Female characters in Runequest

[Utgardloki]

I just got the Runequest book. (YEAY!!!!!). Now I want to change the rules.

Firstly, I've worked out size and weight tables that make sense for humans sized 3-18, so I can use a straight 3-18 range for human characters.

Secondly, I propose giving female characters the following modifiers: -2 Strength, +2 Constitution, +2 Charisma. Also, female characters with a Size above 8 get -4 to Size.

(I might change the Size figures after studying the rules in more detail. The intention is to reflect the difference in size between the average male and female characters. My tables have a Size 3 equivalent to 81 pounds and a Size 6)

The result is that females would do less damage in HTH combat, but would get other advantages to offset that. What I want is something that is fair and balanced.

Any thoughts?

 

[Nephilim]

Cue joke about "...and males should have -2 Int and -2 Wis..."

I've personally always liked giving females the same range of attributes as males. Yes, there are physical differences in the sexes, and males tend to have more upper-body strength, etc., etc., but the attributes we use in RPG's are such gross measures that it really doesn't capture that level of nuance, in my opinion.

If you're concerned about having the sexes be "fair and balanced," the easiest way is to not unbalance them in the first place. Heh.

 

[Lord Twig]

So that would make my wife a Siz 3 (she is 4'11" tall and was 78 pounds when I met her). Hmmm, not sure about that. What size would a Duck or Trollkin be?

We did allow for different stats for women in our old RQ game, but we made them optional. So if you wanted a female character with the same stats as males you could.

As for the changes to make, I would say -2 Str, -2 Siz and +2 Con. A negative to Siz really isn't that big a disadvantage. Where do you get the +2 Charisma from? Maybe you could say that they get +2 to Charisma vs. Human males? (They seem to against you. )

 

[Utgardloki]

For my "Audor" D&D campaign, I made the adjustments optional for PCs, and also designed adjustments for each ethnic group, also optional: one was strong but not too bright, etc.

For "Tales of the Association", I'd like to get the feel of the 1970s TV show. That's my motivation for this exercise.

 

[simonh]

I just got the Runequest book. (YEAY!!!!!). Now I want to change the rules.

Proof positive that the spirit of RuneQuest lives on!

Simon Hibbs

 

[H]

I just got the Runequest book. (YEAY!!!!!). Now I want to change the rules.

Firstly, I've worked out size and weight tables that make sense for humans sized 3-18, so I can use a straight 3-18 range for human characters.

Secondly, I propose giving female characters the following modifiers: -2 Strength, +2 Constitution, +2 Charisma. Also, female characters with a Size above 8 get -4 to Size.

(I might change the Size figures after studying the rules in more detail. The intention is to reflect the difference in size between the average male and female characters. My tables have a Size 3 equivalent to 81 pounds and a Size 6)

The result is that females would do less damage in HTH combat, but would get other advantages to offset that. What I want is something that is fair and balanced.

Any thoughts?

It might make sense for peasents, but for actual adventurers, why will a woman not be as strong as a man. Anyone remember Chyna the woman wrestler, she'd kick my ass any day! just like a man can be a wimp, a woman can be strong, so why play with he stats?

 

[bluejay]

Right but I'm guessing there weren't any hormone injections available around on Glorantha...

Seriously the only really strong women I know have been injecting themselves with steroids for so long that they'd have to measure Gender in percentage terms...

Not that this affects RQ gaming in any way. We're not really after realism are we?

 

[mthomason]

The result is that females would do less damage in HTH combat, but would get other advantages to offset that. What I want is something that is fair and balanced.

Any thoughts?

Give everyone the option of shuffling attributes (-2 here is +2 there, with a few obvious restrictions), thus allowing the players the choice of whether their female characters resemble eastern european shot-putters or not

 

[mala]

Any thoughts?

Just because a girl is physically small or diminutive in size compared to her male counterparts does not make her incapable of accomplishing the same feats. I could go into a long and likely boring feminist dissertation at this point, but that is quite a different discussion. Suffice it to say that an exceptional person, male or female, will find a way to accomplish a goal. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I've always viewed the point of role-playing to be to play exceptional characters.

 

[atgxtg]

IN my olf RQ3 campaigns (RQ3 gives females 2d6+2 for STR and 2d6+3 for SIZ) I used to give women a bonus to DEX and CON.

THe rational was that the woman are often more graceful. In part is is due to the low SIZ, but it is also something of a curcular development. THey are smaller so agility skills copme easier, so they use them more, and thus have a better DEX.

The CON boost was to reflect the "heath based" cultures where MOms would stay at home and tend to all the family when they were sick. Thus mothers were exposed more, and developed a higher resistance to illness.

TOgether the bonuses helped to offset the lower STR and SIZ. THose who wanted to roll "heroic" women could use the "Man" stat rolls.

 

[bluejay]

Well MRQ isn't out to model realism is it? I find it a little unfair towards women in roleplaying games because stats tend to reflect things like raw strength or endurance...

Unfortunately in the real world the stats are unbelievably biased ... maximum male clean and jerk lift: 266kg, maximum female clean and jerk lift: 182kg.

Mind you, given that it's all based on the Athletics skill there's no real disadvantage being limited on Strength anyway (give or take a couple of percentage points)...

If we really wanted to be more realistic we would tie Strength more closely to Size as well. Also Size would be a big advantage in combat like it is in real life (believe me the reach far outweighs being a bigger target).

I've got to say that it really doesn't come into play in my games at all and I don't care less how realistic things are...

 

[Rurik]

I think it is hard enough to get women into gaming without starting them off by saying: You get to roll less because your character is a woman (assuming of course they roll up a woman character).

I realize it may be more realistic, but honesty is not always the best bet. Like the "does my butt look fat?" question.

 

[bluejay]

Ah, good point there Rurik... I never think of that as my group is equally split: 2 men and 2 women. I have to say that my female players often complain about unrealistic women (such as being hugely strong) more than the men do.

Not super-important to me I've got to be honest.

 

[King Amenjar]

I wouldn't be inclined to cut STR, because in RQ rules, SIZ limits doing "Strength stuff" to a degree anyway. A compensation for the lowered SIZ and consequent loss of HP (eek!) would be to give increased DEX, say 2D6+6 - if women are smaller and not as strong as men, then they are more dextrous in many ways. Of course, if someone wanted a Xena type female warrior, I would let them roll as normal.

In fact... what tended to happen in our group was that everyone rolled as normal, but if someone got low SIZ anyway, they would decide to play a female character.

 

[bluejay]

Yeah. that tended to happen in my group a lot as well KA.

 

[Rurik]

Ah, good point there Rurik... I never think of that as my group is equally split: 2 men and 2 women. I have to say that my female players often complain about unrealistic women (such as being hugely strong) more than the men do.

Not super-important to me I've got to be honest.

But they've been assimilated (meaning the women gamers in your group). We don't want to piss off the potential inductees!

My post was mostly joking - but I have known girls to say the RQ3 seperate stats for women weren't fair.

 

[GbajiTheDeceiver]

I don't really think SIZ matters that much (stop laughing down the back!) The great thing about it is that there are also advantages to having a low SIZ that balance things out. I'd personally leave the rest of the stats alone.

 

[atgxtg]

I think different stats for females is fine, if they get something to compenstate for it. I use to give extra points to DEX and CON to offset the SIZ & STR limits.

I could also see somethin glike +2 CON, +2 DEX, +2 CHA/APP

The last would reflect that women are generally better at social interaction, and that in most cultures women put more effort into thier appearance than men. All that effort should pay off somehow.

 

[RMS]

I'm not a fan of doing these types of adjustments for PCs. For NPCs, I just make up the stats anyway, so I'd make up any female STR and SIZ stats just like male ones: as I perceive the character, so the females will be smaller and less strong on average.

The real issue with this for me though is that it's an attempt to be "realistic" and then in the name of fairness you add a bunch of unrealistic changes in to other stats. If you're goal is realism, then lower STR and SIZ for females and don't adjust anything else. That's the way it is in the real world: men are significantly bigger, faster, and stronger than women. There's no fairness about it. It's just the way it is. There is no compensation on the other end, unless you include increased lifespans for women. (Even that is a very modern thing. Historically, men outlive women by a significant number of years. However, magical healing might be a good equalizer there.)

So, I just skip any adjustments. In fact, historically, I skip die rolling for stats. I let me players stat up the character as the picture them and go from there. I have never had someone want to run a STR or SIZ 16-18 (maybe even 15) female warrior in RQ, thought I'd have certainly allowed it if someone wanted such a character. It'd be more rare in the world than a male with those stats, but PCs should be those exceptional characters if they exist IMO.

 

[Halfbat]

I'd leave it to the players: depends what they want to do. Adventurers are hero types after all.

Also Size would be a big advantage in combat like it is in real life (believe me the reach far outweighs being a bigger target).

Ask any younger sibling trying to hit bigger sibling whilst being held off wiht one arm! :lol: