emperorpenguin
Mongoose
Hiromoon said:
yup as did the large shield or scutum. The Romans also nicked their navy from Carthage. Rome wasn't a great inventor but it was the BEST at implementing and co-ordinating all these ideas into an effective whole
Hibernia?
- Thread starter Richgo22
- Start date
yup as did the large shield or scutum. The Romans also nicked their navy from Carthage. Rome wasn't a great inventor but it was the BEST at implementing and co-ordinating all these ideas into an effective whole
emperorpenguin
Mongoose
xeoran said:
I know this wasn't aimed at me but my opinion would be the British, Israeli and perhaps the German and french armies but the latter maybe not
emperorpenguin said:
No, feel free to answer.
Of those I would say;
Germans- no. They havent been tested under real combat since '45. Even in a current deployment like Afghanistan they are lurkign in the fairly peaceful north as oposed to helping the British/American/Canadians in the South.
French- yes-ish. Again they havent had any major conflicts in a while but they do have some excellent battle tested units. I'm interested in how they will hold up in Lebanon. Nice big overseas deployments too. Their basic infantry hasnt really seen enough service for an accurate opinion in favour of them.
Britain- yes. Probably fought more low intesity conflict than any other nation in modern times. Also fought several conventional wars and have massive overseas deployments.
Israeli- no and yes. Judging by their performence in the recent Lebanon war their Reservists are appalling. However the main army and the Golani brigade in particular are pretty good- again though they arent reall main infantry.
Well, the unfortunate thing about the Germans is that their teeth got pulled because of the wholloping the Allies gave them (plus being occupied and divided between east and west), and the guilt they flt from the holocaust.. The benefit though, for the germans is that their officer corps was one of the best in the world after WW2 (filled out with experienced soldiers, plus the country up untill the wall fell was on a war footing) and a deep sense of duty from the Cold War era. They're just recently switching from a somewhat fixed defense army to a rapid deployment force. I asked a friend who lives in Strasburg what's the disposition of French units on the border. Let's say France will be very unhappy if the Germans want to visit...
The gladius is a Celtic weapon, which the Romans found in Spain. At this time Spain was in great parts a Celtic colony. Gladius means "sword" in Spanish Celtic.
The Romans were that type of barbarians the German nazis were supposed to be.
Genocide, cultural devastation. . . and the Colusseum. When people weep at the sight of Auschwitz, they shoud cry when standing in the Colusseum in Rome. Estimates go the 2 million dead in the Colusseum, not for racism, but for games. . . . raped by animals, torn by animals, burnt, drowned ot killed in pit fighting.
Bellum Gallicum. . . 3 million gauls estimated before the war. 1 million estimated dead (through starvation and genocide, not combat), 1 million enslaved, about 1 million survived. Gaius Julus Ceasar is the first Adolf Hitler.
The Germans had the best army the world had ever seen in WWII. The Bundeswehr nowadays in badly equipped and has still to be tested. The British army is also badly equipped, but used to constant minor strifes.
Best pray that the Germans do not go to war that soon. With the nowadays weak induviduals. . . who can barely march. . . The same with most modern western countries.
We have lost the ability to wage war in the western hemisphere. The ragheads, over wich many laugh, have not.
The Romans were that type of barbarians the German nazis were supposed to be.
Genocide, cultural devastation. . . and the Colusseum. When people weep at the sight of Auschwitz, they shoud cry when standing in the Colusseum in Rome. Estimates go the 2 million dead in the Colusseum, not for racism, but for games. . . . raped by animals, torn by animals, burnt, drowned ot killed in pit fighting.
Bellum Gallicum. . . 3 million gauls estimated before the war. 1 million estimated dead (through starvation and genocide, not combat), 1 million enslaved, about 1 million survived. Gaius Julus Ceasar is the first Adolf Hitler.
The Germans had the best army the world had ever seen in WWII. The Bundeswehr nowadays in badly equipped and has still to be tested. The British army is also badly equipped, but used to constant minor strifes.
Best pray that the Germans do not go to war that soon. With the nowadays weak induviduals. . . who can barely march. . . The same with most modern western countries.
We have lost the ability to wage war in the western hemisphere. The ragheads, over wich many laugh, have not.
ehh on the historical numbers my freind . never ever think that they are right.
About the genocide . Well the romans didn't kill that much . killed man don't pay taxes . they enslaved and put big taxes on you . but 1 milion killed . how could he do that ? not enough troops . 1 milion enslaved ? and where do you transport them . such a big dislocation of people would cause hunger . not only in the future france but also in the parts the slaves would be brought to.
and that's very ,very insulting.
About the genocide . Well the romans didn't kill that much . killed man don't pay taxes . they enslaved and put big taxes on you . but 1 milion killed . how could he do that ? not enough troops . 1 milion enslaved ? and where do you transport them . such a big dislocation of people would cause hunger . not only in the future france but also in the parts the slaves would be brought to.
and that's very ,very insulting.
You also of course have to remember the good stuff the Romans brought and the fact that that was a different era. Back then what we would call war crimes were comitted by just about every army.
The British Army actually is badly equipped but battle hardened- not just in low intensity conflict- Korea, Suez, Falklands, Gulf War 1 and Gulf War 2. Not to mention around a dozen other low intesnsity conflicts.
I'd rather the Germans started sending men to Afghanistan and participating- WW2 was a long time ago and frankly the Cold War is over. Germanys army is the size (roughly) of Britians and Frances put together. They have lots of petential to be good troops.
Ragheads is a wee bit insulting. Although you are right, culturally they are different to us- probably because WW1 and 2 were pretty much decided and run from Europe.
The British Army actually is badly equipped but battle hardened- not just in low intensity conflict- Korea, Suez, Falklands, Gulf War 1 and Gulf War 2. Not to mention around a dozen other low intesnsity conflicts.
I'd rather the Germans started sending men to Afghanistan and participating- WW2 was a long time ago and frankly the Cold War is over. Germanys army is the size (roughly) of Britians and Frances put together. They have lots of petential to be good troops.
Ragheads is a wee bit insulting. Although you are right, culturally they are different to us- probably because WW1 and 2 were pretty much decided and run from Europe.
I'd argue that neither the Germans nor the British are badly equipped, and while the Germans are lacking in actual combat experience right now, they're no worse off than the average Western World soldier. Why? It's do to NATO joint excersises that include war games and training across all NATO countries (plus a few non-aligned countries too... I'm looking at you, Finland).
I is sad but true. . . our armies need a blooding, to get their stomachs set to war.
Our probable enemies, and there are a lot of them, do not value the life of a trooper as we do. That is our biggest weakness.
We can not nuke them all. We can not bomb them all. We do not outnumber them. We sell them our weapons.
We only have technology, military knowlegde and maybe, maybe, better trained fighting men.
Estimeates on the gaul dead come from historians. The romans genocided several tribes they could not "pacify".
Gaius Julius was liked by his frontline troops, for he always perferd hunger to open battle. The most gaul dead come from starvation.
The gauls had the best troops at this time. All the references to them as "barbarians" come from the romans. It is the same with iraqi freedom fighters, whom the USA refer to as "terrorists". . .
No one wants to fight freedom fighters, who fight the enemies who invaded their home. Bet get rid of terrorists. The same counts for England.
Do not get me wrong, I am British, and i like the US (but I fear them too, the sheer wight of ignorance).
The gauls and the druids got wiped out on the continent because they did not realize that the Romans wanted them extinct. The Romans did not had conquest in mind. Ceasar/ Hitler aimed for the destruction of the druids, bearers of Celtic culture and resistance.
The gauls were divided and were defeated one by one (as the jews could not believe the nazies to kill them all, or the Irish by the British in the 15th and 16th century, of the Corse by the French in the 19th century).
Our probable enemies, and there are a lot of them, do not value the life of a trooper as we do. That is our biggest weakness.
We can not nuke them all. We can not bomb them all. We do not outnumber them. We sell them our weapons.
We only have technology, military knowlegde and maybe, maybe, better trained fighting men.
Estimeates on the gaul dead come from historians. The romans genocided several tribes they could not "pacify".
Gaius Julius was liked by his frontline troops, for he always perferd hunger to open battle. The most gaul dead come from starvation.
The gauls had the best troops at this time. All the references to them as "barbarians" come from the romans. It is the same with iraqi freedom fighters, whom the USA refer to as "terrorists". . .
No one wants to fight freedom fighters, who fight the enemies who invaded their home. Bet get rid of terrorists. The same counts for England.
Do not get me wrong, I am British, and i like the US (but I fear them too, the sheer wight of ignorance).
The gauls and the druids got wiped out on the continent because they did not realize that the Romans wanted them extinct. The Romans did not had conquest in mind. Ceasar/ Hitler aimed for the destruction of the druids, bearers of Celtic culture and resistance.
The gauls were divided and were defeated one by one (as the jews could not believe the nazies to kill them all, or the Irish by the British in the 15th and 16th century, of the Corse by the French in the 19th century).
they were divided by tribes, true, but some of those tribes were only a single step from creating a working nation/government-even after theconquest of the Gallia,there were still enough celts in the rest of europe to do so, but instead they were incorporated into newer cultures over time. in fact that situation was quite prelevant in europe-there were a few "nests" from which real countries could evolve even in the neolithic/ bronze, but none of them really managed to do so-be it because of other tribes gaining power/migrating, or other unknown to us reasons. it's actually quite frustrating to read that there could be a civilization in the middle of the europe at the same time it was found in middle east, and then "bam", we'r back to the little tribes. must be something in the soil or climate since even now the EU is nothing more than a gathering of national countries instead of one political body :lol:
Well, Richgo, I fear English cooking... so I guess it balances out. 
As for the Barbarians and Terrorist lables, you're really going to have to look at the definitions of those words, they're not similar and most certainly not used in the same manner. And the Caeser/Hitler comment is totally out of line.
And the Gauls with their Druid priestly caste were not wiped out because the Romans wanted them dead, and infact they never really were. Romans never really wanted anyone dead as long as they paid their taxes. It was never about securing Roman Security after the Etruscans were defeated (and even then wiping them out was more of a revenge thing after the Roman army was humiliated). And invading Gaul was more of a response to Rome being raided every time there was a wine shipment (Celts enjoyed raiding Roman territories..).
Vercingetorix banded what celtic tribes he could (hey, they were a very proud warrior culture) and did make war on Julius Caeser's invasion of Gaul, only to be (and apparently both men had the greatest respect for each other) trapped in the city of Alesia by Caeser's siege lines.
Otherwise, the only time Caeser wiped a population of a city off the face of the earth was 40,000 people in the tribal city of Avaricum.
As for the Barbarians and Terrorist lables, you're really going to have to look at the definitions of those words, they're not similar and most certainly not used in the same manner. And the Caeser/Hitler comment is totally out of line.
And the Gauls with their Druid priestly caste were not wiped out because the Romans wanted them dead, and infact they never really were. Romans never really wanted anyone dead as long as they paid their taxes. It was never about securing Roman Security after the Etruscans were defeated (and even then wiping them out was more of a revenge thing after the Roman army was humiliated). And invading Gaul was more of a response to Rome being raided every time there was a wine shipment (Celts enjoyed raiding Roman territories..).
Vercingetorix banded what celtic tribes he could (hey, they were a very proud warrior culture) and did make war on Julius Caeser's invasion of Gaul, only to be (and apparently both men had the greatest respect for each other) trapped in the city of Alesia by Caeser's siege lines.
Otherwise, the only time Caeser wiped a population of a city off the face of the earth was 40,000 people in the tribal city of Avaricum.
The oldest civilization were not found in the middle east. . . the were found in Europe.
Think of the Disk of Gera. . . that think is a star calendar, made before the pyraminds were build. The tribes of nowadays Sachsen (Saxon) went south in this time to settle the part of the world later known as Greece. The Greek had bule eyes and were blond, as many "Romans" were. This took place some 3500 B.C.
The greatest civilization were, in my opinion, the Celts, or the Celtic Empire.
Brennus saked Rome, but was loathe to destroy it. Ohters, the Romans, make destruction the only goal of a state. They destroyed Carthage, the Punic Empire.
But in the end, Rome was crushed by the Germans, as some celtic druids had foreseen about a 500 years before. . .
Think of the Disk of Gera. . . that think is a star calendar, made before the pyraminds were build. The tribes of nowadays Sachsen (Saxon) went south in this time to settle the part of the world later known as Greece. The Greek had bule eyes and were blond, as many "Romans" were. This took place some 3500 B.C.
The greatest civilization were, in my opinion, the Celts, or the Celtic Empire.
Brennus saked Rome, but was loathe to destroy it. Ohters, the Romans, make destruction the only goal of a state. They destroyed Carthage, the Punic Empire.
But in the end, Rome was crushed by the Germans, as some celtic druids had foreseen about a 500 years before. . .
Hiro, why do you think the Romans had a "commissar command" to kill captive druids, like the nazis with the Russian commissars.
Vercingetorix died as a captive after years in a cell, after a beeing paraded as slave through rome. . . good friendship and mutual respect.
Defintions:
Terrorists. . . unlawful fighter who target civilians to spread fear (terror).
Freedom fighter. . . rightious fighters who target invasion forces to gain freedom from occupation.
The Cisalpine gaul were allies of Rome before the war. Later, after helping Rome conquesting their own people, the became slaves. . .
The druids only survived in Ireland and Britan. Why do you think nowadays French are in fact Germans (Franken - a German tribe) and not gauls, of whom they are so proud of).
Ceasar/ Hitler and Rome had realized who their enemy was: the druids, beares of culture and knowlege. Why do you think they did not ignore them (barbarians. . .) but took great pains to kill them. And then that big progagande war (almost 2000 years before Göbbels). Even today people think that druids were man eating, human sacrifing (wicker man) barbarions.
- while the Romans enjoyed rape and slaughter in the circus.
Think twice, Hiro.
Vercingetorix died as a captive after years in a cell, after a beeing paraded as slave through rome. . . good friendship and mutual respect.
Defintions:
Terrorists. . . unlawful fighter who target civilians to spread fear (terror).
Freedom fighter. . . rightious fighters who target invasion forces to gain freedom from occupation.
The Cisalpine gaul were allies of Rome before the war. Later, after helping Rome conquesting their own people, the became slaves. . .
The druids only survived in Ireland and Britan. Why do you think nowadays French are in fact Germans (Franken - a German tribe) and not gauls, of whom they are so proud of).
Ceasar/ Hitler and Rome had realized who their enemy was: the druids, beares of culture and knowlege. Why do you think they did not ignore them (barbarians. . .) but took great pains to kill them. And then that big progagande war (almost 2000 years before Göbbels). Even today people think that druids were man eating, human sacrifing (wicker man) barbarions.
- while the Romans enjoyed rape and slaughter in the circus.
Think twice, Hiro.
ehh you are very ,very wrong . the romans did nothing to the druids . and they is like one roman text about them .
after the romans defeted the guals most of them [after a time ] were happy . no inter wars a good trade market .the taxes weren't so high. and the romas defended them from the geraman tribes. there were lots of intermarriages and slowly the gual turned in to romans . the romans brought more good then bad to the gauls . and the druids died out cos no one wanted to hear them . the roman gods were simiular but te worship less extrem . for example did you know that gauls belived that for a warrior to return save from war a live had to be sacrifficed ?
ok . and so a russian partisan that attacks a train in WWII is a terrorsit (cos the train is maned by civilians ). and what if some nation just invades your land like germans did to poland or czech republic,they say it's they land and suddenly your a terrorist? Ben Gurion attackin britsh hotels and schools was a terrorist? Cos in Israel he is the founding father.
You're definition of freedom fighter work only if the partisans wait for some other country to save them . If no one does , they have to attack those places that hurt most. So is war.
Acutally Richgo, he was strangled (or beheaded). And no, they didn't have a "commissar command" kill order.
Definition of Terrorist as by Princeton:
a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities
Definition of Freedom Fighter as by Princeton:
insurgent: a person who takes part in an armed rebellion against the constituted authority (especially in the hope of improving conditions)
And while I'm not one to go by WikiPedia, it sure as heck beats the book you're learning from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druidry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Caesar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commentarii_de_Bello_Gallico
Might I suggest you find a translation of the Commentarii de Bello Gallico and do some learning on your own with an open mind?
As for the games of Rome, I suggest you read this:
http://janusquirinus.org/essays/Arena.html
Definition of Terrorist as by Princeton:
a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities
Definition of Freedom Fighter as by Princeton:
insurgent: a person who takes part in an armed rebellion against the constituted authority (especially in the hope of improving conditions)
And while I'm not one to go by WikiPedia, it sure as heck beats the book you're learning from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druidry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Caesar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commentarii_de_Bello_Gallico
Might I suggest you find a translation of the Commentarii de Bello Gallico and do some learning on your own with an open mind?
As for the games of Rome, I suggest you read this:
http://janusquirinus.org/essays/Arena.html
