Zistorwal

[PhilHibbs]

It has been said here that a lot of the stuff in The Clanking City is "flawed", and some of it is contradicted by The Abiding Book, for instance Shingallion's appearance is quite different. There isn't a lot in The Abiding Book about Zistorwal, but the is lots and lots of material in The Clanking City. My party is about to arrive in Zistorwal so I'm trying to work out what material to use from Clanking City. Does anyone have any opinions on what is "right" and what is "wrong"?

One specific question - p77 of Clanking City mentions "Frowal", is this the city of Frowalkel on the northern peninsula of Jrustela?

 

[carandol]

It has been said here that a lot of the stuff in The Clanking City is "flawed", and some of it is contradicted by The Abiding Book, for instance Shingallion's appearance is quite different. There isn't a lot in The Abiding Book about Zistorwal, but the is lots and lots of material in The Clanking City. My party is about to arrive in Zistorwal so I'm trying to work out what material to use from Clanking City. Does anyone have any opinions on what is "right" and what is "wrong"?

If Pavis Rises is to be believed, the Zistorites don't actually have mechamagical implants - they just have mechanical looking tatoos, and the story has been exaggerated - in which case almost everything in The Clanking City is wrong. With a massive change such as that, I'm not sure you can say what's "right" and "wrong", you just have to go with what's true in your own version of Glorantha!

 

[soltakss]

We had mechamagical implants from the Clanking City back in 1982, but they weren't called that at the time. So, I accepted the idea quite readily.

Having the city full of cyborgs is going a bit far, though.

 

[Loz]

The biggest problem with 'The Clanking City' book was that it ignored a great deal of the philosophical basis for Zistorwal which had been made available to the first set of RQ/Second Age writers. Too much emphasis was placed on the cyborg aspect and not enough emphasis on how Zistorwal relates to wider Malkionist beliefs. As a result, a lot of great information and intriguing local colour was lost.

Its not that the entire book is wrong; but to a large extent its very problematic and there's a great deal missing.

But if you have this book and like it, then it should be your Zistorwal in your Glorantha. You can quite readily use the Abiding Book material with the old Zistorwal book, retconning where you need to.

 

[Mongoose Pete]

If Pavis Rises is to be believed, the Zistorites don't actually have mechamagical implants - they just have mechanical looking tatoos, and the story has been exaggerated - in which case almost everything in The Clanking City is wrong. With a massive change such as that, I'm not sure you can say what's "right" and "wrong", you just have to go with what's true in your own version of Glorantha!

I believe that Greg's current vision of the Zistorites is that they have a rudimentary knowledge of engineering and some basic mechanics, but none of this mechamagic cyborg stuff. Rather the Zistorites are sorcerers trying to uncover fundamental cosmic truths by experimental combinations of different Runes and seeing what happens. They are in effect using primitive Antikythera computing to 'crack' the DNA sequence of the cosmos. (My crude spin on the concept)

Within the Clanking City, Zistor itself was explained to me as a sort of giant automated Babbage Engine-esque prayer wheel machine which is clunking through every possible combination of every known Rune. It is destroyed not only because each combination requires an input of POW/MP most likely drawn/raped directly from the Heroplane... but also because it is discovering increasingly dangerous and destabilising 'spells' with each revelation, which are then senselessly imprinted into mass produced magic items.

Zistorite power comes from the mastery of automated enchantment and their snow-baling accumulation of knowledge. The city should indeed be full of factories, but each one full of mortal craftsmen making items by hand. The final products are then 'myth imprinted' by Rune Wheels set to specific combinations, magically fuelled from/by the heroplane.

The 'clanking' of the city comes from the hammers of its work force and the shifting of Zistor's great wheels. It is not because of clockwork robots and borg-like protagonists. Of course as Loz and carandol have suggested YGMV, so don't feel obliged to keep up to date with the current Greg interpretation, where he's trying to get back to a more ancient world feel for Glorantha.