Drinax & General Piracy Questions

[vladthemad]

Greetings,

I've been running the Drinax campaign for some friends, and many annoying issues have popped up. One large problem I'm finding is that rules are scattered throughout different books, and even related rules are scattered about in the same book. Slows play to a crawl while I try to find a rule related to something. *shakes his fist*

Enough grumbling...and on to a few actual questions. First, if King Oleb actually wants thieves and not murderers and cutthroats as he claims, why does the Harrier have a particle beam cannon? Isn't a weapon that causes automatic radiation damage to crew every time it hits the exact opposite of what he wants? Is it even a "legal" weapon in the eyes of the Imperium? Flying around in a military grade ship carrying military grade weaponry makes it pretty difficult to appear as anything BUT a dirty pirate.

I thought about just dropping the radiation component to the particle beam weapon, but would that be in keeping with reality? Maybe change it to EMP damage instead? What would be the pros and cons of this?

Also, the Scoundrel book give times for transferring cargo in various ways between ships, but doesn't have an explanation as to how large a container is. I also couldn't find that referenced in any other books. If they are one dTon the times listed on Scoundrel p.50 make sense to me. If they are larger the times seem rather small. Even in zero-G I'd think moving a 20 dTon container full of ore from one ship to the other would take more than 1d6 minutes! If such was the case you could offload a heavy freighter in 30 minutes to 3 hours. Rather fast for 550 tons of cargo. Can someone shed some light on this?

 

[Reynard]

The Harrier was fighting a war when it went missing. I'm assuming the campaign is giving the crew an edge in what will be a dangerous campaign. I know our crew made great use of it without slaughtering everything in sight. Make use of the Called Shots rule or the Attacking Engines skill task in Scoundrel to help end a battle quicker with less crew casualties. The PA is great for taking a specific location out. A PA makes you think before firing and that's why we also fixed and put less deadly weapons in the other turret.

Oh, as to the PA being illegal, 1) We're pirates, 2) It's the Trojan Reach and not anyone's territory and 3) We head for less restrictive ports. Avoid Imperial ports with high law levels, period.

Our referee determined pod sizes and what they contained as he saw fit. We inspected and decided which we wanted. The Harrier has fairly generous cargo section. It's not about exact numbers. Cargo containers can represent the closest size to what amount being held. They can't be too big if carried by adventure ships or they become unwieldy to load and unload with cargo handling drones and equipment.

Traikhetouh of the Harrier 'Raven' or aslan 'Ktaouhaaaw' wishes good luck with the campaign!

 

[Mytholder]

For simplicity's sake, I always assume containers are one dTon.

 

[allanimal]

The pirates in my campaign would often fire a warning shot with that big particle beam and then radio in and ask for a surrender - "the next shot won't miss".

Well, until they got into hot water with the Imperium and decided the could lay low by flying a less conspicuous ship with less conspicuous weapons. It only kind of worked out for them.

*sign* we've been on hiatus for a while, I think it is time to start up again. See what trouble they will get into this time... We left off at a point where they could be really dangerous and once false move will jump them from minor annoyance to the Imperium to "public enemy #3". (I think they have a while before they would actually get to #1, but they have been known to surprise me...)

Yeah, gotta start doing the Drinax again...

 

[Askold]

The pirates in my campaign would often fire a warning shot with that big particle beam and then radio in and ask for a surrender - "the next shot won't miss".

This is important, the threat of violence is often enough and having more firepower than the victim helps make them see reason.

Besides, the kind of pirates that only take the cargo (and not all of it at least in the beginning since the Harrier has less cargo space than any of the dedicated cargo ships) without harming the crew or the ship will net you good karma, or at least less bad karma than otherwise.

Other than that, the Particle beam isn't really a horrible killer at least according to our GM the radiation damage isn't that bad if you only make a few shots.

Besides, the Harrier is an old ship and King Oleb wasn't the one who armed it, when the players get it the Kingdom hasn't even been able to fix it completely.


Our crew did some upgrades and now it actually has two Particle beams and no missiles. It can move Jump-3 as well so that it can keep up with the Gazelle escort and Mercenary Cruiser that we have picked up. (We actually bought the latter one with our ill begotten gains since we needed a ship that had some cargo room as well as weapons. Those Far Traders and other freighters are good at transporting cargo but you can't really take them to battle.)

 

[vladthemad]

All the ideas are great, but what I'm really interested in is a few alternative rules for pbeams that are at least mildly scientific. Can you slam particles into a ship hull without causing atomic radiation? Possibly a different form of radiation that doesn't cook the crew, like EMP? I'd assume it's based on the type of particle being accelerated? As noted, I'd be fine with dropping it all together because the beauty of the pbeam is the damage it does, cooking the crew is just an added benefit.

As far as the whole idea of a shot across the bow as a warning, sadly it doesn't play out in the morale rules or fluff text provided. Even from a roleplay stand point, you wouldn't just instantly give up. If someone shoots at you, I think the logical reaction would be to gun the throttle. It's once you realize you don't stand a reasonable chance of getting away that you surrender, which is what the morale rules bare out.

On top of that, my players more rollplayers than roleplayers. They like crunchy bits that explain things, which is part of why I came here to ask a few questions. They've come from a D&D background, and have learned some hard lessons so far. For one, they thought anything that the GM threw at them they should reasonably be able to tackle. The whole challenge rating from 3.5 D&D. Yeah well, I'm not that kind of GM. They need to think about what they are doing. Surviving a fight with a SDB, antique or not, isn't likely...but they managed to jump away, just barely.

In another instance, when a converted scout S being used as a planetary customs ship came to investigate a mayday, they shot it up with the PBeam. When it fled, they continued shooting...and shooting...and shooting. So, when they eventually made it back to Drinax for repairs and Oleb reviewed the records of what had transpired (oh you thought that he didn't have ways of keeping tabs on what you were doing? It's a tl15 ship! Nanocams everywhere!) he was not at all happy. After explaining how attacking planetary assets and cooking the crew members in the scout were the exact opposite of what they were to be doing, he had his guards stun and throw the perpetrator off the balcony of the floating palace to drive his point home. Hopefully it will also point them in the right direction at least for a little while. I don't care if it goes off the rails, but it's going to be a rough campaign if it goes off the rails the first session!

For simplicity's sake, I always assume containers are one dTon.

It definitely seems like that is what was intended...and too often with this set of Traveller rules, you have to figure out what was intended.

 

[vladthemad]

The Harrier was fighting a war when it went missing.

Oh, as to the PA being illegal, 1) We're pirates, 2) It's the Trojan Reach and not anyone's territory and 3) We head for less restrictive ports. Avoid Imperial ports with high law levels, period.

I know it's a warship, well a commerce raider to be specific if I remember correctly, and that the players are pirate/privateers. I also understand this isn't the Imperium. The Imperium does frequent the area though, and even local planetary governments are going take issue with random military ships with heavy weapons floating around in their territory. If I roll up to commercial dock in California in an unmarked fast attack craft, you can bet all Hell is going to break loose.

It's a warship, that's suspicious enough, and would raise a few eyebrows and questions, but wouldn't be too out of place in the Reach with a solid explanation. Throw on a few weapons that would be classified as military only, and you're going to run into actual problems. I was wondering where the pbeam fell in the Traveller canon, so I knew how to treat it and how others would respond to it. If every place they go is going to react with fear and apprehension, it's going to be hard to make friendly with the natives like Oleb wants.

The options now are to either nerf the radiation effects so it's falls into the realm of standard lasers and missiles, or have a frank discussion with my players about how they really aren't going to be able to use this ship to do anything diplomatically, and how any station they approach is likely to react badly. Of course this plays into the way I'd play the campaign as a player anyway. Two personae, playing good cop bad cop, with two ships...or more. Use the harrier to attack and cause trouble, to loot and scare the locals, use some innocuous freighter to sell the ill gotten goods and to make nice. "Oh no" you tell them "the Kingdom of Drinax can solve all your pirate problems!". Basically you become the cause of and solution to their pirate problems Just hope no one figures out your scam!

 

[AndrewW]

Two personae, playing good cop bad cop, with two ships...or more. Use the harrier to attack and cause trouble, to loot and scare the locals, use some innocuous freighter to sell the ill gotten goods and to make nice. "Oh no" you tell them "the Kingdom of Drinax can solve all your pirate problems!". Basically you become the cause of and solution to their pirate problems Just hope no one figures out your scam!

Good ole protection racket.

 

[Reynard]

"The Imperium does frequent the area though, and even local planetary governments are going take issue with random military ships with heavy weapons floating around in their territory."

If you are the referee, read the campaign carefully. The Trojan Reach is a bit wild and wooly with planets all over the map with loyalty. Part of the crews' mission is to win worlds over to their side with bribes, 'good' deeds and commerce. There's a good choice of worlds that turn a blind eye and other who are just used to the diversity of ships. If you do something really noticeable in a particular system, you either don't return or plan a raid not involving landing in port.

"If I roll up to commercial dock in California in an unmarked fast attack craft, you can bet all Hell is going to break loose."

This is why the vast majority of RPGs and action movies aren't based on the real, BORING, world.

"It's a warship, that's suspicious enough,"

It's a very particular, very rare ship not seen in two hundred years. If asked, lie or at least make up the truth. Even the PA can be explained. No one knows what that ship is. Again, wild and wooly.

For our time of play, no one asked too many questions and we didn't provide much information. Somehow the campaign has been fun and exciting thanks to both players and ref. The game works without modification. As a ref though you do have final say. It sounds like you want a less subtle face to face gameplay. You have the right to choose another weapon system in place of the PA or do any other modifications to the ship or actually use some other non-warship class. Pirates use merchant class vessels all the time. Seriously, don't bring 'realism' in just to prove the game doesn't work. Make it work.

 

[Reynard]

"As far as the whole idea of a shot across the bow as a warning, sadly it doesn't play out in the morale rules or fluff text provided. Even from a roleplay stand point, you wouldn't just instantly give up. If someone shoots at you, I think the logical reaction would be to gun the throttle."

We used the PA (and later, the other weapons in the fixed turret) for that shot across the bow tactic then we opened hailing and the captain of our Harrier made a Skill Check vs. the opponent with a modifier from firing such a powerful weapon. Helps a lot and we got cooperation. Games aren't just fist fights.

 

[Condottiere]

The usual protocol probably is a laser across the bow to indicate that the pursued craft in within range and can't escape.

Heavy weaponry is for actual threats:

 

[vladthemad]

Regarding shipping containers, I did manage to find where they talk about the size related to the movement rules. It's in a gray box section on p. 51 of scoundrels. It states they are basically 1dton containers. I had thought I had read that somewhere before, but Mongoose likes to scatter things all over the place, throughout various books so you can't find what you're looking for when you're looking for it

 

[AndrewW]

I had thought I had read that somewhere before, but Mongoose likes to scatter things all over the place, throughout various books so you can't find what you're looking for when you're looking for it

That's to get you to look at the various books.

 

[vladthemad]

I had thought I had read that somewhere before, but Mongoose likes to scatter things all over the place, throughout various books so you can't find what you're looking for when you're looking for it

That's to get you to look at the various books.

Hah, that'd be fine if they'd at least list a book and page reference. Instead I get a lot of "I remember reading something somewhere about this...". It tends to throttle game play a little bit.

 

[Reynard]

"Heavy weaponry is for actual threats:"

Might explain why our crew did quite well against a rival pirate vessel that was meant to take on more than armed traders. I believe they were part of a larger pirate operation in the region. We left them alive and adrift from called shots and engine hits with the PA and broadcast a Mayday before leaving. They get to explain things to the authorities.

Our last adventure was a cliffhanger that wasn't resolved. A local patrol craft was following our prey's Mayday. At the time it had not come close enough to identify. We may or may not have had to fight it but we still had the weapons for the task. A lesser ship with lesser weapons and defenses might be running more often than not. Give me the Harrier any day.

 

[vladthemad]

Also, I decided to go with an EMP effect instead of radiation. I'm going to mimic the rules for the damage from p. 22 of Trillion Credit Squadron, but instead of 3 hits, I'll give it only one. Not only will this make them less likely to cook crew and raise the ire of the Imperium and Hierate, it has the added benefit of disabling ships quicker without causing real damage...which makes it easier for them to get to the job of robbing!

"The Imperium does frequent the area though, and even local planetary governments are going take issue with random military ships with heavy weapons floating around in their territory."

If you are the referee, read the campaign carefully. The Trojan Reach is a bit wild and wooly with planets all over the map with loyalty. Part of the crews' mission is to win worlds over to their side with bribes, 'good' deeds and commerce. There's a good choice of worlds that turn a blind eye and other who are just used to the diversity of ships. If you do something really noticeable in a particular system, you either don't return or plan a raid not involving landing in port.

"If I roll up to commercial dock in California in an unmarked fast attack craft, you can bet all Hell is going to break loose."

This is why the vast majority of RPGs and action movies aren't based on the real, BORING, world.

"It's a warship, that's suspicious enough,"

It's a very particular, very rare ship not seen in two hundred years. If asked, lie or at least make up the truth. Even the PA can be explained. No one knows what that ship is. Again, wild and wooly.

For our time of play, no one asked too many questions and we didn't provide much information. Somehow the campaign has been fun and exciting thanks to both players and ref. The game works without modification. As a ref though you do have final say. It sounds like you want a less subtle face to face gameplay. You have the right to choose another weapon system in place of the PA or do any other modifications to the ship or actually use some other non-warship class. Pirates use merchant class vessels all the time. Seriously, don't bring 'realism' in just to prove the game doesn't work. Make it work.

I have read the campaign material. Wild and woolly or not, if it's a space capable planet with a moderate population or anything with a class A or B starport, there's going to be at least some sort of token defense force to run off raiders at the very least, even if it's unable to prevent a large scale invasion. If there wasn't, the entire sector would already be picked clean before the campaign starts as there are already numerous pirates operating in the sector according to the material.

I tend to think realistically, even if it's not real life. The fact that it's a ship that hasn't been seen for centuries doesn't change the fact that it's clearly a warship, if a small one. A WWII uboat popping up out of the water would raise just as many questions as a fast attack craft. Probably even more. As far as the California port example, I used it because I equated it to a class A starport with a decent tech level, which is what much of the spice route is. A large amount of traffic travels through those starports, even if it's just to rest and refuel. Landing at any of these in a would raise some questions in my mind. You could only explain away battle damage on your military ship so many times before someone starts putting two and two together. Out here in the Reach you're likely to just be blasted to space dust instead of hauled in for questioning too, so it's an even more dangerous proposition.

Now if you land at a class E starport on some backwater that has just reinvented the steam engine, no one is going to raise an eyebrow about you landing with your nefarious ship and nefarious intentions...and even if they did, what are they going to do about it? If anything these planets are probably more likely to hide from you, because they've been preyed upon numerous times before.

 

[AndrewW]

Hah, that'd be fine if they'd at least list a book and page reference. Instead I get a lot of "I remember reading something somewhere about this...". It tends to throttle game play a little bit.

I did this for the various ship components scattered across the various books.

 

[Anonymous]

There's a lot to be said for searchable PDFs.

Just saying...

 

[Reynard]

"I tend to think realistically, even if it's not real life. "

Thinking realistically in a scifi action oriented RPG makes all but the most mundane adventures know to Traveller impossible. Even jumpcussers with their normal ships and normal weapons would never be anything more than a possible news blip about dumb merchants caught again in a botched robbery attempt. Realistically any ship would be suspect with anything other than a laser in their turret because anything more means you plan to outgun someone. Suspicious. Time for a boarding and inspection. Pirates of Drinax would have been cancelled immediately because it's an
action movie with all the trappings instead of reality crime drama based on the real present day world.

I prefer a fun cinematic campaign of bold pirates in spaceships.

 

[vladthemad]

I did this for the various ship components scattered across the various books.

You mean you compiled them all together? Yeah, I've been thinking about that.

There's a lot to be said for searchable PDFs.

Just saying...

Which is fine...except I bought just about all the books...and trying to remember which book to search in is half the problem. Sadly when you just run a search for something in windows file browser, it doesn't appear to search through the contents of PDFs. I know, I tried. Dammit, this would make it so much easier!