Herbalish, Patar and Herbwardens?


Does anyone know what relations and differences there are between them? :?: As I said on another thread, I never was quite clear about that, but maybe someone else here has access to some helpful lore ...

What I do know (minor background spoilers may follow):

  • The Herbalish were (and probably still are) a clan of goodly druids who had helped the surviving Elder Magi to escape their enemies during the years of the Great Plague, and who, following that, waged war on the Cenerese and were victorious.

    The Patar were a Drodarin race who served the Elder Magi and in return they were entrusted with their new-found secrets of herbcraft and druidic lore. Later they betrayed that trust and allied with the Cener Druids. After the Cenerese unleashed the deadly plague that decimated the Elder Magi, these two allies rose to power for a short time. After their defeat at the hands of the Herbalish, the shamed Patar made a solemn vow to redeem themselves by devoting themselves to the healing arts. Their descendants became known as the Redeemers. (Hm, now would that mean that the Redeemers have magical abilities as well?)

    About the Herbwardens I know only that they are known as the Herbwardens of Bautar, who seemed to have a watchful eye on the machinations of the Cener Druids and who later worked together with the Elder Magi on restoring the volcanic wasteland of the Darklands to its former fertile state. What makes the matter a bit more complicated is that Madin Rendalim has been called a "Durenese herbwarden". That could mean that other countries can have herbwardens of their own, though I always (okay, always since I stumbled over this conundrum) that Madin was taught that art/craft by the Herbwardens of Bautar and therefore was something special ...
Does anyone of you know more details about them? I just cannot shake the feeling that there's more to that, at least as far as the relations between the Herbalish and the Herbwardens of Bautar are concerned. (For example, are they maybe even one and the same? If not, where do the Herbalish live?)

*remembers a post on the Place your mark on Magnamund! thread*

That was completely new to me (the "splinter group" thing, I mean); does anyone know more about that - or any relations of the Cener Druids to the groups above? I always thought they were a separate group, but as I never had a chance to buy the Magnamund Companion or the New Order books (and am missing a number of the Grand Master books as well), I could have missed a lot of information on all of these groups ... :cry:

The Herbalish and the Herbwardens of Bautar are one and the same. If you have got the main book check the gazateer for Bautar and there is some information there. So the Herbalish live in Bautar and it seems that they have some very interesting ranger sidekicks as well. It took me quite a while to find Bautar on the map as it is so small.

I guess herbwarden is quite a generic term but means something different when applied to the Herbalish. It is possible that Madin Rendalim was trained by the Herbalish he does seem extraordinariliy skilled.

In the couple of examples that I remember Redeemers showing up in the books they did hand out potions. Grey Star got a calecena potion and Lone Wolf got a potion of Holy Water. So I guess that they still have there powers. They would make quite an interesting PC class with there vow of scilence and all.