Zhodani without FFE's explicit permission, and
the lawyers will order champagne.

 

[barnest2]

I now have an urge to write that...
Maybe try and make it more like late 19th century warships...

 

[apoc527]

To me that means you will accept poor quality work if some of it is acceptable.

And to that I ask why? I'm not saying you have to like or agree with every deckplan and ship build-out. What I am saying is that the illustrations that they put in the book should all be of equivalent quality (i.e. good quality).

I am still waiting for someone to actually come back and say why it should be acceptable to praise a commercial enterprise for selling low quality products.

Yes, I will accept some lower quality work in an RPG supplement if some of the supplement is acceptable. First, my opinion of the quality of the deckplans differs from yours, though I recognize that they aren't as good as some of the others. Second, I REALLY like the other deckplans and 3D models and ALL the ships are potentially useful.

Third, this is largely about loyalty to a company. Why does that matter? Because the RPG industry sucks. Why do I keep going on about this? Largely because of the vehemence with which you have attacked this book. Why do I do that? Because I don't want others to come on the forums, see your negativity, and decide to bypass the book. If that happens, Mongoose loses. Then we all lose. I want more Mongoose Traveller.

You've already made your opinion crystal clear and presumably haven't bought the book. Fine. Others disagree. Now please, let's be done with it.

 

[phavoc]

Third, this is largely about loyalty to a company. Why does that matter? Because the RPG industry sucks. Why do I keep going on about this? Largely because of the vehemence with which you have attacked this book. Why do I do that? Because I don't want others to come on the forums, see your negativity, and decide to bypass the book. If that happens, Mongoose loses. Then we all lose. I want more Mongoose Traveller.

In this we can agree to disagree. It is my hope that prospective customers of the book WILL have different opinions to choose from before buying the book. It is incredibly unfair to never give fair criticism where it is due. I think everyone that has contributed to this thread has done so and made it clear that they are offering their opinion.

As a consumer its vitally important to me that the reviews I read out there are fair and unbalanced. I shudder to think what the gaming community would be like if no one ever came out against a crappy product. We should not accept schlock at any time, for any reason.

And if we don't hear honest criticism, then we all do truly lose. If Mongoose deserves to lose some business for not putting out quality, then they have rightly earned that for theirself. They don't deserve business simply becuase they are the current holder of the Traveller license. They DO deserve a customer's patronage if they put out quality materials that people want.

 

[AndrewW]

I'm also doubtful about the utility of a fighter mounted flame thrower, but not so much that I wouldn't want to throw it at my PC's as a "What the hell???" moment.

G.

Remember the roll is ground attack not against other fighters.

 

[Treebore]

Glad to see Rust knows the difference between an SRD and a OGL.

 

[GJD]

I'm also doubtful about the utility of a fighter mounted flame thrower, but not so much that I wouldn't want to throw it at my PC's as a "What the hell???" moment.

G.

Remember the roll is ground attack not against other fighters.

Yes, I know, but even so - can you see an F-35 firing a flame thrower on a straffing run? I'd probably rule it works like some sort of self contained napalm-y "blob" that was fired, instead of a constant stream that the fighter would fly into...

Arguably the F-111 had a rear founted one, I suppose....

 

[barnest2]

Is it on a small craft, so a grav vehicle?
If so you just use it at low speeds, when close to the ground, rather than while in proper flight...

 

[DFW]

The SRD is the core rules for MRB, HG & Merc. You can publish as they are in the SRD or change.

Yes, you just cannot name it "Traveller" or market it as "Compatible with
Traveller" or use any of the typical terms of the Third Imperium setting,
and so on, without explicit permission from FFE.

Correct. A rose by ANY other name. Hence, anyone can create it no matter what Mongoose decides to do. I know of no player (I know scores across 3 continents) that care one wit what the legal name of the game is called, jst the rule set.

 

[AndrewW]

Is it on a small craft, so a grav vehicle?

Yes, small craft.

Think of it as a specialized weapon. Doesn't have to be against troops could be used to help clear the jungle those rebels are hiding in for example.

 

[apoc527]

The SRD is the core rules for MRB, HG & Merc. You can publish as they are in the SRD or change.

Yes, you just cannot name it "Traveller" or market it as "Compatible with
Traveller" or use any of the typical terms of the Third Imperium setting,
and so on, without explicit permission from FFE.

Correct. A rose by ANY other name. Hence, anyone can create it no matter what Mongoose decides to do. I know of no player (I know scores across 3 continents) that care one wit what the legal name of the game is called, jst the rule set.

This makes me laugh. Given the bitter, bitter arguments about the difference between "Traveller," the OTU and system versus setting, you couldn't be more wrong. I have to agree with rust here obviously.

 

[DFW]

This makes me laugh.

Why, am I NOT surprised that you think you know my friends better than I :roll:

 

[rust]

Correct. A rose by ANY other name. Hence, anyone can create it no matter what Mongoose decides to do. I know of no player (I know scores across 3 continents) that care one wit what the legal name of the game is called, jst the rule set.

It is not just the name, it is the entire intellectual property connected with
it. Those Traveller players who play the game because of the Third Impe-
rium setting have no reason to buy a clone without that setting. And with
any other setting the system is just one more science fiction roleplaying
game - there are hundreds of them, many with far better systems (and
there have also been Traveller system clones, although no commercially
successful ones).

 

[DFW]

It is not just the name, it is the entire intellectual property connected with it. Those Traveller players who play the game because of the Third Imperium setting have no reason to buy a clone without that setting.

You have forgotten the premise of this discussion...

1: Do YOU buy MGT material?
2: Do you run a 3I based campaign with it?
3: If #1 is Yes & #2 is No. You just made my argument.

 

[apoc527]

This makes me laugh.

Why, am I NOT surprised that you think you know my friends better than I :roll:

I just read the forums. It's pretty obvious.

 

[apoc527]

It is not just the name, it is the entire intellectual property connected with it. Those Traveller players who play the game because of the Third Imperium setting have no reason to buy a clone without that setting.

You have forgotten the premise of this discussion...

1: Do YOU buy MGT material?
2: Do you run a 3I based campaign with it?
3: If #1 is Yes & #2 is No. You just made my argument.

Umm. No he didn't. He's one of the most vocal guys on these forums about his stance on the 3I. You said you didn't know one player (on three continents, no less) who cared a wit about what the game is called. Assuming that you claim knowledge of people on the forum you've likely never met, you are demonstrably wrong.

But this is a seriously pointless argument anyway. MGP produces the vast majority of "Traveller." If they die or simply stop Traveller (not that a few complaining fans will cause that), then there really won't be much "Traveller." Perhaps somebody will publish a sic-fi game using a 2d6 based system , but that's no more Traveller than Stars Without Number is D&D.

 

[rust]

You just made my argument.

Not at all, quite the contrary, because I buy Third Imperium material to
mine it for ideas for my settings, but I do not use the Traveller rules sys-
tem. Just take a look at my "construction site" over on the SFRPG forum,
the "A Little Harder" thread, and you will see that I use a version of BRP
for the game mechanics and a version of GURPS to design the technolo-
gy. Traveller just does not "deliver" what I want for my settings, so I ha-
ve ceased to use the system, but I would not want to miss truly excellent
supplements like Pete Nash's Darrians, although I have to file off the se-
rial numbers when using the material for my settings.

 

[DFW]

but I would not want to miss truly excellent
supplements like Pete Nash's Darrians, although I have to file off the se-
rial numbers when using the material for my settings.

Then it doesn't matter as someone could write something similar without the 3I setting & word Darrian and it would be as useful.

Again, you made my point.