Is it just me....

[Turloigh]

What’s so cool about Rune Quest anyway?
I’m not familiar with the system so if anyone could shed some light on the differences advantages and such would be appreciated

I'm an RQ fanboy, so take what I say with a grain of salt...

RuneQuest is, IMHO, the best fantasy RPG ever. It's very realistic, but more intuitive than any d20/OGL game. The system is skill-based, so there's no fuss with levels, classes, prestige classes, feats, and all the rules baggage that comes with them. Combat is very deadly, so choose your fights carefully. It is a gritty, "simulationist" game - as opposed to d20/OGL, which encourages over-the-top heroics.

It's been out of print for a very long time, but those who played it love it, and some continue to play it until today, despite its lack of being supported. For some, the best thing about it is the game world of Glorantha - for me, it's the system.

 

[Mark Dunder]

I think Mongoose should play it smart and try to support as many different game systems as possible. Trying to take established game systems like RQ and converting them to d20 is not only a lot of extra work, but may be a waste of time. If they kept the system mechanics (and yes they are one of the best out there), and just expanded upon the world of Glorantha, they'd have a very broad customer base already in place. I just don't see how they could lose.

 

[Oly]

If they kept the system mechanics (and yes they are one of the best out there), and just expanded upon the world of Glorantha, they'd have a very broad customer base already in place. I just don't see how they could lose.

IIRC the system mechanics of Rune Quest are still basically Chaosium's BRP system. Mongoose have probably got the license to produce a Runequest game but not the license for the mechanics. A somewhat similar situation to when WOTC took over the Star Wars license but not the D6 mechanics that WEG used.

The mechanics therefore are probably going to have to change, unless there's some deal being struck with Chaosium of course. Given as how Chaosium have the Stormbringer license (whether they're actually doing that much with it is a really good question though) whether they'd welcome an additional fantasy BRP game onto the market is a really good question.

Mongoose have dabbled with making their own RPG system with Paranoia and they've got lots of experience with the various D20 games they make. I think you'll see them start to head out on their own with a new RPG system and trust the Rune Quest name to make it sell. In time I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Conan and the other titles being converted to the new system, as others have said it makes sense to keep the staff focussed on one system.

D&D 4.0 does appear to be loitering on the horizon and it could make D20/OGL games look a bit "old fashioned" and there might be some additional marketing pressure to make something new as well.

 

[Taharqa]

I think Mongoose should play it smart and try to support as many different game systems as possible.

Good thing you are not running the company. I think it is widely agree in the game industry that this is the best way to commit suicide. Its been credited as one of the reasons for TSR's collapse.

 

[Mark Dunder]

Good thing you are not running the company. I think it is widely agree in the game industry that this is the best way to commit suicide. Its been credited as one of the reasons for TSR's collapse.

It was internal and had nothing to do with product, you can never produce enough good product, I would think Mongoose and WotC is proof of that.

I have no idea why you would think different gaming systems could not be supported, they already are. I think I own about every kind of gaming system out there, and I try to collect more. I play Paranoia, Traveller, RuneQuest, Tunnels & Trolls and Star Wars, Aftermath, Twilight 2000, Wild West, Marvel SuperHero by SAGA, Champions, and many more including one of my favorite system mechanics TSR's Conan RPG. I know a lot of people download freeware games and play those also. So I don't think support for a wide variety of systems will collapse a company. I do think poor product design and support will. Mongoose is doing a great job of supporting their product line. If they keep producing good product, as they have been, I see no reason why they can't support more variety. No single system of mechanics can cover the types of genre out there. Besides, in the end, it's background material that is important, not the system mechanics.

 

[Belkregos]

it looks like it will be a new system, this is from Mongoose statement


http://www.mongoosepublishing.com/home/runequest.php

A Truly Open Game

Perhaps the best news of all is that RuneQuest will be an Open system, meaning that publishers and players alike will be free to produce their own derivative works, using the RuneQuest rules and logo, for publication. Though Glorantha will not be Open in this fashion, the free-to-use licence will permit new settings to be written using the RuneQuest rules, as well as scenarios and rules expansions.

More details on the Open nature of RuneQuest will be released towards the end of this year, along with details on how existing publishers (paper or PDF) can get their hands on a copy of the RuneQuest Development Kit.

 

[Mark Dunder]

You do realise that all game systems are generally open systems according to US copyright laws. You can't copyright lists or proceedures or even systems (of doing things). They can copyright the way you "describe" things like Strength and such or even "explanations" of how to do something. But the general idea, such as rolling a number of more on a d20 cannot be copyrighted. Also, names of skills and such cannot be copyrighted unless the name is unique like Glorantha.

So don't be too thrilled about the open gaming system they are "giving" you. It never really was closed.

 

[quigs]

Never played RQ, but it sounds interesting. Glorantha however, sounds absolutely ridiculous. At least the old ones did. A half-duck PC race? Elves that grow from plants? :roll:

Hahahahaha!

 

[Mark Dunder]

Never played RQ, but it sounds interesting. Glorantha however, sounds absolutely ridiculous. At least the old ones did. A half-duck PC race? Elves that grow from plants?

Obviously, you haven't read as many sci-fi or fantasy books that I have. Aliens from outer space sounds ridiculous to many people. Statues that get up and walk sound ridiculous, huge bugs sound ridiculous. They all sound ridiculous, but they work for the world they are designed for and are not ridiculous in the right setting.

Still and all, if we're talking system mechanics, I like those that don't use any or nearly no characteristics (like dex and wis). I don't mind having them for a character, but I don't think systems should require you to use them. For one thing, what if you wanted to play a ghost? Sure wouldn't have a need for any physical abilities now, would you?

 

[Taharqa]

Good thing you are not running the company. I think it is widely agree in the game industry that this is the best way to commit suicide. Its been credited as one of the reasons for TSR's collapse.

It was internal and had nothing to do with product, you can never produce enough good product, I would think Mongoose and WotC is proof of that.

I have no idea why you would think different gaming systems could not be supported, they already are. I think I own about every kind of gaming system out there, and I try to collect more. I play Paranoia, Traveller, RuneQuest, Tunnels & Trolls and Star Wars, Aftermath, Twilight 2000, Wild West, Marvel SuperHero by SAGA, Champions, and many more including one of my favorite system mechanics TSR's Conan RPG.

Haven't we already established that you are not normal? And most of those gamelines are dead.

My point was that it is suicide to split the same product into two separate systems. The reason is simple. For twice the effort, you are mostly just cannibalizing your own customers.

 

[Mark Dunder]

And most of those gamelines are dead.

Not the last time I checked. But then again, since you can barely read, it's no wonder you don't know they are still supported by thousands of players worldwide.

 

[Taharqa]

And most of those gamelines are dead.

Not the last time I checked. But then again, since you can barely read,

That was rude and uncalled for.

 

[Mark Dunder]

Sorry, I had mistaken you for someone saying something ridiculous.

Good thing you are not running the company. The reason is simple. For twice the effort, you are mostly just cannibalizing your own customers.

Well, It would seem I would be running their company just fine, considering they seem to be doing just that.

also

Haven't we already established that you are not normal?

I'm in very good company, considering all the other abnormal people out there playing the same games I am. Look in the mirror next time.

 

[Strom]

Well, the new game always gets the glory. I remember when Conan was the new game and other gamers from B5 or Slaine were hoping they would not be forgotten. B5 has certainly not been forgotten and I would doubt that Conan will be either. I'm just not excited about a new edition changing the mechanics when I have purchased so many supplements for the OGL version. Supplements I should add that are awesome and really add to the game and are worth their price.

I don't think it will happen but some say court battles could prevent OGL publishers from publishing any new material until a verdict in court. That may be way off, but I'm not sure any of us can say for certain that is the case.

 

[Mark Dunder]

They can always keep producing background material for all the other gaming systems. I'm sure no one will ever be able to actually stop anyone from using OGL now that it is public domain. When thousands of people are using and modifying OGL, it would be hard to put the cat back in the bag. It's bad form to give something for free and then when everyone is hooked, try to take it away. That would make them drug pushers.

 

[mlmguru99]

I for one have been a major fan of RQ since 1st edition. I feel it's open based skill system and combat system that favors skill over level fits the feel of Conan.

I will convert my Conan to the new RQ system when it comes out and hope they support new Conan material for both OGL and RQ. This would allow that crossover for those who want to switch to a better game system than the OGL with way too many feats to pick from, limitation of levels and classes determining what you can do.

 

[Azgulor]

And most of those gamelines are dead.

Not the last time I checked. But then again, since you can barely read, it's no wonder you don't know they are still supported by thousands of players worldwide.

You do realize, don't you, that playing a game that is no longer in print and playing a game that is in print and has supplements in print and planned are not the same thing, don't you?

Yeah, I could continue to play Alternity, original D&D, and 1st edition Vampire, but none of those games are in print or have new official material coming out for those editions. They have a fixed amount of content and are no longer being published as new. Therefore, they are dead - at least from a publisher's viewpoint.

And what's with the personal attack? Hardly a persuasive argument.

Azgulor

 

[Azgulor]

Aside from Trolling, could someone please explain to me why certain individuals feel the need to repeatedly post criticisms of OGL and level-based games to a message board dedicated to a very popular OGL game?

They're certainly entitled to their opinion, but I don't really see the point. I can just picture them going to a steakhouse and getting pissed off that everyone there isn't a vegetarian. It's essentially the same scenario.

Oh, and I've spent the last 5 years playing GURPS which is a skills-based, point-driven, non-level RPG. While I could certainly play a Hyborian game with GURPS (a game I still love), I found the Conan OGL to be much more evocative of the source material.

Also, if you're still making the tired "levels limit your options" argument, you should take a closer look at the "Hyboria's X" class books. The multi-class combos show how versatile the Conan game is at portraying a huge number of fantasy archetypes.

One last thing. For all the raves classless/leveless systems get for allowing you to create ANY type of character (and they can), my experience has been that most PLAYERS create characters around particular archetypes and that classes and levels make it easier for new players to understand a RPG. As a GM, if you want to make unique characters all day long, more power to you. I did with GURPS - and it almost never made a significant impact on my campaigns. But if your players are anything like the 30+ people I've gamed with over the years, you're going to see a lot of archetypes similar to the ones found in the Conan RPG. And the differentiation provided by those classes, feats, etc. allow each player to stand out just as well (and in some cases better) than their point-based, classless/leveless counterparts.

Azgulor

 

[Mark Dunder]

I know I posted somewhere that I had developed 77 different classes for my poor little fantasy game. OGL Conan has 8 base Classes, this means if you Multi-Class only 2 of these you would have a choice of 36 different combinations of Classes, just with 2! If you combined 3 you would have 120 different combinations of Classes! That’s something, huh? (yeah, add commoner to get 9 classes, but I won’t).

Skills use levels/ ranks in both BRP/ RQ and OGL/ Conan. How these levels are figured may be different, but they still both use levels/ ranks.

Who claims RQ doesn’t have Classes? According to my book there are Rune Priests, Shamans, Alchemists, Sages, Thieves, Players/ Minstrels, Foresters, Armorers, and Horsemasters, Everyone seems to be a Fighter as a base class, although Fighter is not mentioned as a class. For that matter, neither are the other classes I mentioned above. But they are! You can only get certain spells, skills, and bonuses by being one of these. To me that is a Class. Also, characters can seek out Training schools to increase their skill levels. Oh? Perhaps progression upwards may not list levels as such, but some form of Level advancement exists! After all, is not Levels in OGL nothing more that getting levels in skills and abilities? Only the “way” it’s done in both games is different, the basic effect is the same.

If you took the percent based skills from RQ and divided by 5, you would have a skill rank ready made for OGL and multiplying by 5 would give you an RQ skill level.

Really, what’s the big difference?

 

[Taharqa]

Sorry, I had mistaken you for someone saying something ridiculous.

Good thing you are not running the company. The reason is simple. For twice the effort, you are mostly just cannibalizing your own customers.

Well, It would seem I would be running their company just fine, considering they seem to be doing just that.

Wrong. There is some speculation that they might consider it, and given Matt Sprange's comments on ENworld it is clear that they are aware of the cannibalization issues that you don't seem to get.

Just to be clear, since most of your posts tend to drift considerably off-topic, the OP was talking about the potential integration of Runequest with the Conan line, not Runequest itself. I have no problem with Runequest itself. If there are enough fans of the system then a revival seems like a sound business decision. But, the issue here is the possibility of developing two separate systems for the Conan line itself. IMO that would be a bad idea, because it is unlikely to recruit many new customers to the line. If you want to play in the Hyrobian age, you are already here.