Appeal of Savage Worlds

[ryhopewood]

I understand the suggestions to go with the Solomon Kane magic system for SW Conan. I am also considering using the recent Realms of Cthulhu sourcebook to bolt the mythos and Conan together. All demons etc would be mythos creatures and the magic system has been adapted beautifully from Call of Cthulhu to SW. Of course, I would still allow a few fantasy monsters from Conan - the giant Serpents are essential.

 

[rabindranath72]

I like SW because, though it has "crunch" like d20 (skills and edges) the coupling between these and the attributes and the "levels" are very loose, so there is essentially no "wrong" way of doing a character.

 

[Enpeze]

I'd like to mention that I ran a Conan game for a while with 2 players using just the core SW book and the fantasy toolkit (for monster/npc stats).

Yes. this one can call truly "savage". The core book is enough for most games. SW follows a certain gaming philosophy. And this philosophy does not include unnecessary detail and complexity which is often found in other game systems.

An essential part of SW is the extensive use of imagination and trappings. For example you dont need an extra spell for ice bolt, fire bolt or an attacking swarm of hornets. Just taking the "Bolt" power from the core, adjust the trapping to ice or fire or black psionic death ray and there you have your supernatural attack. The receipt is formidable if you know how to cook it.

I guess the problem with the writings of V. Darlage for Pinnacle was that his script was too detailed for the above mentioned philosophy. This might function in games like d20 where complexity is a virtue but its not appealing to savages. We like everything simple, fast and painted with a very broad brush. (not only the rules, also the setting description)

Both my players said they had the most fun playing this game, using these rules, than any other gaming system. They never felt their characters were inferior or too "average".

Yep, SW offers the most fun of any game system I know. In the beginning it could a little bit rough until you have altered your playing style a little bit but after a few sessions the sheer genius of the rules show up.

the power curve of a typical SW character is different from a d20 character. You cannot compare both games. In d20 you begin as a wimp and end as a superhero. In SW you begin more powerful (most of this "more" comes from the different treatment between wild cards and extras) but you will never be as mighty at "legendary" tier than a say 15th level d20 character. Additionally even if you are "legendary" tier you can skill your character in a way which makes him inferior to a novice fighter in combat by giving him for example just non-combat edges and academic skills. (in this SW is similar to gurps) Its up to you choice.

 

[Demetrio]

I guess the problem with the writings of V. Darlage for Pinnacle was that his script was too detailed for the above mentioned philosophy. This might function in games like d20 where complexity is a virtue but its not appealing to savages. We like everything simple, fast and painted with a very broad brush. (not only the rules, also the setting description)

Eh? SW Solomon Kane is easily as detailed as the Conan d20 rules with regard to setting, in fact probably more so as it contains a summary of every SK story. And if you look at, for instance, SW Deadlands, you'll see that the setting is easily as detailed as d20 Conan. So I can't agree with that at all.

 

[Enpeze]

And if you look at, for instance, SW Deadlands, you'll see that the setting is easily as detailed as d20 Conan. So I can't agree with that at all.

I have no prob if you cannot agree. Then just lets agree that we dont agree.

 

[Silent Scream]

I'd buy SW Conan, where I wouldn't buy D20 or Runequest - the two are a perfect fit. That said it would take very little work to turn Hellfrost into a Conan-esque game.

 

[Enpeze]

I'd buy SW Conan, where I wouldn't buy D20 or Runequest - the two are a perfect fit. That said it would take very little work to turn Hellfrost into a Conan-esque game.

This is true. Hellfrost is conanesque. Only the (powerful) Hellfrost magic should be tweaked to suit more to the conan setting. I would take the magic of Solomon Kane.

 

[celmive]

Celmive,

Not a rant dude. Nor rumor. Shane from Pinnacle confirmed this on another thread.

Shots anyone?

Which is where ? Can you link it please as I and many others would like to read it I am sure.

Vincent Darlage - The part time artist ? His stuff is okay but not what I would call amazing. Then again, I can understand his appeal to some. Not sure as to the credentials you gave him. Do you mean artwise or to the lore or something else ?

 

[Demetrio]

Vincent Darlage knows a lot about R.E. Howard's Hyborian Age, and Howard's work in general. More than some publishers seem comfortable with for some strange reason (because if you're going to base a game on books, employing someone who knows the books inside out would be the smart move... the setting authenticity is really pretty critical to the game's potential success in most cases, hence the ludicrousness of the suggestion that a postulated SW Hyborian Age should be broad brush in terms of background. The background is central to the game. Otherwise it's really just generic S&S masquerading as Conan).

 

[rabindranath72]

I can see the appeal of a "minimal" setting, just in terms of what Howard wrote and without any extrapolations. This would require at least someone who has read all of Howard's stories and the essay on the Hyborian Age.
This would be quite different from, for example, Solomon Kane, which was surely fantasy, but was also based on a "real" time frame, so anything outside of Howard's stories could be easily filled-in; not so with the Hyborian Age.

 

[celmive]

Vincent Darlage knows a lot about R.E. Howard's Hyborian Age, and Howard's work in general. More than some publishers seem comfortable with for some strange reason (because if you're going to base a game on books, employing someone who knows the books inside out would be the smart move... the setting authenticity is really pretty critical to the game's potential success in most cases, hence the ludicrousness of the suggestion that a postulated SW Hyborian Age should be broad brush in terms of background. The background is central to the game. Otherwise it's really just generic S&S masquerading as Conan).

My point is just because someone is knowlegable it doesn't make them a fluid and entertaining writer. TBH I cannot think of anything I have read solely by him - I probably have but just can't recall it. I am aware of some art he has done and he has contributed things to the d20 Conan line but that is about it. If he was so good then why can I not recall anything else written by him ? Rhetorical question that... Glenn Lord probably is the one person who knows the most about REH & his works but the intro's he has written have been, well, uninspiring, generally at best. "Factually Correct" writings do not always make good reading.

Now, this is not to knock anyone - it is an observation. It seems that this gent has his fans and to be honest I would like to be convinced to be one too. I have collected REH & HPL books and documents since the late 70's and written for fanzines such as Polaris in the 80's on the subject of HPL, Howard, Conan and the Cthulhu Mythos in general. I even exchanged letters with Glenn way back when about a snippet of a story that appeared in The Howard Collector.

Now, I know some parts of the D20 Conan line were penned by him but I am wondering if there is anything written solely by him that is not d20 Conan related about the setting ?

Hands on the table : I found many of the d20 Conan books full of info but lacking writing flair and it would be good to see what this guy can do

 

[VincentDarlage]

Well, celmive... I guess not everyone is a fan, or even mildly appreciative of the effort I give.

I guess I could defend myself with the 15 published books I wrote by myself, and the handful I collaborated on with others, as well as the unpublished output, but what would be the point? After all, as a "part-time artist" without any amazing output, what on Earth could I possibly say that would have merit?

I've never claimed to be amazing, but honestly I have never been slammed because I wasn't amazing. I've been slammed for some pretty valid reasons on these boards - those critiques just make me want to do better for everyone the next time around, but to be slammed for not being amazing? How on Earth does that even help me? Do you really expect people to be amazing at everything they do? And then, if they aren't amazing, immediately dismiss anything they offer? Can't you find value in something less than amazing? Curious standard you hold.

Have a nice day, celmive. You've certainly pissed in my Cheerios for no particular reason and given a rather sour note to my day, but still... have a nice day.

~Vincent the part-time artist without any amazing output.

 

[zozotroll]

Vincent, I was a wargamer, and starting on a carreer as a historin, before there where RPGs. Then reality bit me, and I wound up in the US Army. So I guess I look at things in a bit doifferent light than some.

That said, I find your work outstanding. Had you decided to go that way, you could have been a good historian. The D20 Conan books I use most where written by you, by your self. In fact, if I can get employed again, and continue to collect, that fact that you wrote a particular book will sell it to me much faster than anything else, regardless of what it is about. Because I know it wioll be well written and useful to the game.

Perhaps I never have used amazing. Instead the words that come to mind are competence, and Profesional. I dont have any idea if you have ever met a long time NCO. If not let me assure you we value those two terms much more than any glittery hyperbola.

I cant unpee your cherios, but I can offer you a good singler malt Highland Whiskey to wash the taste out.

 

[VincentDarlage]

Thanks zozotroll! Competent and professional are perfect. I would rather be deemed competent and professional than amazing any day. And thanks for the historian complement. My father is a history teacher, so that really pleases me.

 

[zozotroll]

Considering how much I have enjoyed the work you have done, It is I who is in debt.

I just wish that on other forums, more authors would post. However, considering what gets hurled at them forom time to time, it doesnt surprise me.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Thanks zozotroll! Competent and professional are perfect. I would rather be deemed competent and professional than amazing any day. And thanks for the historian complement. My father is a history teacher, so that really pleases me.

Well, I know that Im amazing anyway! I amaze myself with how amazing I actually am.

Vincent, you show flashes of being amazing. So, in that sense, you have been amazing on occasion. Its just that, well, Im slightly more amazing than everyone else.

 

[VincentDarlage]

Well, I know that Im amazing anyway! I amaze myself with how amazing I actually am.

Vincent, you show flashes of being amazing. So, in that sense, you have been amazing on occasion. Its just that, well, Im slightly more amazing than everyone else.

LOL! PrinceYyrkoon, you are indeed amazing... as well as amusing.

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

Well, I know that Im amazing anyway! I amaze myself with how amazing I actually am.

Vincent, you show flashes of being amazing. So, in that sense, you have been amazing on occasion. Its just that, well, Im slightly more amazing than everyone else.

LOL! PrinceYyrkoon, you are indeed amazing... as well as amusing.

Get yourself a fresh bowl of Cheerios, and keep writing!

 

[PrinceYyrkoon]

I'll be honest with you Vincent, I make stuff for a living, and I know pages and pages of praise doesnt offset the one bad comment. Its truely frustrating that creatives are so sensitive, but, the stuff produced is part of us in a way.

You may recall me trying to defend the guy that did the Thiefs Companion picture. I didnt think it was great, but I felt a bit sorry for the guy getting slammed for it. I know what it feels like, Im sure you do too. I guess its unavoidable when you create something you know youre going to be criticised for it. It happens all the time.

Best you can do, I think, is to just try and do the best you can and be proud of what you do. Staying away from forums helps, I find too!

 

[celmive]

Well, celmive... I guess not everyone is a fan, or even mildly appreciative of the effort I give.
.

Vincent - do not be like that... I find it strange that I have been quite a fan of the genre since the 70's and you are off the radar other than a few pics I have seen in a long forgotten fanzine and a series of d20 books.

To be honest I am not a fan but am here to be convinced.

I will look at the links on your sig and take it from there.

And you have a nice day and have a fresh bowl of cheerio's mate