Best and Worst Raid level ships
- Thread starter Humbaba
- Start date
true but the nova gets alot more AD 
also its +1 for 3rd age, +2 for crusade
and ISA is only +2
then theres the 4 flights of auroras.
all i am saying really is its not as easy as people thing to take down a nova with a WS. molecular pulsars shots will more than likely be intercepted too.
also its +1 for 3rd age, +2 for crusade
and ISA is only +2
then theres the 4 flights of auroras.
all i am saying really is its not as easy as people thing to take down a nova with a WS. molecular pulsars shots will more than likely be intercepted too.
I know nova isnt crusade, which is why i said +1. i wa spointing out the +2 is only for crusade, not 3rd age as reaverman thought.
and no it wont. 1 hit every other turn means unless playing annihilation will take forecer to kill the nova.
and if you follow the above example the nova can get the hits. then theres 3-4 flts of starfuries to worry about too (depending on how many are left after killign the single Nial).
effectively a WS has a 1AD beam against a nova, the pulsars count for nothing there.
and it needs to win init to use that beam, if it loses it the nova will more than likely get into range to fire for a turn or neither side will fire.
like i said its not as easy as you think as you have to worry about your speed bringing you into range of the novas guns.
and no it wont. 1 hit every other turn means unless playing annihilation will take forecer to kill the nova.
and if you follow the above example the nova can get the hits. then theres 3-4 flts of starfuries to worry about too (depending on how many are left after killign the single Nial).
effectively a WS has a 1AD beam against a nova, the pulsars count for nothing there.
and it needs to win init to use that beam, if it loses it the nova will more than likely get into range to fire for a turn or neither side will fire.
like i said its not as easy as you think as you have to worry about your speed bringing you into range of the novas guns.
katadder said:true but the nova gets alot more AD
also its +1 for 3rd age, +2 for crusade
and ISA is only +2
then theres the 4 flights of auroras.
all i am saying really is its not as easy as people thing to take down a nova with a WS. molecular pulsars shots will more than likely be intercepted too.
The Whitestar is faster, more maneouvrable, and can out range a Nova. Its bloody easy to kill a Nova, and the Pulsars would only be used for the final kill. It will just whip about the Nova, picking it to bits, and critting the poor SOB to bits. Like a big cat, taking down a stupid bovine!
Burger said:
All the ISA player does is move into position (left or right flank), and zip across the Nova's bow. If its loses initiative it stays out of range, it wins it attacks. That means it never gets hit, in either situation. The Nova can APTE, but will not get into range, as the Whitestar is coming from the left, and right flank.
Katadder you are digging a deep hole, for pete's sake give up :roll:
CZuschlag
Mongoose
Normally, games have a 10-turn restriction, which is where I can see katadder's argument. Can 1 WS take out a Nova with just the INL in 10 turns?
6.6666 hits over 10 turns for first die
3.3333 hits from second dice
1.1111 hits from third dice
0.1852 hits from fourth beam dice
Gives 11.3 hits for 34.66:38.42
... and the Pulsars finish the job on turn 10 with ease (interceptors are down .... on average).
If the nova wins initiative say, 40% of the time (down 1 on the roll), it gets 4 shots, say (for argument) with the 12-die system:
4x(6.667 hits before dodge -- 3.3333 after), after adaptive is 3 1:1's and say 1 2:2 and 2 criticals, for 0.8:1.02 after adaptive each. He'll get to regen the damage but not the crew, so net might look like 3:7, after all is said and done.
The Whitestar just went a-crushin'.
6.6666 hits over 10 turns for first die
3.3333 hits from second dice
1.1111 hits from third dice
0.1852 hits from fourth beam dice
Gives 11.3 hits for 34.66:38.42
... and the Pulsars finish the job on turn 10 with ease (interceptors are down .... on average).
If the nova wins initiative say, 40% of the time (down 1 on the roll), it gets 4 shots, say (for argument) with the 12-die system:
4x(6.667 hits before dodge -- 3.3333 after), after adaptive is 3 1:1's and say 1 2:2 and 2 criticals, for 0.8:1.02 after adaptive each. He'll get to regen the damage but not the crew, so net might look like 3:7, after all is said and done.
The Whitestar just went a-crushin'.
Here is a diagram for the imaginatively impaired.
The WS starts 15" form the Nova (green ellipse is WS, blue rectangle is Nova. WS can fire, Nova cannot.
If the Nova moves first then the WS can easily avoid its range. If the WS moves first then it takes the red path. The Nova moves to chase, its best plan would be to Come About and follow its red path.
So the question is, is the purple line "?" longer than 12" or not. Well by fairly simple trigonometry, yes it is. In fact with careful positioning the WS can end up over 15" away. And this is assuming it starts at 15"... the WS range is 18", so it is even more in favour of the WS.
So the WS has either got a 2nd "free" shot at the Nova, or it has got out of range.
Rinse and repeat.
The WS starts 15" form the Nova (green ellipse is WS, blue rectangle is Nova. WS can fire, Nova cannot.
If the Nova moves first then the WS can easily avoid its range. If the WS moves first then it takes the red path. The Nova moves to chase, its best plan would be to Come About and follow its red path.
So the question is, is the purple line "?" longer than 12" or not. Well by fairly simple trigonometry, yes it is. In fact with careful positioning the WS can end up over 15" away. And this is assuming it starts at 15"... the WS range is 18", so it is even more in favour of the WS.
So the WS has either got a 2nd "free" shot at the Nova, or it has got out of range.
Rinse and repeat.
CZuschlag
Mongoose
Burger,
Granted, you've shown for one turn, but to make sure no one can ever shoot the White Star, you have to make it a proof by Induction. Does your newly disadvantaged position (in the lose-initiative case)come with getting-shot consequences of its own?
Do you have that by chance? I don't, and would be very, very interested to see such a proof out.
Granted, you've shown for one turn, but to make sure no one can ever shoot the White Star, you have to make it a proof by Induction. Does your newly disadvantaged position (in the lose-initiative case)come with getting-shot consequences of its own?
Do you have that by chance? I don't, and would be very, very interested to see such a proof out.
well maybe not quite the same cos it needs another turn, but possible. in a 10 turn game though its close to not being able to destroy it.
my main point was though thats its not as easy as most people think to do a WS v Nova scenario. also the fighters still havent been factored in too much
my main point was though thats its not as easy as most people think to do a WS v Nova scenario. also the fighters still havent been factored in too much
If the Nials escort the WS, or stay out of range until they can choose the dogfight odds, then they can pick the furies off one at a time.
If the WS is shooting every other turn, then it'll get 5 shots in a 10 turn game. Thats 5AD of SAP/P/TD beam. Is that enough to kill a Nova?
Averages 5.6 hits, thats 17 damage plus 2 crits. Might be enough, might not, depends on the crits. But its a no-lose situation for the ISA.
If the WS is shooting every other turn, then it'll get 5 shots in a 10 turn game. Thats 5AD of SAP/P/TD beam. Is that enough to kill a Nova?
Averages 5.6 hits, thats 17 damage plus 2 crits. Might be enough, might not, depends on the crits. But its a no-lose situation for the ISA.
Burger said:
Bear in mind as well, that the 50% of crits scored will be Movement mods as well. So Katadder, as each turn progresses there is going to be an increased chance of damaging it. As the Whitestar could actually lose iniative, move into range without fear of the Nova out maneaurvering the Whitestar
