How do characters "Level Up"?

[nezeray]

i talked to a friend about Traveller and he mentioned that he didn't like the "old" way traveller characters advance in "level". I looked in the MGP Traveller book and couldn't find anything except in initial character creation.

Am I missing something?

James / Nezeray

 

[Twi'lekk_Den-keeper]

technically, no. The only upgrading you get to do pass initial creation is train for extra skills. Personally, that doesn't suit me, so I homebrewed rules for training on the run and for charecteristic upgrades. That I can do that is really what makes traveller for me.

 

[nezeray]

technically, no. The only upgrading you get to do pass initial creation is train for extra skills. Personally, that doesn't suit me, so I homebrewed rules for training on the run and for charecteristic upgrades. That I can do that is really what makes traveller for me.

I didn't even find rules for training in extra skills.

Thanks

James / Nezeray

 

[Paladin]

pg 59

 

[nezeray]

Thanks!

Now for the next logical question. if it takes 1 week to improve a skill from 0 to 1, can you do it while in Jump Space, since the minimum travel time is 1 week?

(If there's a discussion along these lines somewhere else, feel free to post a link).

Thanks

James / Nezeray

 

[GhostWolf69]

There is nothig in the rules that says you need a trainer or access to training facilities and/or materials. But I'd say this is up to the Ref and his/her common sense.

Also: It takes a week from 0 to 1 assuming you have a skill level total of 0.

Remember training time is Level you want to reach PLUS Level Total.

/wolf

 

[Paladin]

Thanks!

Now for the next logical question. if it takes 1 week to improve a skill from 0 to 1, can you do it while in Jump Space, since the minimum travel time is 1 week?

(If there's a discussion along these lines somewhere else, feel free to post a link).

Thanks

James / Nezeray

The time periods are really more like guidelines.

It depends on whether a character is truly twiddling his thumbs during the Jump trip. There are likely other tasks to be done during the flight depending upon their role on the ship. And being able to actually plot a few courses and do a few practice jumps on their own would probably be in order.

It also depends on how much you allow technology to run things in your campaigns. If the computer does most of the work in plotting the trip and humans are only needed to try to speed things up and save time or make non-standard jumps, then it may be easier.

 

[nezeray]

I think the base problem for me is that the MGP book isn't detailed enough. I know that T5 will be a lexicon of rules, so I may pick that up, but it seems like necessary details are missing in this version.

Another Example/question:

Bob the drifter is the doctor on a ship. The ship is planning a 6 parsec trip but only has a jump 1 drive. So it takes a minimum of 6 weeks, plus refueling/resupply time, correct?

He would like to improve 2 skills: Engineer(power) 0, and Engineer (jump drive) 0 on this trip. So he would need to spend 1 week for each skill, PLUS 1 week for the fact that he's studying 2 skills at once?


James / Nezeray
newbie Traveller GM in training.

 

[Deniable]

Assuming Bob has no other skills yet, he would need 1 week for the first skill (0 total skill levels +1 new level) and 2 (1 total skill levels +1 new level) for the other skill. If he already has some skills, add these up and plug them into the numbers above. (I would hope he had some levels in medic.)

Another way to look at 'leveling up' is that the players don't need to because they are not facing bigger and badder enemies in every adventure.

 

[Maglaurus]

This came up last night during a game session I was running.

Skills can be increased using training time that takes place in terms of weeks (time spend in "jump" works very well for this as ship's computers can provide training simulations), meanwhile--I decided in my capacity as GM--characteristics are set save for the interference of futuristic science. Cloned muscle replacements, cybernetic augmentations, and drug therapy can take aged crew members back to the fonder days of youth. More radical drug and genetic therapies (almost certainly illegal) might be able to improve brain capacity or synaptic speed at the risk of turning the patient into a mutated freak.

 

[nezeray]

One thing that worries me is that most of my players are used to games were, "We completed this adventure, got some treasure, and now how many XP do we get?". If they don't go up a level every few adventures, they think they're not accomplishing anything. D&D syndrom I guess.

How do traveller players then feel like they've done something? If a character has 6 skills after character generation, it's then going to take 6weeks + 1 week per skill advancing, + 1 week per skill point they want to go up? Bob's going to need to take a sabatical to improve a skill while the others haul cargo to pay for his food while he's studying....

I'm sure I'm missing something here. I have problems seeing how my game will go beyond a couple of one-shot sessions.

James / Nezeray

 

[Paladin]

I think the base problem for me is that the MGP book isn't detailed enough. I know that T5 will be a lexicon of rules, so I may pick that up, but it seems like necessary details are missing in this version.

I agree that some sections are rules light, but I personally prefer it that way and I personally wish they would have been even more vague on skills/advancement. A cut and dried formula doesn't work for me, though I understand the need for some system for advancement (esp when the topic has come up several times in the last few months). I like the advancement method even less in other games systems like D&D where you magically see any of your skills go up with no effort simply because you squished enough stuff and solved unrelated puzzles/goals for XP.

We're going with something more "vague" and based a character participation and a bit of GM (Referee) fiat. Players will gain skills over time based on what they do during the games and what they actively try to do with their down time. But they will conveniently find their free time limited if they try to train themselves into uber-munchie characters.

One thing that worries me is that most of my players are used to games were, "We completed this adventure, got some treasure, and now how many XP do we get?". If they don't go up a level every few adventures, they think they're not accomplishing anything. D&D syndrom I guess.

The game requires a bit more maturity on rewards verses the instant gratification, mega-growth uber PC development of D&D or other game systems. Traveller lets you start with a more developed PC and offers more realistic material or intangible rewards than character focused development. Suggested rewards: Fun, money, debt reduction on ship, new ships, weapons, your life, your friends life, fame, fun, additional calories from the snacks you consumed, robots, new contacts, allies, enemies, satisfaction of a mission accomplished.

How do traveller players then feel like they've done something? If a character has 6 skills after character generation, it's then going to take 6weeks + 1 week per skill advancing, + 1 week per skill point they want to go up?

Bob's going to need to take a sabatical to improve a skill while the others haul cargo to pay for his food while he's studying....

If it happens repeatedly mock the character for being a wuss or use some other method to get them engaged. If they still refuse, interrupt their repeated training sessions with an adventure they can't refuse. kidnapping, espionage, theft, urgent request elsewhere etc.

I'm sure I'm missing something here. I have problems seeing how my game will go beyond a couple of one-shot sessions.

If you can get a solid group, I think the opposite will be true if the character creation process created a decent team with a mutual history.

 

[nezeray]

I think for official demos it's not going to matter about levelling up. I think for my regular group (10+ years together) I may use this system:

1. The official system is in effect.
2. Each time I make them roll a skill check to do something, if they pass they get a "tick" mark. Once they have 10 tick marks in the skill, that cuts a week off the training time.
3. If they aren't activly training in a skill, and they get to 10 x new level ticks, then they get the next level. example. Han has Pilot 1, he is designated pilot when in combat. If he gets 20 ticks, he gets Pilot 2.
4. You ONLY get ticks for abnormal things. driving to work everday doesn't get you ticks in Drive.

I think this will satisfy their need to advance, while keeping it slow. Of course The "bad" guys will get the same benefit for training.

James / Nezeray

 

[Duroon]

One thing that worries me is that most of my players are used to games were, "We completed this adventure, got some treasure, and now how many XP do we get?". If they don't go up a level every few adventures, they think they're not accomplishing anything. D&D syndrom I guess.

How do traveller players then feel like they've done something? If a character has 6 skills after character generation, it's then going to take 6weeks + 1 week per skill advancing, + 1 week per skill point they want to go up? Bob's going to need to take a sabatical to improve a skill while the others haul cargo to pay for his food while he's studying....

I'm sure I'm missing something here. I have problems seeing how my game will go beyond a couple of one-shot sessions.

James / Nezeray

What your missing is that those weeks of training don't have to be taken all at the same time.

The crew is in jump space a week, Bob gets to train. The following week is spent adventuring on a planet. Bob doesn't get to train. Next week is in Jump again, another week notched off from the training, and so on. D&D has indeed trained a lot of people to need that instant gratification at the end of an adventure for the improvement of their characters. At the end of a Traveller adventure hopefully your characters have earned some Cr. and get some additional time to train new skills. As GM you could award them training time if during the adventure they have used the skills they are trying to train.

Just think, in CT a character had to find a university and train for 4 years in order to gain a new skill or improve one he already had.

 

[nezeray]

I think that makes sense then.

Thanks

James / nezeray

 

[Maglaurus]

I think the D&D-habit is an issue to consider...particularly with younger players who might feel the game is a competitive rather than co-operative experience. What I found was fun for my players was to do a round or two of pure trading/transporting passengers at the end of a session. This accomplishes several things:

--Helps the crew pay their mortgage, which is like a communal experience point total.
--Gives the sense that the crew isn't having something crazy/adventurous happen in every system in which they stop.
--Gives the crew some weeks in "jump" to train-up their skills.

 

[GamerDude]

One thing that worries me is that most of my players are used to games were, "We completed this adventure, got some treasure, and now how many XP do we get?". If they don't go up a level every few adventures, they think they're not accomplishing anything. D&D syndrom I guess.

In my introduction to MGT, I tell everyone up front that there is NO XP system, no levels, and the only character advancement is through training. "Adventures" bring you money, stuff, maybe occasionally some reputation and/or social standing, but nothing in the way of XP.

The funny thing is, in all the RPG systems I've ever played in, I only recall Traveller and Paranoia as systems which have NO experiance system.

And I like that, it promotes role playing instead of "how many ex-pee do I get for killing that chipmunk" syndrome.

 

[atpollard]

And I like that, it promotes role playing instead of "how many ex-pee do I get for killing that chipmunk" syndrome.

Yeah, now we can kill all the chipmunks we want!! No more alignment drift to worry about.

 

[nezeray]

And I like that, it promotes role playing instead of "how many ex-pee do I get for killing that chipmunk" syndrome.

Yeah, now we can kill all the chipmunks we want!! No more alignment drift to worry about.

Kill the chipmunks, sell them to shifty shopkeepers, then kill them and take their goods as cargo and make billions of credits.

James / Nezeray

 

[newtraveller]

I dunno, I'm split on the whole 'no x.p.' thing.

I'm currently running an Alternity game, and am planning to switch to MGT this fall.

It took a great deal of convincing to get my fantasy group to try sci-fi at all, amidst intense grumbling regarding the skimpy experience system in Alt.

To shift to a non-experience driven game will really throw them.

And I'm not sure I'm entirely against a system that represents character improvement resulting from 'experience'.

So I think I may like to come up with an x.p. system which allows skill increases at certain points, etc.