Idea: fix double and triple damage weapons

[CZuschlag]

Enterprising souls could even pick up the pace a step and roll a d12 and combine it all into one.

Actually --- now that I think --- it's isomorphic to a damage table change:

Damage:
1-2: Bulkhead, do no damage or crew
3-11: Standard hit, do 1 damage and 1 crew
12: Critical hit, do 1 damage and 1 crew and roll on the critical chart and apply effects.

We can do this with no extra rolling whatsoever.

Even precise is maintained (almost perfectly!).

 

[cordas]

Having read this idea my 1st reaction is I like it. However I have thought of one problem that would need rebalancing....

Precise with either DD, TQ or even QD..... You are rolling 2-4 times as many dice each with a 1in 3 chance of scoring a crit rather than a 1 in 6 chance.

For example (I will do my best with the maths but have a stinking head cold at the moment)

you have a weapon 6AD, Beam , TD, PRECISE, SAP.

Say it scores 12 hits

Under the old system this would give an average of 4 crits.

With your new system it would give 36 "hits" giving 12 crits.

Take out the precise.

12 hits

old - average - 2 crits.
new - average 4 crits.

This makes precise even more powerfull.....

I am not saying that this breaks your improvement, just that precise would need to taken into account and either precise altered, or the ships slightly down powered.

 

[emperorpenguin]

1: Yes it would slow the game down a lot. VAS is much simpler than ACTA. Adding it to ACTA would slow it down much more.


Yes confirming crits would be an extra roll which would cause slow-down. But nowhere near as much as rolling against armour. There'd be no modifiers to the roll, and it wouldn't depend on the target's "armor" o any other value. Just pick up the dice that rolled a crit, and re-roll them.

1: Is it? I don't think so, as already said VAS features MORE dice rolls! What pulls VAS back from taking too long is that the ships don't have awkwardly high damage values. In ACTA there has been a damage creep effect with some ships into the 100s

2: It'd still add to the length of games and slow down the turn

 

[Johnny D]

Really like the D12 idea but the need for an extra set of dice for damage means I can't see it taking on.
Perhaps it would be better to limit the more devestating effects on the damage charts, or at least the more annoying results that can remove ships from the game with one hit. ie no move or no weapons are even harder to get, either that or improve the repair process.

 

[emperorpenguin]

Really like the D12 idea but the need for an extra set of dice for damage means I can't see it taking on.
Perhaps it would be better to limit the more devestating effects on the damage charts, or at least the more annoying results that can remove ships from the game with one hit. ie no move or no weapons are even harder to get, either that or improve the repair process.

what you suggested has been added to 2nd ed

 

[Burger]

Really like the D12 idea but the need for an extra set of dice for damage means I can't see it taking on.
Perhaps it would be better to limit the more devestating effects on the damage charts, or at least the more annoying results that can remove ships from the game with one hit. ie no move or no weapons are even harder to get, either that or improve the repair process.

what you suggested has been added to 2nd ed

Which part?
From what I've heard crits are even worse in 2e, such as removing traits!

 

[emperorpenguin]

From what I've heard crits are even worse in 2e, such as removing traits!

it is easier to repair crits

and yes traits can be lost but the speed 0 and no weapons are gone....

 

[katadder]

there no no weapons crit. but you right, some crits do remove traits, which you get back if you repair of course.

 

[Burger]

I vote "hurrah" for crits being easier to repair, and "boo" to losing traits. Makes some races (eg. Minbari, ISA, Drakh) suffer more than others (eg. EA, Narn, Dilgar).

 

[katadder]

true, but the more advanced your ship the more things there are can go wrong
EA can lose interceptors obviously as well. but this does tend to effect the more advanced fleets the most.

 

[H]

damn, no more praying for the no weapons crit :-(

 

[CZuschlag]

Trait loss should be handled very, VERY carefully. There are some ships out there, the ISA Whitestar comes to mind, that rely on traits for basic survival. Some are even particularly vulnerable to criticals
(GEG doesn't help stop crits, and the Drakh Raiders live on Traits alone.), the same can be said for Vorlons (no self-repair or adaptive is a huge loss), Minbari (no Stealth = ugh), and justifying some already undervalued ships (no Fleet Carrier on Brakados = pointless ship.).

I fly Dilgar as my primary race, which would benefit from Traits being lost on crits, but, as my Drakh are secondary, I see just how dangerous this could be. Trait-loss crits are .... worrisome .... from a balance perspective.

No speed zero --- Dilgar will get something else for the Mass Drivers to do, then?

 

[captainsmirk]

Well with Vorlons and other ancient races at least, things like adaptive armour and self-repair are an intergral part of the living ship, they're something the ship does naturally, not a system or organ. To disable them you'd need to actually kill the ship (or remove the Vorlon ship's entire skin...).

Seems a bit odd for them to loose those traits...


Nick

 

[katadder]

perhaps it just shocks it for a turn or something.

 

[emperorpenguin]

or hits their liver!

 

[katadder]

or the spine takes some time to grow that back so it goes with repairing the spine rather than the outer hull 1st.

 

[Burger]

But squids are invertibrates!

 

[katadder]

good job vorlons arnt squids then, otherwise planetary gravity would probably play hell with their skin.

 

[H]

would make for some interesting, if not nauseous effects!

 

[Burger]

Well we could have the smoke rules from VAS, when the Vorlons spray ink :lol: