I've NEVER played RQ or even read any of the books. That being said, I was wondering how important "dungeons" are to the game. D20 pretty much revolves around meeting at the tavern and delving the local dungeon that was built to be plundered. Hearing how plot driven RQ is, I'm guessing that things are a bit different.
Dungeons
- Thread starter Mac V
- Start date
Yeah, I know the only limits are you're imagination routine. Good for you. I'm just talking about the TYPICAL types of adventures you'd most commonly run into. Most D20 modules seem to revolve around some sort of fixed location with multiple levels to plunder. How's it go with RQ?
My experience has been that dungeons in RQ are the exception rather than the rule.
Pavis and the Big Rubble and Griffin Mountain/Island are good examples of typical RuneQuest play and most of the adventuring was done outside. That said both Apple Lane and Snake Pipe Hollow had extensive caves. There were never really any worked dungeons.
The Glorantha supplements I have used encouraged travel to exotic places over delving into the ground somewhere.
Pavis and the Big Rubble and Griffin Mountain/Island are good examples of typical RuneQuest play and most of the adventuring was done outside. That said both Apple Lane and Snake Pipe Hollow had extensive caves. There were never really any worked dungeons.
The Glorantha supplements I have used encouraged travel to exotic places over delving into the ground somewhere.
Hmm, hard to say. If there was one central theme that the "typical" RQ adventure was (if there is such a thing), it would probably be based not around a 'dungeon' per se, but around a community.
Now, that community might be a town, or it might be a orlanthi lord and his men, or it might be a insect-raising family of trolls, or it might be a temple complex to Yelmalio. Heck, it might even be a 'dungeon,' in the more traditional sense, but even there, the emphasis will not be so much on the walls and stone, but how the elements -- be they family or townsfolk, monsters or priests -- interact with each other and how that can and will affect others (notably, the PCs).
Yeah, old RQ was usually based around a community. Typically with several subgroups. The player characters typically worked to solve various problems for thier subgroup, and occasionally the community at large.
It is sort of difficlut to translate this into something that a D&D dungeon develer canrelate to. In some ways, RQ is like an exact opposite to old time D&D. In RQ, all the stuff that the group tries tog et through quikcly so that they can get on with the adventure (killing monsters and stealing treasure), actually is the adventure, and killing monsters anf fighting is somewhat secondary. Rather than spending most of the night going from fight to fight, RQ has fewer combat, but they tend to be more intense, since the risks are greater.
In D&D a 1HD monster really is no threat to a 5th level fighter, let alone to a 15th level fighter. In RQ, a spearpoint though the eye is usualy fatal no matter how experienced a fighter is. THis means that there is always some risk of getting killed whenever you are fighting someone, even someone who is inept. THe foe can always get lucky and roll a critical, or you can always screw up and fumble. THis makes ever fight dangerous, and thus, exciting.
It is sort of difficlut to translate this into something that a D&D dungeon develer canrelate to. In some ways, RQ is like an exact opposite to old time D&D. In RQ, all the stuff that the group tries tog et through quikcly so that they can get on with the adventure (killing monsters and stealing treasure), actually is the adventure, and killing monsters anf fighting is somewhat secondary. Rather than spending most of the night going from fight to fight, RQ has fewer combat, but they tend to be more intense, since the risks are greater.
In D&D a 1HD monster really is no threat to a 5th level fighter, let alone to a 15th level fighter. In RQ, a spearpoint though the eye is usualy fatal no matter how experienced a fighter is. THis means that there is always some risk of getting killed whenever you are fighting someone, even someone who is inept. THe foe can always get lucky and roll a critical, or you can always screw up and fumble. THis makes ever fight dangerous, and thus, exciting.
All true. I can add that not just RQ but all BRP games tend to be like that. Some of the printed Stormbringer scenarios would be like D&D(a few are, period) if you lined all the encounters up, I guess, but there is usually plenty of opportunity for different kinds of activity between combat encounters. As stated above, the 'intermission' activity tends to revolve around some type of community. I never really thought about it before but it is definitely a fact.
Mac V said:
Great. Just considered yourself warned. In my experience people used to D&D have some difficulties adjusting the RQ at first. Most of them end up prefering RQ once they get familar with it and start to understand the things they can do in RQ that they can't do in D&D.
Mac V said:
If you like to play the most time in dungeons then MRQ is maybe not the best choice because its very deadly. I mean if you go from this room killing things to that room killing things, then its quite sure that in the one of next rooms you will be the next to be killed.
But of course trying BRP out is always a good thing. At the beginning the minimalism (without XP, character classes etc.) will probably feel a little bit bleak to you but the more you play with it the more you will like BRP
Chardros The Reaper
Mongoose
Yeah, D&D has always focused on dungeon crawls (it is part of their name after all-which is also why we also get several hundred species of dragons...) but I think the prevalance of dungeons in gaming is due to the fact that it is much easier to design a linear adventure around an underground maze. Gamemastering can be very tough, especially I've found this true with D&D which really is not a simple system.
RQ, however, is much easier on the GM and therefore I think makes it more suitable to non-linear adventures, but of course, works easily well in a more bear-and-pretzels type scenario. I've found that the more basic systems promote more detail in actual role-playing instead of meta-gaming. Heck, I ran Stormbringer 4th edition for two years and I don't recall ever using a dungeon!
RQ, however, is much easier on the GM and therefore I think makes it more suitable to non-linear adventures, but of course, works easily well in a more bear-and-pretzels type scenario. I've found that the more basic systems promote more detail in actual role-playing instead of meta-gaming. Heck, I ran Stormbringer 4th edition for two years and I don't recall ever using a dungeon!
Durand Durand
Banded Mongoose
If dungeon crawling really is your bag, the many ages of Glorantha have seen cultures and civilisations rise and fall. There should be plenty of ruins, cave systems, old forts, bandits and cultural enemies to keep you busy. There should be a plethora of forbidden places to visit, temples to rob (enemy temples, not your own), merchants to rob, bandits ot slay and stories to tell. It's a big wide world and there is a lot to see.
Typically, your altimate enemy is chaos, but their are plenty of secondary enemies and encounters who make things difficult, and things are not always clear cut.For instance...
A) Those hulking trolls (Uz) who beat up your local militia were only protecting them, more specifically, keeping the guards out of mothers reach and thus causing a 'real' diplomatic incident.
B) The mysterious black skinned individual breaking into homes and sawing the legs off honoured citizens is really a De-tailed Newtling out for revenge on tail-meat traders. Eating sentients is generally considered a faux par by everyone except for Chaotics and Uz. Eat uncle Zoorb will you? You tail-eating *%(*^.
C) The man being held down by four thugs in that alley while a robed man cuts at his tounge with a knife is really undergoing an expensive language course to broaden his job prospects and outlook on life. He'd be upthet if you interupted.
D) That handsome captain being lashed to his ships mast while his crew plug their ears with wax is really just a bit of eyecandy bait to lure merwomen near enough to harpoon, kill [purely for research purposes, of course] and sell to sorcerers, butchers and exotic perfumers.
... golly, who'd want to go into a dungeon anyway. Only Uz, Mostali and choas fleeing the righteous wrath of the law.
DD
Typically, your altimate enemy is chaos, but their are plenty of secondary enemies and encounters who make things difficult, and things are not always clear cut.For instance...
A) Those hulking trolls (Uz) who beat up your local militia were only protecting them, more specifically, keeping the guards out of mothers reach and thus causing a 'real' diplomatic incident.
B) The mysterious black skinned individual breaking into homes and sawing the legs off honoured citizens is really a De-tailed Newtling out for revenge on tail-meat traders. Eating sentients is generally considered a faux par by everyone except for Chaotics and Uz. Eat uncle Zoorb will you? You tail-eating *%(*^.
C) The man being held down by four thugs in that alley while a robed man cuts at his tounge with a knife is really undergoing an expensive language course to broaden his job prospects and outlook on life. He'd be upthet if you interupted.
D) That handsome captain being lashed to his ships mast while his crew plug their ears with wax is really just a bit of eyecandy bait to lure merwomen near enough to harpoon, kill [purely for research purposes, of course] and sell to sorcerers, butchers and exotic perfumers.
... golly, who'd want to go into a dungeon anyway. Only Uz, Mostali and choas fleeing the righteous wrath of the law.
DD
Enpeze said:
Not to mention the fact that the "thing" in the next room will probably have heard you killing the "thing" next door, and will be prepared and call for reinforcements. No going room to room beating up opponents with 14th your party strength. Intead, the whole complex will probably come down on the group-just what an intelligent group of foes should do.
Oops, I mentioned it.
This sounds like fun. I never really liked running the liniar thing. Too much work memorizing minutia. I always loved running CoC senarios that listed a few speific locations with clues/encounters and important NPC's and their motivations. It always semed to flow better instead of having to look up how many orcs have how many silver coins....
ONe of the reason why RQ run differenet is that the monsters are different that D&D monsters. Many of RQ "monsters" such as Trolls, Broo and Minotaurs, are actually intelligent species. THey think and use tactics, magic and equipment. THis makes them far more formidable foes. Of course, they are not always your enemies either. Some characters might have firends who are Trolls or Minotaurs.
RQ Monsters on the other hand, come of as nastier than thier D&D counterparts, mostly due to the games fixed hit system (that is your hit points stay about the same throught the course of the campaign). A character who started the campaign with 12 hit points is probably going to end it with around 12 hit points, that is unless he trains up his CON or has some sort of CON or SIZ enhancing magic, or if he looses CON.
THe net effect of fizxed hit points is that, since most monsters are stronger and larger than humans, they have larger damage bonuses. In D&D, having a monster get a +7 to damage from STR certainly has an impact, but not quite as much as it wouldhave in RQ. A creature with a 22d6 damage bonus (the equivalanet to +7) is going to tear through armor and inflict very serious injuries.
RQ Monsters on the other hand, come of as nastier than thier D&D counterparts, mostly due to the games fixed hit system (that is your hit points stay about the same throught the course of the campaign). A character who started the campaign with 12 hit points is probably going to end it with around 12 hit points, that is unless he trains up his CON or has some sort of CON or SIZ enhancing magic, or if he looses CON.
THe net effect of fizxed hit points is that, since most monsters are stronger and larger than humans, they have larger damage bonuses. In D&D, having a monster get a +7 to damage from STR certainly has an impact, but not quite as much as it wouldhave in RQ. A creature with a 22d6 damage bonus (the equivalanet to +7) is going to tear through armor and inflict very serious injuries.
waiwode said:atgxtg said:
361 - 376, according to RQ3!
(Which is an average of +77 damage ... the RQ version of Sauron sweeping armies away with his "left-over" damage, I guess).
Oops, a typo. THat was supposed to be a 2d6 damage bonus. THe idea being an average of +7 equalling a +7 in D&D 3E. Sorry about that. Glad that I didn't do that in an adventure book, one black bear could wipe out a gaming group. :shock:
atgxtg said:waiwode said:atgxtg said:
361 - 376, according to RQ3!
(Which is an average of +77 damage ... the RQ version of Sauron sweeping armies away with his "left-over" damage, I guess).
Oops, a typo. THat was supposed to be a 2d6 damage bonus. THe idea being an average of +7 equalling a +7 in D&D 3E. Sorry about that. Glad that I didn't do that in an adventure book, one black bear could wipe out a gaming group. :shock:
A +7 damage bonus in D&D means STR 24-25. I'm not sure how big a damage bonus that would end up with in the new RQ (depends on SIZ too), but 2d6 to 3d6 sounds about right.
That's pretty much "one hit and youre out, and propably dead" stuff.
Adept said:
In RQ3 it would take a combined Str of 41-56 to get that +2D6 bonus. Well above where anything human is coming in to roost, not out of the question for Trolls.
A quick glance at the Dragon stats in the previews reveal an average Str of 70 and a SIZ of 65 ... that's +7D6 damage in the old system. A glance at the new damage stat for that dragon shows a dragon claw does a D8 + 3D12 ... obviously they've updated the extra damage section, but whether +3D12 or +7D6 I'm still not volunteering to be attacked by a dragon.
Of course the Dwarf and Duck listed have 4 to 8 hit points in each location. Without serious spells or armour coming in to play, one hit from that troll with a big lead heavy-mace (1D8+1+2D6) is one body part destroyed/ mangled/ decapitated.
Parry with your quarterstaff? Ker-runch! Good-by quarterstaff, hello jagged clubs!
Even a Kite Shield will take a real beating when you're facing a Troll ... the Shield can soak up 10 hits with each successful parry, but the 18 hit points aren't going to last forever!
Doug.
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