A simple G'Quan poll!

[Ike]

anyways back to subject at hand

so beam wise its not bad, current incarnation with 5 AD DD B is nice, yes it will get hurt if TTT reduces it to half like the 1.0 p&p SA was going to be, but lets be honest, you only have a 33% chance to pull it off and the GQuan has nothing else going for it except that it can take a hit and keep coming until you crit adrift it then it just sort of floats towards you

with that being the only recommondation its really just a battle lvl ini sink

id rather have a gquann move first and be boresighted, taking the hits then my varnics, or my gvrahns (I wrote off the dagkars the minute I brought them to the battle field)

I will have to use the Gtal now just to get command 2 back, but first ship off the line will be the GTal on CBD and a 5 inch move ahead

 

[Rawwar]

I don't even know what a Q'Guan is, but I clearly need to get one!!!!

It's a dyslexic G'Quan it took me ages to realise what I'd actually written. That's one of my better ones

 

[Tzarevitch]

Even without the new CBD rule for the Narn I think the ship as (proposed) modified is mostly ok. I would drop the e-mines by 1d and make them slow-loading (same for the Bin'Tak) to make the ship a good choice.

For the G'Quonth clone the G'Quan except replace the mines with ion torps (obviously drop the ship to battle).

The G'Tal stays as proposed, possibly give it (and the Bin'Tak and Ka'Bin'Tak) interceptor 1 as they are rare command ships and should receive the precious few of those systems the Narn have.

The G'Lan should drop the med laser and up the mag gun to 4d.

Tzarevitch

 

[Hindsight]

Against ISA, you'll never fire most of those guns. Those guns you pay for. I can dance cirlces around a Narn player, and with only 8" guns, there is little they can do about it. The foundation for these bigger Narn ships needs readjusting, or a turret, or something, so they can always be firing at something. In the show, we never see a G'Quan picking its nose waiting for something to come into range... it hunts down and beaminates anything it sees fit.

 

[Ike]

beaminates

must fit it into every day vocabulary

 

[Target]

G Quan leave the hits as is, 12" the ion cannons, DD the pulse & slow load the e-mines
G Quath lose a priority, e-mines, make the secondaries the same as G Quan.
G Lan as people say lose the laser, gain AD on the Mag gun & secondaries the same as above
G Tal change the secondaries as the rest
Probably Bintaks secondaries could have this setup.

 

[Hindsight]

It may help to drop all variants, until the core ship is rebalanced and is deemed useful, then create fresh variants keeping those names, adding functionality in exchange for something else. Long range, fighters, command, etc.

 

[katadder]

you want DD pulse? what the? thats crazy.
at most I say increase the pulse to 10" and leave the ion cannons as they are.

 

[Foxmeister]

you want DD pulse? what the? thats crazy.
at most I say increase the pulse to 10" and leave the ion cannons as they are.

That would be my preferred solution for the secondaries too - just make the light pulse cannons regular pulse cannons for Battle+ level ships.

Regards,

Dave

 

[katadder]

which is something I have tried to get through before.

 

[No. 1 Bear]

yeh but we know everyone just doesnt like the gquan.

Anyway make the emine sl and id be happy as it would balance out leave the crappy secondaries as they are crappy.

 

[Foxmeister]

Someone once pointed out that if you made the G'Quans e-mine SL, all you would do is encourage the use of the G'Quan as a long range sniper - sitting back near the table edge on perpetual All Stop and Pivot and never actually getting into the fray.

I tend to agree with that sentiment, however, the crappy secondaries on the G'Quan still encourage that sort of play since it is practically impossible to bring them into play unless your opponent wishes it.

As it stands, the ships isn't a brawler, and it isn't that much of a sniper either.

Regards,

Dave

 

[No. 1 Bear]

Someone once pointed out that if you made the G'Quans e-mine SL, all you would do is encourage the use of the G'Quan as a long range sniper - sitting back near the table edge on perpetual All Stop and Pivot and never actually getting into the fray.

Yeh that was me. But i wouldnt mind SL emines, maybe cut the range a bit.

 

[l33tpenguin]

Someone once pointed out that if you made the G'Quans e-mine SL, all you would do is encourage the use of the G'Quan as a long range sniper - sitting back near the table edge on perpetual All Stop and Pivot and never actually getting into the fray.

I tend to agree with that sentiment, however, the crappy secondaries on the G'Quan still encourage that sort of play since it is practically impossible to bring them into play unless your opponent wishes it.

As it stands, the ships isn't a brawler, and it isn't that much of a sniper either.

Regards,

Dave

Well, considering the description mongoose has for it, the ship is supposed to be a sniper. It forwent its secondaries in exchange for a long range beam and e-mines.

 

[Ripple]

In which case the beam should be impressive, rather than anemic.

Ripple

 

[Target]

Twin link the 4AD beam maybe lose the rear arc all together, they always seem to get wasted from behind. Extend ranges of the secondaries & no lumbering + increase speed.

 

[stepan.razin]

Twin link the 4AD beam maybe lose the rear arc all together, they always seem to get wasted from behind. Extend ranges of the secondaries & no lumbering + increase speed.

Twin-linked beams? Really?

 

[Target]

Why not, has less beam dice than every one else, but thats about all it would have other than e-mines O/S. The side firepower might have to be reduced. Just don't stand in front of it. Twinlink just means it 3 instead of 2 hits (av), same as 6AD weapon but less poteintal for massive hits just a constant hitting power.

 

[Ike]

Why not, has less beam dice than every one else, but thats about all it would have other than e-mines O/S. The side firepower might have to be reduced. Just don't stand in front of it. Twinlink just means it 3 instead of 2 hits (av), same as 6AD weapon but less poteintal for massive hits just a constant hitting power.

uh what?

would not twin link then go onto all your attacks with the beam thats just crazy

i mean I like beaminating things as much as the next guy

75% chance of a hit is kind of redonkulous when you get another attack dice if you hit, which means a runaway beam is alot more likely

if your going to upgrade like that AP would be better, only 66% but either would be outside the narn weapons tech as they stand

unless your reroll from twinlinked is counted as a mini beam, that way you get your beam dice plus 4 rerolls(mini beams) for when you finally miss (or 5 under the upgrades)

which actually has some merit but still makes the gquan just a boresight beam wrapped in an awesome looking ship

 

[Cavalier1645]

Ok, so on one of the other threads Hindsight said:

You left out that the G'Quan still sucks...

To which Katadder replied:

doesnt suck, 1AD less beam than omega plus e-mine and new narn CBD and having 17 more damage = g'quan wins in g'quan/omega battle.

Now, I was going to reply directly to that post that in my opinion, the new G'Quan still sucks, but I decided that a poll would be more interesting.

I've deliberately made the poll very simple with just two answers - yes and no. I'm sure there is someone out there who has a different or more complex opinion on the subject of the G'Quans suckiness, but I shall leave that to the thread proper for comments.

Where do I stand on this?

IMHO, it still sucks, for the following reasons:

1. Poor 5AD beam - if TTT remains as full AD, I could possibly live with it but since it's likely to go to half AD the G'Quan is going to getting hosed when compared its contemporaries when on TTT (i.e. the Omega)
2. Poor speed and lumbering
3. Crappy short ranged secondaries that almost never get rolled
4. O/S e-mine
5. Extra damage, and new Narn CBD (if it remains as is), does nothing when it'll be critted out of play before it loses all its HP.
6. Var'Nic and Dag'Kar still a much better use of a battle point. Weapons load out of these two ships is far superior - similar beam, better e-mine, and ion torps. Plus you have similar HP and crit redundancy for two hulls.
7. Variants offer nothing of value or significant enough differences to make them viable.

Note - I'm not saying it's the worst battle level hull out there, just that IMHO it still sucks!

Regards,

Dave

Ya Fox got to agree with you on all points. The only one I could possible argue with you is on point 7 Variants. The only good one is the G'Tal and the only reason to use that is force its +2 Command (and that is only because they are going to nerf the G'Vrann, which is poor desision, base on somebody wining about it).