All Stop and Pivot question

[animus]

A dumb question that's been asked before coming up.

In a recent game a Primus pulled an All Stop and then next turn an All Stop and Pivot to bring its laser to my circling White Stars. Nothing wrong there but next the Primus pulled another All Stop and Pivot. It effectively became a turret then. I was under the impression that it had to execute another All Stop before it could do ASAP again.

What's right?

 

[Delthos]

All Stop and Pivot states, as long as the ship used the All Stop! special action or otherwise did not move in it's last turn, you may use All Stop and Pivot! in its current turn. As All Stop and Pivot! does not allow any movement, the use of this special action fulfills the prerequisite for using it again in the next turn.

I wouldn't be too concerned, I think the drawbacks out weigh the benefit of using it over multiple turns.

 

[Triggy]

Not to mention that a Primus can only turn 90 degrees each turn with All Stop and Pivot.

 

[EDFDarkAngel1]

Perfectly okay, have used it several times. It's basically the navigator pulling hard left on their flight stick and hanging on for dear life.

Dark Angel

 

[CZuschlag]

It does get bad when Vorlon Light Cruisers and smaller do it, because they really are turrets with 1/90 turns minimum. I find that sort of thing a might bit abusive, but it's allowed.

 

[Banichi]

If you play a boresight fleet it's a good use of a ship to target someone pulling this trick. Especially if the ship you are using to target the pivoter was going to get sinked out of shooting anyway.

But I have to confess, I've done multiple all stop and pivots as well. Usually with my omegas. They make decent long range turrets.

 

[David Anla Shok']

Just a thought here. But would not the pivot count as movement?

 

[Banichi]

Just a thought here. But would not the pivot count as movement?

Not a bad point David, it depends on your in game definitions of movement and turning I guess. I think the game (I might be wrong) considers movement and turning to be two different things.

 

[CZuschlag]

We've never played it as such. For instance, we allow Mass Driver fire on ships under All Stop and Pivot.

My Dilgar fleet doesn't see a whole lot of oponents doing the all stop thing.

I wonder why.

 

[David Anla Shok']

We've never played it as such. For instance, we allow Mass Driver fire on ships under All Stop and Pivot.

My Dilgar fleet doesn't see a whole lot of oponents doing the all stop thing.

I wonder why.

No idea.

"Everybody must get stoned"
some bad folk singer

 

[Taran]

Well, the argument was going on (though I think they came to a decision) that a ship reduced to 0 movement couldn't turn, which would certainly seem to link movement and turning...

 

[skavendan]

But since you have to not move to use the all stop and pivot whats to say you can not pivot again?

Gray area needs an offical answer in my opinion I would Roll of for it till an offical answer is given. Seems possible to me though.

 

[David Anla Shok']

Well, the argument was going on (though I think they came to a decision) that a ship reduced to 0 movement couldn't turn, which would certainly seem to link movement and turning...

I would think that if you stopped by choice, you would still have power to manuever and could thus do what you pleased. If compelled to stop, it is less likely that you have manuevering power.

 

[texican]

My understanding is that is that (All Stop) and (All Stop and Pivot) are two different SAs so instead of (All Stop and the (All Stop and Pivot) then (All Stop and Pivot) etc I feel that it should be (All Stop) then (All Stop and Pivot) then All Stop and then (All Stop and Pivot)

 

[Iain McGhee]

The pivot shouldn't really be considered a move, just a turn. You can use ASAP as long as you haven't moved any distance in a straight line on the last turn (or used All Stop), so you could All Stop one turn and ASAP each turn after if you so desired. Besides, you aren't compelled to use the Pivot part of the ASAP so the All Stop component presumably works as with the All Stop SA.

 

[Da Boss]

you can still dodge on All stop................

 

[Taran]

Well, the argument was going on (though I think they came to a decision) that a ship reduced to 0 movement couldn't turn, which would certainly seem to link movement and turning...

I would think that if you stopped by choice, you would still have power to manuever and could thus do what you pleased. If compelled to stop, it is less likely that you have manuevering power.

If that's the case, then they need to specify. The ruleswriters need to decide which it is. "No Movement" can't mean 2 separate things. Though "No movement other than turning" does Not mean the same as "No movement".

 

[lastbesthope]

you can still dodge on All stop................

Can you? Not if you stay in the same place, anything that doesn't move loses the dodge trait for that turn I remember reading in the rules.

LBH

 

[Na-Po]

But All Stop allows you to move up to half your speed.
So if you move at least a little you can dodge.

If you use All Stop in order not to move at all then you cannot dodge
and you are a "Mass Driver" ideal target

 

[lastbesthope]

Oh yes, you can still oddge so long as you move a bit, but then that prevents you pivoting on the next turn.

LBH