Bridge tonnage discrepancy

[Condottiere]

According to the current High Guard, a one and a half tonne single cockpit can effectively control a fifty tonne hull.

Previously, a two and a half tonne double cockpit can do the same, upto ninety nine tonnes.

One supplement pushed that to two hundred tonnes.

Another, two kilotonnes.

You strip that to basics, that's what's required for aerospacial control.

 

[Sigtrygg]

The old description of a bridge:

The Bridge: All starships must allocate 20 tons displacement for basic controls,
which include guidance radars, drive and power plant controls, communications
equipment, and other devices required for proper control of the ship.

The Bridge: All ships must allocate 2% of their tonnage (minimum 20 tons)
to basic controls, communications equipment, avionics, scanners, detectors, sensors,
and other equipment for proper operation of the ship.

The Bridge: Every ship requires a bridge for control of the drives and electronics
and for navigation. Such a bridge (designated as the main bridge or prime bridge)
requires 2% of the ship's tonnage (minimum: 20 tons) at a cost of Cr5,000 per
ton of ship. The bridge contains all necessary equipment for the control of the ship with the
exception of the computer.

So the list of components are:
basic controls
avionics
guidance radar, scanners, detectors, sensors
drive controls (for each type of drive)
comms
other equipment for proper operation of the ship.

I quite liked the MegaTraveller sequence of considering each as a separate system

So the design system could allocate a minimum tonnage and a formula for each of those items.
Controls become work stations, avionics should be linked to displacement and ship capability - a ship that is atmosphere capable or can skim will require a better avionics package than a ship that just hauls rocks from orbit to orbit.
Radars et al are already covered although the rules need expansion.
Drive controls also become workstations, while comms also need expansion.

Question is what is meant by "other equipment for proper operation of the ship"? Airlocks, hatches, clamps, power conduits and interface etc?

 

[Sigtrygg]

basic controls - 1%, 1 ton min
avionics -1%, 1 ton min
guidance radar, scanners, detectors, sensors -1%, 1 ton min
drive controls (for each type of drive) - 1-3%, 1 ton min
comms - 1%, 1 ton min
other equipment for proper operation of the ship - 1%, 1 ton min

This was posted in haste, some of those numbers are placeholders.

I like the "control points" approach for workstations and workstation add ons, but it needs a wand of simplification waved over it.

 

[MasterGwydion]

Wait… Are you wanting to transport 10 tons of… brewed coffee?

Brilliant idea, but this time I was actually thinking of petroleum and stuff like that.

Not in my ship. First I don't allow that option as I've seen real world issues with tankers switching between materials and there being missed contamination in the clean out/purging. Second I can't stand the smell/taste of coffee. Third I have unusual reactions to caffeine that I don't want to go back to experiencing.

Don't trains transport stuff like grain in large open cargo areas and then maybe fill the same area with rice on the next run? I know they do this with stuff like coal.

 

[Condottiere]

There was/is a scandal in China, where same tankers were transporting coal byproducts and cooking oil, and didn't bother to clean the tank.

In the future, contamination in parts per million, and even smaller, should be a lot easier to detect, and are grounds for rejection.

 

[Fluffy Bunny Feet]

Brilliant idea, but this time I was actually thinking of petroleum and stuff like that.

Don't trains transport stuff like grain in large open cargo areas and then maybe fill the same area with rice on the next run? I know they do this with stuff like coal.

Liquids get into nooks and crannies that solids do not and then when another liquid is added spreads through that liquid where a solid wouldn't spread the same way.

A company I worked for had a customer supplied material come in a tanker that was thoroughly cleaned but the pump wasn't. Due to testing done before and after transfer began (with transfer stopped during testing) little was put into our tank but it was still a major and time consuming effort to clean it out.

Now imagine that is your jump fuel and you misjump. A potential life ending accident. Which is why I wouldn't allow the same tank to store jump fuel and anything else. It only takes one person not doing their job properly to kill you.

There was/is a scandal in China, where same tankers were transporting coal byproducts and cooking oil, and didn't bother to clean the tank.

A company I worked for received fish oil in a milk tanker. It was thoroughly cleaned between uses but it was only allowed because contamination wasn't toxic. You might not like the taste or smell of the milk but it wouldn't kill you. The livestock additive made from the fish oil would also not cause problems with milk contamination that slipped past inspections. It wouldn't destroy the truck and kill the driver like contaminated jump fuel might.

 

[rinku]

If Starship bridge min limit is 10, that breaks all the 100 tonners using small bridges.

Rephrase that to be minimum base bridge size. The small bridge rule should still apply. I wasn't intending to change that.

 

[rinku]

Why is that a clear error?

It lists 2000 tons as belonging to two brackets.

1001-2000 tons = 40 tons; 2000 tons or more = 60 tons

That was fixed up in later products to be "2001 tons or more" or 2001 tons to some higher tonnage. It seems to be the only case of an ambiguous threshold, unless there's one in MGT1e High Guard, which I forgot to check.

 

[Fluffy Bunny Feet]

It lists 2000 tons as belonging to two brackets.

1001-2000 tons = 40 tons; 2000 tons or more = 60 tons

That was fixed up in later products to be "2001 tons or more" or 2001 tons to some higher tonnage. It seems to be the only case of an ambiguous threshold, unless there's one in MGT1e High Guard, which I forgot to check.

Older version than mine, that clears it up. Thanks.

 

[Condottiere]

To reiterate, bridge size doesn't matter, except for smaller spacecraft.

Were bridge/small introduced only in Mongoose?

If so, we have the opportunity to figure out how all essential instrumentation is squeezed together, and if any are discarded.

 

[Ezarhon]

To reiterate, bridge size doesn't matter, except for smaller spacecraft.

Were bridge/small introduced only in Mongoose?

If so, we have the opportunity to figure out how all essential instrumentation is squeezed together, and if any are discarded.

If it gives you 3 extra tons to fit in a med bed or some cargo, due to published discrepancy, I would say that matters. It did to the player who owned the erroneous ship, I can safely claim. She even did a happy dance.

 

[Condottiere]

To reiterate, hard tonnage requirements only really affect smaller spacecraft.

That includes five tonne overhead on jump drives, and sensors.

 

[Ezarhon]

To reiterate, hard tonnage requirements only really affect smaller spacecraft.

That includes five tonne overhead on jump drives, and sensors.

To re-re-reiterate, small spacecraft are still pertinent. Especially to new Captains who need space.