ACTA - I want, I hate, lets adjust
- Thread starter Da Boss
- Start date
l33tpenguin
Mongoose
hiffano said:
Someone needs to make a 'laser' template or something. Its always frustrating using one of those when you have a ship surrounded by other ships. But I have to agree, they are excellent
l33tpenguin
Mongoose
Does that do angles and arcs?
I was going to do a Planet Mongoose article on this, but the software is playing up at the moment. So, I'll do a little capsule of yes' and no's to the points raised in this thread thus far.
1. Crew scores have gone. This is partly because of streamlining, and partly because of the setting (there is not a huge amount of crew on these ships). You are _still_ tracking three scores on ships now (Damage, Shields and Troops) as opposed to just Damage and Crew, but we are looking at clean-wipe datacards (optional accessory) to help with this.
2. A points-based system is in. Patrol, Skirmish and all the rest is still in as a 'Conflict Intensity' rating, which is now basically just a guide to game and table sizes, as well as an optional limit on ship classes (so, if you choose, you won't be surprised by a dreadnought in a game that is supposed to have lots of frigates).
3. It is now impossible for one critical to kill or even seriously damage a ship. We now have an escalating system of criticals (this is probably the biggest single innovation in CTA 3 - at least, in concept, as it is really just a change of table and the way it is used!). There are a few weapons on really big ships that can cause serious problems on crits, but they are very rare. BTW, I still personally feel that crits _should_ allow the possibility of taking a ship out in one blast, if for no other reason than it happens too often in the real world! However, the people have spoken!
4. Very few ships have stealth and, thus far, we have seen no reason to change it. Not a sacred cow though, and if it causes problems in playtesting, it will change.
5. Bookkeeping is indeed being kept to a minimum. Hate it myself, and always look to eliminate it!
6. Movement has not changed in any way. We can basically decribe it in two paragraphs, and we are not going to change that!
7. Initiative has not changed (yet...), and we have spent a good, long time looking at it (including, yes, the BTech system). However, in this iteration of the rules, we have yet to see any serious ramifications coming from it. There are no boresight weapons and the one other area where it could have been devastating (boarding) we've managed to neatly gazump by altering the Special Action concerned.
8. Campaign rules will be staying sort of the same - the big addition will be a ransoming model, whereby you can negotiate with other players for the release of captured ships and/or crews!
9. You remember with initiative that the loser always ends up moving first, even though the victor has a 'choice'? Well, we were going to eliminate that, and make it automatic - but then we go and add a rule that makes wanting to move first a real possibility! Not as 'clean' as I wanted, but there will now be times when you really have to think in the Initiative Phase.
10. There will be plenty of ways to spend 'spare' points, such as upgrading troops on board and, yes, adding fighters. We have not yet added upgrades or 'variants' of existing ships to the lists, but they are of course a possibility.
11. CBD is still in, though you will be rolling far less dice this time round (no crew for a start, and weapons tend to have less AD).
12. As I said, no boresight in the game at this time, but it could always be added later for a new fleet or a new setting - I like the contested crew Quality check to resolve the boresight issues, BTW...
13. big ships - there are plenty of reasons to go for these chaps now. They cannot be downed by a smaller ship (or several smaller ships!) in one go now, whereas they have the possibility (depending on armament) to down a smaller ship easily. Also, with the way ships work, lots of AD is a distinct advantage for some weapons, and the only ships with lots of AD are the big ones - basically, concentration of firepower can be a big advantage in CTA3.
14. The setting will be _very_ familiar to some, but might seen a bit 'out there' to others. However, give it a chance. We are including lots of background material in the core book and there will be much that any science fiction fan can quickly relate to.
Hope that sheds some light onto the new game!
1. Crew scores have gone. This is partly because of streamlining, and partly because of the setting (there is not a huge amount of crew on these ships). You are _still_ tracking three scores on ships now (Damage, Shields and Troops) as opposed to just Damage and Crew, but we are looking at clean-wipe datacards (optional accessory) to help with this.
2. A points-based system is in. Patrol, Skirmish and all the rest is still in as a 'Conflict Intensity' rating, which is now basically just a guide to game and table sizes, as well as an optional limit on ship classes (so, if you choose, you won't be surprised by a dreadnought in a game that is supposed to have lots of frigates).
3. It is now impossible for one critical to kill or even seriously damage a ship. We now have an escalating system of criticals (this is probably the biggest single innovation in CTA 3 - at least, in concept, as it is really just a change of table and the way it is used!). There are a few weapons on really big ships that can cause serious problems on crits, but they are very rare. BTW, I still personally feel that crits _should_ allow the possibility of taking a ship out in one blast, if for no other reason than it happens too often in the real world! However, the people have spoken!
4. Very few ships have stealth and, thus far, we have seen no reason to change it. Not a sacred cow though, and if it causes problems in playtesting, it will change.
5. Bookkeeping is indeed being kept to a minimum. Hate it myself, and always look to eliminate it!
6. Movement has not changed in any way. We can basically decribe it in two paragraphs, and we are not going to change that!
7. Initiative has not changed (yet...), and we have spent a good, long time looking at it (including, yes, the BTech system). However, in this iteration of the rules, we have yet to see any serious ramifications coming from it. There are no boresight weapons and the one other area where it could have been devastating (boarding) we've managed to neatly gazump by altering the Special Action concerned.
8. Campaign rules will be staying sort of the same - the big addition will be a ransoming model, whereby you can negotiate with other players for the release of captured ships and/or crews!
9. You remember with initiative that the loser always ends up moving first, even though the victor has a 'choice'? Well, we were going to eliminate that, and make it automatic - but then we go and add a rule that makes wanting to move first a real possibility! Not as 'clean' as I wanted, but there will now be times when you really have to think in the Initiative Phase.
10. There will be plenty of ways to spend 'spare' points, such as upgrading troops on board and, yes, adding fighters. We have not yet added upgrades or 'variants' of existing ships to the lists, but they are of course a possibility.
11. CBD is still in, though you will be rolling far less dice this time round (no crew for a start, and weapons tend to have less AD).
12. As I said, no boresight in the game at this time, but it could always be added later for a new fleet or a new setting - I like the contested crew Quality check to resolve the boresight issues, BTW...
13. big ships - there are plenty of reasons to go for these chaps now. They cannot be downed by a smaller ship (or several smaller ships!) in one go now, whereas they have the possibility (depending on armament) to down a smaller ship easily. Also, with the way ships work, lots of AD is a distinct advantage for some weapons, and the only ships with lots of AD are the big ones - basically, concentration of firepower can be a big advantage in CTA3.
14. The setting will be _very_ familiar to some, but might seen a bit 'out there' to others. However, give it a chance. We are including lots of background material in the core book and there will be much that any science fiction fan can quickly relate to.
Hope that sheds some light onto the new game!
I guess with some adjustment you can still play with the B5 ships. some traits have changed but have similar effects but some traits are gone completely. and as matt said crew scores are gone completely making explorers rock hard 
so currently you probably could play with the B5 ships using only minor adjustment.
so currently you probably could play with the B5 ships using only minor adjustment.
Lifegiver said:
I would be amazed if someone didn't do a conversion (we won't do an official one).
However, we would quite like people to buy a new fleet or two. We are going to make them quite cheap * and everything
* Serious note on this - a fleet box set looks like it will be $29.99, not $99.99 this time round, and while there will likely be less fighters and the ships a little smaller (on average, there are some notable exceptions), they will still form good, solid, playable fleets. They will officially be a Good Deal
Honestly, way too much complaining here.
The game was good and if it wasn't good enough, then, like others on here, tweak it yourself. There was never anything in the book that said "NO, you cant change this!"
As far as buying more stuff-sheesh-I just spent the last year and a half getting all the b5 stuff-a thousand dollars +.
The game was good and if it wasn't good enough, then, like others on here, tweak it yourself. There was never anything in the book that said "NO, you cant change this!"
As far as buying more stuff-sheesh-I just spent the last year and a half getting all the b5 stuff-a thousand dollars +.
l33tpenguin
Mongoose
msprange said:
Don't you mean *can't*
I'm sure there will be plenty of conversions to be had on the boards. However, we would quite like people to buy a new fleet or two. We are going to make them quite cheap * and everything
* Serious note on this - a fleet box set looks like it will be $29.99, not $99.99 this time round, and while there will likely be less fighters and the ships a little smaller (on average, there are some notable exceptions), they will still form good, solid, playable fleets. They will officially be a Good Deal
This is excellent to hear, and is a big ++++. The cost of minis is a real set back for many people. I was lucky in being able to fill out three fleets to my liking, with my Earth fleet being rather large. Considering the rising cost in metal, at a box cost of under $30, are you using plastic or another material?
I'm really chomping at the bit to know what setting it is in after your post, btw. Can't wait to see
Mean Mutton
Mongoose
l33tpenguin said:msprange said:
Don't you mean *can't*
Personally, I love the most up-to-date version of B5: ACTA. I am not sure that there needs to be any conversion to a 3rd edition because the 2nd edition of B5: ACTA was really, really good.
In my opinion depends on how good, invoative and pratical the new 3rd ed system is.
For instance if the new critical table is a real plus point that could be adjusted for ACTA 2nd ed.
Converting 2nd ed B5 ships to 3rd Ed "Setting" Ships could be slightly more complicated without crew scores but I am sure its possible.....as katadder says Explorer ships without crew are a nightmare - and White Stars (and unofficial shadowy mirror universe versions) get pretty nasty too........
Thanks Matts for giving us a official heads up,
(my initial reactions in green - only opinions)
For instance if the new critical table is a real plus point that could be adjusted for ACTA 2nd ed.
Converting 2nd ed B5 ships to 3rd Ed "Setting" Ships could be slightly more complicated without crew scores but I am sure its possible.....as katadder says Explorer ships without crew are a nightmare - and White Stars (and unofficial shadowy mirror universe versions) get pretty nasty too........
Thanks Matts for giving us a official heads up,
(my initial reactions in green - only opinions)
msprange said:1. Crew scores have gone. This is partly because of streamlining, and partly because of the setting (there is not a huge amount of crew on these ships). You are _still_ tracking three scores on ships now (Damage, Shields and Troops) as opposed to just Damage and Crew, but we are looking at clean-wipe datacards (optional accessory) to help with this.
I am still not convinced myself that loosing crew in favour of troops as a mechanism is the way to go but need to see the game in action more to see if its a plus or minus point.
2. A points-based system is in. Patrol, Skirmish and all the rest is still in as a 'Conflict Intensity' rating, which is now basically just a guide to game and table sizes, as well as an optional limit on ship classes (so, if you choose, you won't be surprised by a dreadnought in a game that is supposed to have lots of frigates).
No issues with this - could make tournaments interesting
3. It is now impossible for one critical to kill or even seriously damage a ship. We now have an escalating system of criticals (this is probably the biggest single innovation in CTA 3 - at least, in concept, as it is really just a change of table and the way it is used!). There are a few weapons on really big ships that can cause serious problems on crits, but they are very rare. BTW, I still personally feel that crits _should_ allow the possibility of taking a ship out in one blast, if for no other reason than it happens too often in the real world! However, the people have spoken!
Again looking forward to seeing how this works - I am always torn by the crit issues but I sort of agree that too often games (and at least one torunament I ran
4. Very few ships have stealth and, thus far, we have seen no reason to change it. Not a sacred cow though, and if it causes problems in playtesting, it will change.
Similar - Stealth is realistic but perhaps not fun - it may be worth trying other variations that may be more "fun"....... on the other hand a few Scout/Spy type ships with it rather than battlefleets mean it is less likely to be an issue
5. Bookkeeping is indeed being kept to a minimum. Hate it myself, and always look to eliminate it!
I always felt ACTA had about the right amount so thats good
6. Movement has not changed in any way. We can basically decribe it in two paragraphs, and we are not going to change that!
Excellent
7. Initiative has not changed (yet...), and we have spent a good, long time looking at it (including, yes, the BTech system). However, in this iteration of the rules, we have yet to see any serious ramifications coming from it. There are no boresight weapons and the one other area where it could have been devastating (boarding) we've managed to neatly gazump by altering the Special Action concerned.
Sounds good
8. Campaign rules will be staying sort of the same - the big addition will be a ransoming model, whereby you can negotiate with other players for the release of captured ships and/or crews!
I guess this depends on exactly how effective boarding is and how easy/difficult it is to actually complete as opposed to blowing your opponents ships away- always nicely satisfying.
9. You remember with initiative that the loser always ends up moving first, even though the victor has a 'choice'? Well, we were going to eliminate that, and make it automatic - but then we go and add a rule that makes wanting to move first a real possibility! Not as 'clean' as I wanted, but there will now be times when you really have to think in the Initiative Phase.
Interesting- guessing related to boarding
10. There will be plenty of ways to spend 'spare' points, such as upgrading troops on board and, yes, adding fighters. We have not yet added upgrades or 'variants' of existing ships to the lists, but they are of course a possibility.
Strange - I was thinking there would be Command and Control variants, escorts and the like to make a larger variety of ships - but I guess suplements? Upgrades sound good otherwise
11. CBD is still in, though you will be rolling far less dice this time round (no crew for a start, and weapons tend to have less AD).
Hmm as long as they have enough AD to make ships of same class or smaller go "boom" rather than ineffectually plinking away which is pretty boring
12. As I said, no boresight in the game at this time, but it could always be added later for a new fleet or a new setting - I like the contested crew Quality check to resolve the boresight issues, BTW...
that helps with a number of issues as you mentioned
13. big ships - there are plenty of reasons to go for these chaps now. They cannot be downed by a smaller ship (or several smaller ships!) in one go now, whereas they have the possibility (depending on armament) to down a smaller ship easily. Also, with the way ships work, lots of AD is a distinct advantage for some weapons, and the only ships with lots of AD are the big ones - basically, concentration of firepower can be a big advantage in CTA3.
Sounds good
14. The setting will be _very_ familiar to some, but might seen a bit 'out there' to others. However, give it a chance. We are including lots of background material in the core book and there will be much that any science fiction fan can quickly relate to.
Colour or b/w? - hopefully colour with lots of shiny pictures of the models and background fluff........
Hope that sheds some light onto the new game!
thanks
All sounds great!
I'm sure we can use our B5 ships as proxies for the new fleets, but if I like the setting I could be persuaded to buy new ones. Especially if they are that cheap, and smaller ships are easier to paint IMO :lol: But if I don't like or have never heard of the setting I'm afraid the ships might be a bit of a hard sell to me.
All I need now are some opponents!
I'm sure we can use our B5 ships as proxies for the new fleets, but if I like the setting I could be persuaded to buy new ones. Especially if they are that cheap, and smaller ships are easier to paint IMO :lol: But if I don't like or have never heard of the setting I'm afraid the ships might be a bit of a hard sell to me.
All I need now are some opponents!
Agreed 100%. If it's not a setting I care about then I may as well switch to BFG, which has the advantage that I can easily find opponents and annual tournaments for that. If the setting is of interest (or when the unofficial B5 supplement comes outBurger said:
) I will probably take a look.As for the miniatures, that brings me to another thing to keep - variety within a fleet. Compare the various ships in a single fleet of BFG, for example, and they're pretty much the same except for size. Now compare the various ships in the EA fleet or the Brakiri fleet - see the difference? So what I want to keep in the new miniatures is a fleet which doesn't look like a bunch of clones of varying sizes. Such a fleet, at the sort of price we're used to paying for a single ship in B5, is quite likely to attract my interest. And my wallet.
I like Clanger's idea of buyable upgrades, partly because it removes the need for variants but mainly because it gives you something to do with the points left over after you've picked your ships. Conversely, for those cases when you've picked your favourites and find you're a few points over budget, how about downgrades which get you points back?
