[BR] ISA vs EA, 3 point armageddon

tneva82

Mongoose
InterStellar Alliance does not approve study of shadow technology! Ergo with heavy heart ISA has to give Earth Alliance heavy lesson. If you mess with shadow technology face the consequence...In otherwords. We played yet another ISA vs EA game :D 3 point armageddon to give us chance to try out new goodies nicely. We house ruled victory's lightning cannons to 30" range. Frankly it should outrange neutron lasers(in the crusade it was often used when neutron lasers were out of range afterall) but we settled on 30".

I opted for fleet of Victory(adaptive armour and improved firepower. Heh heh), white star carrier&gunship, 2 WSC-2(improved in armageddon) and 4 white stars. Opponent took Nemesis, 2 marathons(now these are fast big buggers for EA. Not as fast as white stars of course but speed 12 and 2/45 turns is nothing to be sniffed at), 2 omega heavy destroyer, 2 chronos, 1 hyperion and 3 hermes.

For terrain 3 6"x6" asteroid fields. 2 on south(ISA deploy here), 1 on north. For scenario it was annihilation again. This time I lost the roll for hyperspace deployment(darn!) so this time opponent took the opportunity. Yep. Both marathons were in hyperspace waiting.

EA deployed into pretty much center with Nemesis and omega leading the way with remaining ships further back. Especially trio of hermeses and hyperion. Guess he isn't keen on losing initiave sinks yet :D Myself I went for victory in center preparing to duel it with EA fleet. On left were gunship and trio of white stars(one of them WSC-2) and on right carrier and second trio.

Turn 1: Fleets started to approach each other. As suspected smaller EA ships were used to draw white star fleet forward. Since I didn't have "victory in hyperspace" suprise(actually it would have been gunship and carrier this time but idea is same) this time available I complied and moved forward to strike them. This did result in omega getting WSC-2 in range but I had hopes for dodge 3+. I also got victory into firing range of said omega...Gunship stayed bit behind to ensure IT doesn't get shot instead of WSC-2. Lower dodge save is not good. Carrier stayed similary behind.

The jump points appeared right of victory and finally nemesis moved into position to fire into victory. This ought to be interesting...

Then shooting. I had two choises here. Shoot at omega or shoot at nemesis. Figured I might try to take 1 of the 3 heavy hitters ASAP so fired neutron lasers at softer target, the omega. 4 hits. 4 hits!, 1 hit. Wow! 3 criticals and suddenly omega was -4 speed and no SA as well as over half dead. That was good shot! Too bad didn't damage weapon system but can't have everything. Atleast the WSC-2 promptly dodged full laser salvo without effort. Huzah! Nemesis fired it's nasty beam toward victory but adaptive armour kept damage in manageable level. Missile salvo was also stopped without too much of problem. Trio of hermeses sent salvo as well, inspired by victory interceptors having been drained, and got 1 hit against victory. This resulted into -2 speed critical as well.

Turn 2: As usual turn 2 saw things heating up. Victory found himself under attack of all THREE advanced ship(trust the adaptive armour!) with white star and WSC-2(plus 5 white star fighters) coming on help against marathons while gunship moved toward nemesis. Trio of white stars on left moved in to finish damaged omega. One white star on right moved in to shoot at omega(which was also target of victory) while carrier moved further away(not yet willing to endanger it). I also had some starfuries(and thunderbolt to assist one squadron) hunt down 2 flights of starfuries that had been launched from marathon.

Time to shoot. WS gunship opened up as I thought it might get lucky and silence nemesis before it gets to shoot. Not so lucky this time. 3 hits were scored, one of them critical, but was just more crew dead. Ah well. On right white star got hit by omega but once more dodge and adaptive armour ensured that not too much of damage was done. Yea! On left omega got hit by white star and though pulsars failed to even hit neutron laser caused yet another no SA critical and took it well past skeleton crew mark. Neutron laser. Got to love it! Too bad victory actually carries inferior neutron laser :D Atleast it carries more of them...

Speaking of victory. Nemesis got to shoot at it full load. Heavy pulse overload interceptors and scratched paint while main gun dented armour nicely. Missile launcher fired another salvo and another -2 speed critical was caused. So far so good but still 2 marathons to shoot...So while it still could(I have fear of 4-6 critical all the time) victory opened fire. Secondary weapons shot at nearest marathon while neutron lasers shot at the second omega. Pulse cannons didn't get past interceptors but fusion cannons caused 6-2 critical to the marathon along with decent damage(for non-damage multiplier weapon). Neutron lasers shot at the omega and though result wasn't quite so many hits 6-4 critical more than made up(also -2 speed) for it.

White Star Gunship suffered -2 speed from the near dead omega. Omega was later destroyed when it suffered THIRD no SA(the 3-4 one). That is great crew killing critical! Second omega was almost crippled by white star while marathons dented victory nicely. Still no criticals which was kinda limiting damage they were able to cause it. Clear difference between precise and non precise beams. Finally at the end of turn victory repaired -2 speed from the last turn.

Turn 3: Turn got even more messier this time. Heaps of manouvering on both sides. Those hermes ships were proving their weight in gold in usefullness to draw white stars to move before his big ships moved. On right hermes and chronos paired against white star and white star carrier. Nemesis found out itself to be overshooting(or if all stop victory simply moving out of boresight) so ended up moving to boresight white star instead. Marathon with no DC got white star that had moved into the EA fleets back into boresight while second marathon pulled all stop. Victory decided to target marathon this turn with WSC2 and white star pairing against second marathon/nemesis with support from gunship and WSC-2 from the otherside.

But if reqular ship movement was messy the fighter duel was even more messy. Oh...My...God! This was THE most complicated turn ever I have had as far as fighters go. Wasn't particulary helped by vassal not having ability to IDENTIFY separate furies/thunderbolts from 2 player. Grumble grumble.

Anyway all that dueling resulted in marathon suffering hit from white star fighter, couple of ISA fighter stand losing(even when I outnumbered them...), two white stars taking hits from starfuries and 'bolts. On the right however happened something...Spectacular. 6 white star fighters and nial flight were attacking damaged omega. Nial and 4 WS fighters took out interceptors. 5th WS fighter didn't do anything. Remaining got 1 hit. Critical. 6-6! BOOOOOOOOOOM! Nothing was left of what had been there. BUGGER! I lost 66% of my white star fighters and 2 valuable nial flight in that. Okay I got that omega out of my sky but still. 2 other white star fighters caused hit to hermes. Interceptors worked well as they stopped 4 out of 5 hits scored.

Anyway. Shooting. Victory opened up. Secondary weapons aimed at marathon next to it since interceptors were already down. Pulse cannon did little bit and so did fusion beams. Weapons of marathon would also lose 1 AD which was usefull. Neutron lasers then came down against marathon and caused 6 hits, of which whopping 4 were criticals(god that precise is nasty). This left marathon quite, quite crewless.

Nemesis replied then. Front weapons went against white star that was nearly crippled and skeleton crewed in one go. Rear minibeams went against the victory and promptly caused no SA critical to it as well.

On right fighter clearance continued as white star carrier blew the hermes up big time! This took out 2 more white star fighters(ouh) and 2 thunderbolts from EA(heh!).

Hyperion got to shoot at WSC-2 with plasma cannon, heavy laser and pulse cannon, white star #1 with pulse cannon and particle beams and white star #2 with pulse cannon. Lots of damage scattered around but nothing really scary. White star #2 suffered no SA critical but SA's aren't crucial for white stars anyway.

Nemesis suffered bit of damage, one hermes was blown apart(took out another thunderbolt) after shooting ineffectively against white star(dodge dodge dodge). Chronos caused slight damage to white stars but that dodge is sure usefull!

On south I opted to switch target from marathon to nemesis for neutron lasers for WSC-2 and white star. Pulsars would shoot at marathon with it's depleted interceptors but time to soften up big ship. WSC-2 got 3 hits from pulsars though somehow depleted interceptors(needing 6+) stopped 2. Remaining scored critical though thanks to precise WSC-2's pulsars got. Neutron laser didn't do all that much but did cause second -2 speed crit. Atleast won't be gaining back it's speed in a hurry. And just to make point clear white star blew out the engines. Hah! Too bad victory isn't in position to fire up lightning cannon...

Turn 4: Lot easier now since Nemesis is sitting duck. 4 white stars, including gunship and WSC-2, descended upon nemesis like pack of wolves. Victory started to turn around though since marathon moved ahead boresighting on carrier it ensured it didn't turn too much to bring neutron lasers out of arc. On right carrier and another white star paired against chronos. Elsewhere it was EA ships trying to come about in response to fleeing white stars(hehe! I'm not staying there!).

Fighter side it was now I who was in trouble. Thunderbolts and starfuries descended against my white stars like maniac wolves. Oh dear. On south thunderbolts actually knocked weapons from one random arc(and with only one arc in these ships...) from WSC-2. On north gunship was actually decrewed completely by swarm of furies and bolts. Hmmm...Darn!

Atleast they had had to come close to victory to do that. Victory and its fusion beams...Scratch 2 squadrons of furies and 2 squadrons of thunderbolts! Pulse cannons entertained themselves by shooting one squadron of each more. Now this is looking better again!

Especially since marathon was left crippled AND skeleton crewed by neutron lasers. Much more anti-neutron laser cursing from my opponent...

He got small revenge though when said marathon blew out the engines from white star carrier who promptly failed to dodge anything out of the nasty beam from EA ship. Still not much of a problem at this point.

At this point opponent started to concider running away(if nemesis repair it's engines that is!). However I pretty much stopped that plan before it started by causing no SA crit as well. Now unless he manages to bring another ship to open up jump point nemesis cannot escape even if it manages to repair the engines. Until he fixes that critical as well. Sometimes life is tough for EA...Especially when his hyperion found itself inch short of range for plasma cannons. Pulse cannon fired up and nearly took out one white star but still no help for EA in sight.

Rest of turn slight damage to white star carrier, little bit to nemesis and WSC-2 finished off the marathon.

Most important event of end phase was that nemesis fixed up its engines! Beast can move again!

Turn 5: Nemesis started to turn away from victory while chronos, hermes and hyperion started to move toward it. Is he trying to escape? Another chronos circled immobilised white star carrier while white stars circled around nemesis or started to move toward it. Exceptions were one white star that came hard about and moved to shoot at hermes and WSC-2 that had no front weapons for now which started to move away from nemesis. Unfortunatly due to speed critical it couldn't avoid minibeam range anyway...

In fighter shooting one white star got badly mauled by thunderbolts and starfuries. I'm starting to hate these! White star carrier suffered slightly less damage except for 2 -1AD criticals...Bugger.

Shooting. Carefull measuring showed that Nemesis had barely failed to get into safety! Neutron lasers...Fire! This blew out weapon systems from nemesis and took it within 9 crew from being decrewed. Ouh! Pulse cannons, aft neutron lasers and fusion cannons shot at chronos that had tried to APTE toward nemesis. This decrewed poor chronos from crew critical. Okay. That hadn't been that good manouvering from opponent but as I said he's just learning and also was probably getting "bit" desperate ATM.

The white star that was heading toward hermes got then bit of warm welcome first from hyperion and then from said hermes who finally scored good critical that decrewed said white star for good. Still way too late.

Hyperion got their aft weapons blown out of action by neutron laser of nearby white star. Nemesis had interceptors overloaded by pulsars of white star and WSC-2 and then missile rack from said WSC-2 blew out engines. Nemesis was AGAIN immobilised and to finish it off neutron lasers caused 5-6 critical(with only 4 crew left to begin with...).

With this we quit as he couldn't even salvage some honour by escaping with nemesis. With nearly dead hyperion, hermes and chronos left he couldn't even open up jump point and survive it.

So...How come this was such a massacre? Good question! Wish I knew...About all I can think of is his attempt to kill victory so early. Though marathons came to help quickly(and thus he had armageddon and 2 battle ships bombarding it) he was hard pressed to take it out quickly thanks to its adaptive armour. Barring lucky crit that would silence those infernal neutron lasers that were causing such a havoc(I mean 2 turns, 2 omegas practically crippled and ready to be finished off by white stars. Now THAT'S firepower...). Concentrating on white stars could have enabled him to reduce amount of neutron lasers I had as well as ensure activation amount doesn't fall too badly against him(and thus remove ability to boresight. What's up with EA and their boresight obsession? One could think they would have learned by now to have rotating weapon mounts for their main guns...).

Nemesis proved to be as ineffective for the cost as others have reported it to be. Big beam but not precise one(which makes neutron lasers of victory better weapons eventhough they are only double damage instead of tripple damage) and without adaptive armour isn't also as survivable as victory is.

White star carrier...Seemed to be rather fun ship. Those white star fighters gave good showing until they were destroyed(most of them because of being too effective!). Gunship on the otherhand wasn't as effective as I hoped from war level white star. Actually I think 2 WSC-2's outperform it nicely. So from the 2 new war choises I think the carrier is my favourite.

Next up we'll planning bit smaller scale battle again. 4 point skirmish sounds like fun.
 
seriously, he's very unlucky with his criticals, Precise should increase crits for sure, but your ratio to his is amazing! Vassal hates him ;-)
I beat the ISA with drakh last night, admitedly, my opponent is not an ISA player usually, and we wanted to try fighters, but It was quite an interesting battle, as I was actually prepared to leave Cruisers in range of nasty guns, to offer cover from the fighters. Drakh are a finesse fleet, but I say let him playe Drakh ( lots of precise) or narn with E-Mines.
 
hiffano said:
seriously, he's very unlucky with his criticals, Precise should increase crits for sure, but your ratio to his is amazing! Vassal hates him ;-)

Yep. Vassal hates him. Maybe we should get around buying models but...Well thing is. We don't even have suitably sized board. Try to play game of ACTA on 48"x24" board :D

Or maybe we should replace vassal dice rolling with real dice rolling. That could work :-)

But main problem for him was probably the attempt to take out Victory. That thing can soak up firepower a lot so unless he gets 4-6 or atleast 4-4 critical shooting isn't going to do all that much(well speed 0 crit would also help...). But then again. Maybe that can be forgiven after the last game where victory showed up. I remember all too many times I have struck with vengeance against something that last game did something nasty :D
 
yes, concentrating on an uber ship is often a bad plan, take out it's support quickly, then pile every ship you have against it, without fear of anything else. the Bin tak exceled at that for my narn, and of course the victory has in effect 200 damage points.
 
I do not know....he had more than enough firepower dedicated to it. Several other crits could have mattered and somewhere in that all those dice he should have gotten a few.

I do agree eliminating the whitestar (vanilla) would have been a very good initial move. The whitestar 2 is too survivable to try taking out with the TD beams though...adaptive plkus theh 3+ dodge means you will often only hit 1 and that becomes one and one. Better targets for the hermes missles, where your hoping for some luck anyway.

One thing I noted was you did not comment on recovery rolls for the whitestar fighters. You had a Fleet Carrier on the table so you should have had the +1 dogfight for all your fighters and at least a 5-6 recovery roll for every whitestar fighter lost.

Ripple
 
Ripple said:
I do not know....he had more than enough firepower dedicated to it.

Either he didn't have or he rolled seriously badly there. The thing wasn't even half way to being crippled after nemesis and pair of marathon shot...Adaptive armour is just awesome. As for crits. He got several of them but nature of them was not so good. -2 speed crits enough enough to ensure it won't get full speed back again but didn't knock weapons out(which was what he was hoping. Or atleast front weapons).
 
Agree, he needed something in the vitals table or a x-6 crit to really matter, but he had a decent shot at that. Also it appears he did not get the 'roll-up' on any of the beams that sometimes happens. Just saying he had two War points dedicated to the job and that is usually enough to kill something in a shot or two. (ie if you dedicated the same pl as the target, usually in a shot or two you can get something disabled if not killed.)

Ripple
 
Ripple said:
Just saying he had two War points dedicated to the job

2 war points? He had more. Nemesis alone is armageddon level and then pair of marathons...

Dented Victory nicely but still would have taken more time to take victory out. Time he didn't have(especially thanks to my attrocious critical rolling that took out marathon out quickly. Victory and nemesis also passed each other and then speed 0 for nemesis...).

By the way. Those marathons were really neat ships. Apart from the problem of weak weaponry outside the main boresight guns(and boresight being what it is...) it was quite a nice ship. Certainly have to prepare to face more of those in a future. Especially as no chance of facing nemesis(aka point sink) again.
 
Well thats officially 3 War points but to be frank the Nemesis is for an Armageddon level ship, a big steaming pile of arse.

It's ONLY worth it if your fighting Minbari where it's HEL system can actually make it quite dangerous :P
 
Fought a quick battle of 2 Victories + 1 WS 2 + 2 ws 1 vrs 2 Shadow ships and a shadow hunter and the victories could take the beating off 2/3 of the shadow ships for 3 turns before i had to worry about things looking grim. And dealing damage back, they did their job awsomely. Seems to be the Victory might not be the biggest shooter on the block, but survivability, they rock.
 
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