legozhodani
Banded Mongoose
Just found these while wading about the forum. Very sweet. Loverly little believable craft, well done mate. 
Art: 2e Gig with Interiors
- Thread starter wbnc
- Start date
steve98052
Mongoose
Nice Work. Thanks for sharing. What rendering software do you use?wbnc said:
The way I would rule on this is that the power plant, maneuver drive, and crew spaces all have a minimum size that defines a practical minimum on the hull size of around 10 dtons, because there's no reason for a hull to have a minimum size. A missile casing is a hull, after all.AnotherDilbert said:
But a fusion power plant might have a minimum of ten dtons at TL8, declining at more advanced levels, to the point where it's like a "Mr Fusion" with beyond-Imperium technology. Or maybe there's one minimum for anow efficient power plant (like one would use for a ground power station) and a smaller limit for one where it doesn't need to be efficient, just to generate enough power to run a ship or craft in limited space. (That may be too crunchy for regular game rules, but that's how existing technology tends to be. For example, you can get a really tiny two stroke nitromethane methanol engine for a model airplane, but you'd want a much more efficient -- and reliable -- engine in a human size plane.)
sorry I missed this back when you posted it I noticed it had gottn a few comments so I thought I'd bepolite and replylegozhodani said:Just found these while wading about the forum. Very sweet. Loverly little believable craft, well done mate.
Thanks I took the basic shape and style form the one in the new books and did my own little touches. it was a fun project.
Here's some stats for a high-end 10- ton dingy. Also, the one problem I see with the lovely looking image of the 20-ton gig and the 10-ton dingy is that they should have exactly the same size bridge, and they don't appear to.
This design reduces the size of the fusion plant to 0.5 tons and the fuel to 0.2 tons, but that doesn't seem unreasonable (both for small craft and also for a TL 15 design). Other than that, it's buy the book.
This design reduces the size of the fusion plant to 0.5 tons and the fuel to 0.2 tons, but that doesn't seem unreasonable (both for small craft and also for a TL 15 design). Other than that, it's buy the book.
heron61 said:Here's some stats for a high-end 10- ton dingy. Also, the one problem I see with the lovely looking image of the 20-ton gig and the 10-ton dingy is that they should have exactly the same size bridge, and they don't appear to.
This design reduces the size of the fusion plant to 0.5 tons and the fuel to 0.2 tons, but that doesn't seem unreasonable (both for small craft and also for a TL 15 design). Other than that, it's buy the book.
Hmm good point I may need to rework that problem at some point.....
Not a bad design either. For my own in house use I use half ton reactors and less than one ton of fuel for small craft to increase usable space. For anything I intend to share or maybe offer in a boklet I go with the standard rules...and get clever to figure out how to fit what I want inside the rules....whihc is not always successful sadly.
For a small 10ton craft, you might actually not install an airlock to save space. That does mean you would need to depressurize the entire craft at times, but that would be a reasonable accomodation since space is at such a premium. And it's not like there haven't been other sci-fi examples of such a thing (or even real-world).
Also, since size is a factor for storage in smaller starships, have you thought about making the engines more conformal to the hull? Having such large engines requires more deckspace, and that's always going to be a premium for a smaller ship's hangar or storage capacity. It's not as big of a deal for ground to orbit craft - except when they need to dock or land inside another ship.
For a craft that small I'd also be expecting a fixed weapons mount rather than a turret - unless that turreted weapon is a vehicle-class one, and not a starship-classed.
But I like where you are going with your visualizations. It adds a LOT to the game to be able to visualize small craft.
Keep up the good work!
Also, since size is a factor for storage in smaller starships, have you thought about making the engines more conformal to the hull? Having such large engines requires more deckspace, and that's always going to be a premium for a smaller ship's hangar or storage capacity. It's not as big of a deal for ground to orbit craft - except when they need to dock or land inside another ship.
For a craft that small I'd also be expecting a fixed weapons mount rather than a turret - unless that turreted weapon is a vehicle-class one, and not a starship-classed.
But I like where you are going with your visualizations. It adds a LOT to the game to be able to visualize small craft.
Keep up the good work!phavoc said:For a small 10ton craft, you might actually not install an airlock to save space. That does mean you would need to depressurize the entire craft at times, but that would be a reasonable accomodation since space is at such a premium. And it's not like there haven't been other sci-fi examples of such a thing (or even real-world).
Also, since size is a factor for storage in smaller starships, have you thought about making the engines more conformal to the hull? Having such large engines requires more deckspace, and that's always going to be a premium for a smaller ship's hangar or storage capacity. It's not as big of a deal for ground to orbit craft - except when they need to dock or land inside another ship.
For a craft that small I'd also be expecting a fixed weapons mount rather than a turret - unless that turreted weapon is a vehicle-class one, and not a starship-classed.
But I like where you are going with your visualizations. It adds a LOT to the game to be able to visualize small craft.
a lot of desig features that a sarship would need...airlocks full, sized bridges, etc are not completely needed on a very small craft. Curretl smal craft turrets do seem to be diffrernt than starship turrets shorter range smaller magazine capacity for missiles etc....they seem to be an intermediate stage between vehicle and starship weapons. They have the same punch but no where near the same range as a starship weapon.
I worked up drawings for each of the small craft from the main book for fun and practice(mostly practice) at one point. they are buried in the epths of the older threds somewhere. I thought about packaging them up and putting them up over at teh Travellers Aid society on DrivethruRPG I may still do so so people who want them can get them in one place.
Condottiere
Emperor Mongoose
You could probably have an airlock that can fit into a half metre square, if you use a more thinner and flexible protective suit, not necessarily skintight, but certainly not bulky.
This would be handy, since it provides 2 Tons of extra space, since according to High Guard (page 22) every ship gets "1 airlock for every 100 tons or part of" for free, so a 10 Ton hull w/o an airlock in practice becomes a 12 ton hull. I'm assuming that the free airlock is one of many reasons that ship size has a minimum of 10 tons.phavoc said:
AnotherDilbert
Emperor Mongoose
Only Ships get free airlocks. Ships are 100 dT or bigger (HG, p4).heron61 said:
Authors note here:
http://forum.mongoosepublishing.com/viewtopic.php?f=89&t=119415&p=907313&hilit=airlock#p907313
Condottiere
Emperor Mongoose
You don't have to pay for that airlock, since it would seem that cost is subsumed with the price of the hull.
But you still have to account for that space; in Mongoose First, I came to the conclusion that the first airlock is part of a ten tonne and onwards bridge, together with a one tonne ship's locker. I haven't made up my mind with Mongoose Second, yet.
Obviously, this clearly isn't the case with a cockpit and a three tonne bridge.
But you still have to account for that space; in Mongoose First, I came to the conclusion that the first airlock is part of a ten tonne and onwards bridge, together with a one tonne ship's locker. I haven't made up my mind with Mongoose Second, yet.
Obviously, this clearly isn't the case with a cockpit and a three tonne bridge.
heron61 said:
Well, you'd get a 10Dton craft with additional internal space to be used for passengers or cargo, or even fuel. I would say you could fairly apply the same logic to 20 or even 30 ton craft. Though much of the reasoning needs to be determined based upon the usage of the craft. A small craft designed specifically to shuttle people from ground to orbit, with the assumption that it would always be docking with something else that had an airlock would not need one of it's own. In practice a similar ship used by the Navy or Scouts to board other ships for inspections, derelicts looking for surivivors, or whatever, would be more likely to need an airlock.
Civilians are far more likely to look to save a few credits on something than the military would.
dmccoy1693
Cosmic Mongoose
alex_greene said:
Agreed. They're pretty nice.
phavoc said:
I tend to think of most published versions of small craft as Mass Market models. they have features allowing them to be useful to the widest number of buyers possible. a buyer who isn't going to need an airlock could always scratch it off the design list or In theory reduce the fuel tankage etc to make a few extra cubic meters of space available in the hull.
Condottiere
Emperor Mongoose
They're likely to be two basic types of spaceships, ones that could be used anywhere, and ones that are optimized to work with the local conditions where they were manufactured.
Jame Rowe said:Well that makes sense, now, doesn't it?
I tend to prefer the CT versions of the art, which are either cylindrical or wedges. But they can come in literally any shape, at least other than unstreamlined.
I tried to work up several other small craft, streamlined cylinders, wedge types..etc... I tend to be constantly working on something for practice ..somewhere around ere I have about every small craft in the books I have access to
I personally like the wedge, and cylinder shapes more than most. they tend to look a bit more practical than other types.not always the flashiest ride around but they are functional.
